Rolls razor sharpening

[jonathon41uk]

Hi
i have a Rolls Viscount razor with two blades. The hone is intact and so is the strop. I don't seem to be able to get it quite sharp enough to shave with. It will cut hair but not as smoothly as I would like. How many times should I hone it and strop it? Any other ideas?

Jon

 

[rajagra]

Try using a marker pen on the bevel. Do a few laps on the hone then check to see if it is honing all the way to the edge. If not, keep going.
Once honing wears off the ink evenly over the whole of the bevel it is worth going to the strop.
When it is shaving reasonably well you can use progressive refinement - hone it a bit before and after each shave and it should improve towards an optimum level.

Be sure to check the shavewiki page on the Rolls.

 

[jonathon41uk]

Sorry to be really stupid but what do you mean by the bevel? Is that the edge of the edge?

 

[rajagra]

Sorry to be really stupid but what do you mean by the bevel? Is that the edge of the edge?

Yes, the 'side' of the edge. In the pic below you can see a straight razor than has been marked then honed. Most of the bevel is shiny all the way to the very edge as it should be.

...Can't embed the image, if you scroll down this page you can see examples of the marker test in use.

 

[Mickey Oberman]

I too am rather dense.

By "hone it a bit" approximately how many strokes is that?
After the bit of honing I presume it must be stropped. Again, approximately how many strokes?

Mickey

 

[mvk]

I used this method that was posted in 2008. It worked fine for me - I cut the sandpaper to fit over the hone in the rolls and it worked just fine that way. I found the the rolls works great if I shave pretty much the same way as I do with my gem SE.


"I asked the same question and Joe Lerch, who is the guru on sharpening them, told me his method of honing a Rolls.

It is his assertation that most ROLLS razors found on E-bay have blades too dull to sharpen with the onboard hone. His method starts with a piece of flat glass and 1000 grit wet/dry sandpaper. You work on that, moving forwards, to start the blade on its way. Also use a microscope to see how ragged the blade is and try to get it smooth. When you have done that for a while, move to a medium hone and do the same. Then on to the Rolls hone and strop. If not sharp enough, go through the steps again.

I substituted 1500 grip sandpaper for the medium hone, as I did not have one. Soak the sandpaper and lay it flat on the glass. It should stick. Do not use a lot of pressure on the blade, let the paper do the cutting. Kinda like shaving your face."

here is the Link: http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/36697-Sharpening-a-Rolls-Razor

 

[rajagra]

By "hone it a bit" approximately how many strokes is that?
After the bit of honing I presume it must be stropped. Again, approximately how many strokes?

The advice in the link below is good (read the 'four way' method.)
http://wiki.badgerandblade.com/Rolls_Razor#Honing

Don't worry about over-honing, the built-in stone is very mild. But avoid slapping the blade as you hone.

 

[Mickey Oberman]

Thank you, rajagara.

I have for the past few days been experiencing shaving I never imagined possible.
Thanks to the magic talents of Nathan Maskarine at [email protected]

I sent a couple of old blades to him and he converted them into instruments of shaving pleasure. That he is in Toronto means I need not pay outrageous postage fees of the USPS.

I wish my beard grew faster so that I could shave twice daily.

Mickey

 

[Slash McCoy]

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/263824

Honing out of case gives you more options. I now use lapping film of course and the edge is just as good as my straights.

 

[Mickey Oberman]

Two of my blades are turning black.

I have no idea what is causing this.

It seems to be occurring when they are used with the aluminum razor handle not the steel one although I am not yet sure of this.

Can they be un-blackened?

I can post pictures if it will help.

Mickey

 

[Slash McCoy]

Pics would be helpful. Of course you can always polish the blades. Just hit them with any metal polish. Try a nonabrasive one first. If it doesn't work, break out the big guns. Diamond paste. A progression of 3u, 1u, and .25u ought to do it and give you a deep mirror finish if you really work at it. After polishing, hone them up and you should be good to go. Keep them dry. wipe your blade well and let it dry before storing it.

Where exactly is the problem? If it is some sort of electrolysis action it should be confined to the area where it is in contact with the handle. I have seen problems from aluminum being in prolonged contact with steel, but usually the aluminum gets the worst of it, not the steel. Generally, some moisture is needed for a reaction, as well. One place where water can escape your notice is in the hole in the blade that fits onto the stud of the honing mechanism in the case. Be sure you blow out any moisture and allow it to dry completely before putting it away in the case.

