MARTIN DE CANDRE - UH, IT'S ALRIGHT, BUT....

[Roy]

Reviews of soap are like those of most things, if 90% give something a good rating, then it is likely that the soap will be good for you too. There will always be some who will not find the same good soap good.
Best just try it for yourself..you can always grate it and mix it with other soaps!! I did that once with a terrible soap and the results were fantastic.

 

[Bbb34]

You have to take into account that the “worst ever” was the opinion of a “doctor”. Never met a doctor who didn’t have an over opinionated view blah blah blah... no offense to the good doctor or medical professionals intended.

I think you will enjoy MdC for what it is, a good soap and hope that it doesn’t over exceed your expectations or you might not “ever” want to try another soap.

Ha ha... so it's on then eh... lol, let's see what @kingfisher has to say to that.

On a more serious note, I already have Agrumes and Vetyver and find them excellent in every way, scent and performance. I gave up Fougere, the first one I purchased as I really did not like the scent (but performance was great).

So for me, this is one of the best soaps I've ever used, and as I mentioned earlier, I have tried way too many to list.
I can understand how it might not work for some, I mean, everyone's skin/sense of smell/water/technique and expectations are different.

 

[McNutt]

I'm not expecting anything far superior to some of the other great soaps I have. It's a checklist for me and it wasn't prohibitively expensive in the long run. Now if only I knew how long it took to ship from England. The anticipation is killing me. I've already bought two more soaps through Amazon just to hold me over until my MdC soaps arrive.

 

[Steinmetzify]

Just grabbed one off eBay this morning, there was no waiting for this guy. Should be here Friday, I’ll report back.

 

[kingfisher]

You have to take into account that the “worst ever” was the opinion of a “doctor”. Never met a doctor who didn’t have an over opinionated view blah blah blah... no offense to the good doctor or medical professionals intended.

I think you will enjoy MdC for what it is, a good soap and hope that it doesn’t over exceed your expectations or you might not “ever” want to try another soap.

You hang out with the wrong doctors, then.

Sheesh. Only mentioned I was a doctor to provide a context of what the scent did to my brain. When I was in school, we were forced to hang out with the cadavers in the anatomy lab for about 2-3 hours every day for the entire first semester. The scent had a way of lingering, getting onto your shoes, etc. Sometimes it seemed like that smell permeated the entire world.

The semester ends, and you get over it.


MdC's original scent certainly doesn't smell like formaldehyde. I'm not trying to imply that. I had a sample of the stuff and I shaved all the way through it (in other words, I didn't throw any of it away). That proves that I didn't HATE it, and I didn't think the lather was worthless. I thought the lather was pretty good but a bit drying. The scent was relatively mild, but it's definitely a lavender that veers heavily into the "herbal" side and away from the "floral" side. Very herbal lavenders often have a medicinal undertone to them. It might not be obvious to everybody, as noses differ. When you add the benzoin, there is a LITTLE HINT of the formaldehyde. You or other people might not notice it, or might not care even if you did.

But you know how scents have this ability to throw you back in time and space to a different place and time? That's generally considered a positive thing, as, for example, when a nice tropical floral scent reminds you of a wonderful vacation you took to Hawaii or whatever. That tiny little hint of formaldehyde, on the other hand, placed me squarely back in that dissection room, even though the scent is really miles away from what that room smelled like. I don't want to go back to that room. Ever.

As far as "best ever," or "worst ever" is concerned, I agree that those types of terms are thrown around a lot, and not always by doctors.;-)

I never said that MdC was the worst soap ever, and I don't even remotely believe that MdC is the worst soap ever. It's not even close to the worst soap ever. It's a fairly good soap. It makes a lather that provides for a clean shave, and if it doesn't dry out your skin (or if you have oily skin to begin with and want your skin to dry out just a little bit), and if you don't mind the scent, or like it, then MdC is a good soap for you.

I was calling it the "most overrated" soap, not the worst soap. There is a huge difference. I base this claim ("most overrated") on the fact that in the 10 years I have been on this shave forum, I have seen more long threads extolling the virtues of MdC than I have for almost any other soap. People love it. And that's ok. Overrated doesn't mean it's bad. It means that, for me, at least, it doesn't live up to its hype.


I'm just going to throw out a theory.... I suspect that if the price were much cheaper, people wouldn't love it as much as they do. When I was in the Army, I was stationed at Ford Ord, near Monterey and Carmel, CA. There was a woman there who was trying to sell her house, located in Carmel proper, which is a very stuffy and very expensive place. She had the home on the market for a few weeks without a bite. Eventually, she contacted a realtor for help selling her place. The realtor told her that the problem was that her price was too low. He said that in a place like Carmel, when people saw a price like that, they assumed that the house would be terrible, so they didn't go to see it. So, she raised the price considerably. Suddenly, the place was crawling with potential buyers and she had it sold within a week. Having a high price conveys a certain cache to a product. The fact that MdC is made in a quaint place in France doesn't hurt, either. Let's face it, it's a cool story. The videos of the making of the soap are awesome. Getting an expensive soap from France is cool. Finally, when people pay a lot for something, they tend to exaggerate the good in the product; this rationalizes the purchase. Most of this is done subconsciously, and everybody does it. "If you want the best, you have to pay for the best," "You get what you pay for," etc., etc.

In short (too late for that, I know), I contend that if a guy named Scott made MdC soap in Morgantown, West Virginia, and called it, oh, I don't know, say "Almost Heaven Soap Works," or something, and sold it for $18 per container, it would never have achieved legendary status, even if it were the exact same soap. Sure, guys would like it and praise it. "Hey guys, check out this new artisan soap from West Virginia! It only takes a tiny bit of soap to lather, it lathers up really quickly, it shaves great, and it has an interesting lavender scent. You should give it a try." And perhaps a bunch of people would love it for its frugal nature, getting hundreds of shaves out of an $18 puck of soap. But I seriously doubt it would have 35-page-or-longer threads over and over again; I don't think it would take up nearly as much bandwidth as MdC has over the years.

Oh, and I would probably even buy it and use it in one of the other scents (agrume, rose, maybe the fougere).

I'm really sorry that you have had bad experiences with doctors in the past. I'm not one of those "doctors" (not sure why you used quotation marks). I don't think I know everything. And I don't go around making outrageous claims all the time like "worst ever" or "best ever," and that sort of thing. I'm kind of regretting even saying "most overrated." I mean, it's impossible to prove. Lots of soaps have been overhyped, and some of them were much worse soaps than MdC.

 

[It's Hedley]

You hang out with the wrong doctors, then.

Sheesh. Only mentioned I was a doctor to provide a context of what the scent did to my brain. When I was in school, we were forced to hang out with the cadavers in the anatomy lab for about 2-3 hours every day for the entire first semester. The scent had a way of lingering, getting onto your shoes, etc. Sometimes it seemed like that smell permeated the entire world.

The semester ends, and you get over it.


MdC's original scent certainly doesn't smell like formaldehyde. I'm not trying to imply that. I had a sample of the stuff and I shaved all the way through it (in other words, I didn't throw any of it away). That proves that I didn't HATE it, and I didn't think the lather was worthless. I thought the lather was pretty good but a bit drying. The scent was relatively mild, but it's definitely a lavender that veers heavily into the "herbal" side and away from the "floral" side. Very herbal lavenders often have a medicinal undertone to them. It might not be obvious to everybody, as noses differ. When you add the benzoin, there is a LITTLE HINT of the formaldehyde. You or other people might not notice it, or might not care even if you did.

But you know how scents have this ability to throw you back in time and space to a different place and time? That's generally considered a positive thing, as, for example, when a nice tropical floral scent reminds you of a wonderful vacation you took to Hawaii or whatever. That tiny little hint of formaldehyde, on the other hand, placed me squarely back in that dissection room, even though the scent is really miles away from what that room smelled like. I don't want to go back to that room. Ever.

As far as "best ever," or "worst ever" is concerned, I agree that those types of terms are thrown around a lot, and not always by doctors.;-)

I never said that MdC was the worst soap ever, and I don't even remotely believe that MdC is the worst soap ever. It's not even close to the worst soap ever. It's a fairly good soap. It makes a lather that provides for a clean shave, and if it doesn't dry out your skin (or if you have oily skin to begin with and want your skin to dry out just a little bit), and if you don't mind the scent, or like it, then MdC is a good soap for you.

I was calling it the "most overrated" soap, not the worst soap. There is a huge difference. I base this claim ("most overrated") on the fact that in the 10 years I have been on this shave forum, I have seen more long threads extolling the virtues of MdC than I have for almost any other soap. People love it. And that's ok. Overrated doesn't mean it's bad. It means that, for me, at least, it doesn't live up to its hype.