 

[smalltank]

any pics of the discolored blades would help...

 

[Mickey Oberman]

Thanks to the advice from Slash McCoy and a little buffer in my Foredom flexible shaft machine the blades look like new.
It was easy. Now I must try to find out why the stains occur and how I can prevent them.

Thanks also to rajagara for his suggestion of marking the edge with a marker.



Mickey

 

[Slash McCoy]

Looks like you had water or lather in the blade hole. Always blow it out good and let it dry before putting it away. Also you might want to check the stud on the honing mechanism for corrosion and debris.

 

[Taproot]

I Love Rolls Razors- I ended up having 3 of them and got them all shave ready. The issue is what someone already mentioned- The RR onboard hone is high grit and not really meant for doing a complete resharpening- it was just meant to keep the razor sharp. While I suppose you could do thousands and thousands of passes on it to bring an ebay blade to a proper edge- it would take forever.

I used my Norton stones (4k followed by 8k) to bring the Edge up and then finished it with a waterstone- I've sometimes had to remove chips from the RR blades I get on ebay and usually I use a 1k or lower to do that. Although some people suggest removing the safety bar from it I don't- here's why. The safety bar on the RR is hinged, it is not meant to protect the user but instead is used to make sure that the blade is lightly placed upon the hone/strop in normal operation (by forcing the user to overcome the friction of the hinge) and also to protect the blade from accidentally dinking the blade on a sink or something ( since the average user couldn't do a a complete rehone to fix that if it happend, as we've mentioned the RR hone is pure maintenance.) For that reason I leave it on during honing because unfortunately there is no handle to provide control during honing like a straight has- and you end up appreciating having the bar present when you flip the blade on a stroke.

Anyone who can hone a straight can hone a RR- I'd suggest finding a friendly honemeister and having them get it shave ready for you, I'm sure there are a few who would want to try their skill on this weird piece of kit.

 

[Slash McCoy]

I find the Rolls hone much too coarse for a finisher. I only hone outside the case. Also the honing mechanism puts a bigger bevel angle than honing on film with the spine on the honing surface. That creates problems with going back and forth between the two methods. The Rolls hone is probably about 6k grit. I say that because a 3u film edge seems a bit sharper than the case honed edge. After the 3u I go to 1u and finish with .3u over damp paper with lather, using my SlashTool(tm) as a blade holder. Then I strop on the Big Daddy.

I don't use the guard because overcoming the resistance of the detent can make the blade slap.

There is no compelling reason to settle for an edge that isn't as sharp as your keenest straight.

 

[srm_92000]

On mine, when using the in case hone, the spine is definitely flat against the surface as it would be honing out of the box.
It seems to me that it was designed to work that way hence the loose floating pin and spring arrangement.
I also observed that the guard is used when honing in the box as it ensures that the spine contacts the surface slightly before the edge, ensuring no rounding.
Of course all this is irrelevant if You are honing externally.
I've always done done mine in the box and get good results, the blades I have though are pretty much NOS.
Cheers

 

[Mickey Oberman]

I am quite meticulous about drying the blade and blowing water out of the blade hole. This after rinsing it in very hot tap water to accelerate drying. I also wipe the stud before replacing the blade.
You will notice the blade on the left has blackened all over, much more than that on the right.

I guess I am destined to periodically polishing them or using black blades.

 

[Slash McCoy]

On mine, when using the in case hone, the spine is definitely flat against the surface as it would be honing out of the box.
It seems to me that it was designed to work that way hence the loose floating pin and spring arrangement.
I also observed that the guard is used when honing in the box as it ensures that the spine contacts the surface slightly before the edge, ensuring no rounding.
Of course all this is irrelevant if You are honing externally.
I've always done done mine in the box and get good results, the blades I have though are pretty much NOS.
Cheers

Color the spine with a sharpie marker and give it a couple of strokes on the hone. Did it wear any ink off? Two laps should wear a shiny stripe through the ink, along the entire spine, on both sides, if it is making good contact with the hone, right?

 

[rajagra]

I don't think that the spine touches the hone on mine, but it occurs to me that after the blade wears down that must eventually happen.