I'm just going to throw out a theory.... I suspect that if the price were much cheaper, people wouldn't love it as much as they do. When I was in the Army, I was stationed at Ford Ord, near Monterey and Carmel, CA. There was a woman there who was trying to sell her house, located in Carmel proper, which is a very stuffy and very expensive place. She had the home on the market for a few weeks without a bite. Eventually, she contacted a realtor for help selling her place. The realtor told her that the problem was that her price was too low. He said that in a place like Carmel, when people saw a price like that, they assumed that the house would be terrible, so they didn't go to see it. So, she raised the price considerably. Suddenly, the place was crawling with potential buyers and she had it sold within a week. Having a high price conveys a certain cache to a product. The fact that MdC is made in a quaint place in France doesn't hurt, either. Let's face it, it's a cool story. The videos of the making of the soap are awesome. Getting an expensive soap from France is cool. Finally, when people pay a lot for something, they tend to exaggerate the good in the product; this rationalizes the purchase. Most of this is done subconsciously, and everybody does it. "If you want the best, you have to pay for the best," "You get what you pay for," etc., etc.

In short (too late for that, I know), I contend that if a guy named Scott made MdC soap in Morgantown, West Virginia, and called it, oh, I don't know, say "Almost Heaven Soap Works," or something, and sold it for $18 per container, it would never have achieved legendary status, even if it were the exact same soap. Sure, guys would like it and praise it. "Hey guys, check out this new artisan soap from West Virginia! It only takes a tiny bit of soap to lather, it lathers up really quickly, it shaves great, and it has an interesting lavender scent. You should give it a try." And perhaps a bunch of people would love it for its frugal nature, getting hundreds of shaves out of an $18 puck of soap. But I seriously doubt it would have 35-page-or-longer threads over and over again; I don't think it would take up nearly as much bandwidth as MdC has over the years.

Oh, and I would probably even buy it and use it in one of the other scents (agrume, rose, maybe the fougere).

I'm really sorry that you have had bad experiences with doctors in the past. I'm not one of those "doctors" (not sure why you used quotation marks). I don't think I know everything. And I don't go around making outrageous claims all the time like "worst ever" or "best ever," and that sort of thing. I'm kind of regretting even saying "most overrated." I mean, it's impossible to prove. Lots of soaps have been overhyped, and some of them were much worse soaps than MdC.

Just busting your chops Dr! I sit corrected, you did say overrated and not worst ever. Great reply to my over generalization of the doctors I know and in all seriousness, they are some of the best people I know. Albeit long winded!

I too remember the smell of formaldyhyde in class, but it was in high school biology dissecting frogs and pigs. We also had a kid in that class who smoked weed. Many different smells and a very memorable class indeed. I do not smell that in MdC, but my sniffer is not as good as it used to be, certainly not during Summer allergy season. Maybe I should see a doctor for that?!

I once played golf around the Monterey Penninsula (Pebble, Spyglass etc) and the last course we played on the way to SFO to fly home was the course at Ft. Ord (the Bayonet course I believe). Hardest course I played that week or at least the worst golf I played. Certainly not the prettiest course, but tough.

I love your comparing/contrasting the home in Carmel and the "Almost Heaven Soap Works". In many cases it is slick marketing, lofty reviews, romantic notions etc that sell, whether it is a home or soap. For me personally, I was going to be in Paris, wanted to see this cool shop called Planete Razoir and had decided I had to buy something while there and the MdC was a no brainer.

Thanks for the kind reply.

 

[Bbb34]

I'm just going to throw out a theory.... I suspect that if the price were much cheaper, people wouldn't love it as much as they do.

Maybe you're right, but also, it could be judged too harshly because of it's price too. People maybe set their expectations too high because of it. Something along the lines of "soap that's 40Euros just has to perform twice as good as one that's 20Euros and 4 times as well...." well you get the idea. Where in reality, law of diminishing returns applies to shaving soaps too, just like everything else.

For me what matters is whether I want to use certain product repeatedly. Shaving soaps which I (currently) do, cheapest one is $7.50 CAD if memory serves me well, and I'm not sure I like them it any less than MDC because of it's price.

Oh, and I suppose I'm the one who used "best" and "worst" but didn't mean anything bad by it, nor did I imply you did anything wrong by stating you feel MDC is "most overrated" - I mean, I do not agree, but that's perfectly fine.

 

[Bbb34]

I'm not expecting anything far superior to some of the other great soaps I have. It's a checklist for me and it wasn't prohibitively expensive in the long run. Now if only I knew how long it took to ship from England. The anticipation is killing me. I've already bought two more soaps through Amazon just to hold me over until my MdC soaps arrive.

1-2 weeks, no hard rule and also no tracking either (you get what you pay for - which really isn't much)

 

[kingfisher]

Just busting your chops Dr! I sit corrected, you did say overrated and not worst ever. Great reply to my over generalization of the doctors I know and in all seriousness, they are some of the best people I know. Albeit long winded!

I too remember the smell of formaldyhyde in class, but it was in high school biology dissecting frogs and pigs. We also had a kid in that class who smoked weed. Many different smells and a very memorable class indeed. I do not smell that in MdC, but my sniffer is not as good as it used to be, certainly not during Summer allergy season. Maybe I should see a doctor for that?!

I once played golf around the Monterey Penninsula (Pebble, Spyglass etc) and the last course we played on the way to SFO to fly home was the course at Ft. Ord (the Bayonet course I believe). Hardest course I played that week or at least the worst golf I played. Certainly not the prettiest course, but tough.

I love your comparing/contrasting the home in Carmel and the "Almost Heaven Soap Works". In many cases it is slick marketing, lofty reviews, romantic notions etc that sell, whether it is a home or soap. For me personally, I was going to be in Paris, wanted to see this cool shop called Planete Razoir and had decided I had to buy something while there and the MdC was a no brainer.

Thanks for the kind reply.

At the risk of totally sending the thread veering in the wrong direction, I played Bayonet tons of times when I was there. And yes, it is a brutally difficult course. Pebble Beach was simultaneously quite a bit easier and exponentially more beautiful (I played it for free, believe it or not).

 

[Chandu]

I do agree with @kingfisher and his theory.

I tend to think it's one thing to buy a $20 dollar soap and feel ripped off and complain in forums about it. But when you're chunking down $75, I think you look a lot harder to find some redeeming quailities in it so you don't feel so much the fool yourself. Writing off $20 is no big deal to many, but $75 is a little harder to swallow.

The one good thing about buying soaps with good reps is that if you don't like it yourself you can usually get a good portion of your money back by reselling.

 

[lancre]

• Expense is the sum of money you pay when you buy something. Cost is the sum of money that gets lost when you use something.
• MdC is a large expense but a low cost.
• Soap preferences are subjective so it's not really much use to discuss right and wrong when it comes to that.
• Different people have different priorities and different budget constraints and thus have different definitions of cost effective.

What I'm getting at is that it's very interesting to follow this thread, but there's no right and wrong only different opinions and priorities.

...oh God I sound like an old school teacher.

Just wondering:
Would that be an OLD schoolteacher or an OLD-SCHOOL teacher?

 

[cyclingsteveb]

Seems like MDC likely does sell so well because of the hype surrounding it. Made in France, great production back story and finally "the must be awesome" price. I am curious enough to try it one day. Just bought Henri et Victoria Cognac and Cuban Cigars soap today. I will have to be content with the less expensive soaps for now.

 

[snowman]

Glad to read yet another thread filled with comments about the cost of MdC. Its expensive soap but in the grand scheme of things not that much money. Get into old English sports cars for a hobby. Or boats. You know what BOAT stands for? Break Out Another Thousand.

So I unashamedly admit to owning MdC, liking MdC, and every penny of the $65 cost of entry was earned through hard work. Ask me if I care if anyone on this forum thinks I wasted my money?

Oh....and thanks for the new signature line!

 

[Leverspro]

It was outstanding for a while, I couldn't think of a soap that lathers as easily as MdC and lasts as long, but that's what made it remarkable in my opinion. I am now spoiled with such nice post shave from newer soaps, that it's no longer easy for me to appreciate my old ones, MdC included.

I'm keeping my MdC's in my den, it will always have that special collector value in my eyes, but as a performer, it's a little long in tooth.

interesting perspective! I've only been wet shaving for about 5 years. I received my first MdC last week. The Fougere. it is a really great soap, but not amaziingly better than some other modern artisans that I have.

 

[Sabin]

I've heard that MdC is almost as good as Ogallala..

 

[martym]

I have been using it since December 1,2018 and it exclusively.

 

[McNutt]

Thank you again for taking one for the team.

 

[Boghopper]

With so many differing views, I just might have to get some.

 

[McNutt]

If you do, use The English Shaving company. With shipping to the US, I only paid $45 for each tub.

Thanks again, Bbb34, for the tip.

 

[Polarbeard]

Just wondering:
Would that be an OLD schoolteacher or an OLD-SCHOOL teacher?

Both.