The fact that Blackland refuses to disclose blade gap and exposure, along with my own recent experiences trying to find a daily shaving "Goldilocks" over the last 6 months since getting into wet shaving lead me to believe that blade gap and exposure don't even come close to telling the full story of comfort and efficiency. Do you agree? I think they give an indication (generally), but I've experienced small blade gap razors that are rough and large blade gap razors that are too mild. Apparently geometry (down to subtleties) make a huge difference?
Design and Geometry Observation
- Thread starter Greg788
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Mr. Shavington
Knows Hot Turkish Toilets
I‘d agree with that. Other things too, like you can’t always predict how rigid the blade will be just by inspecting how the razor clamps the blade. There’s clearly some witchcraft involved.
Iridian
Cool and slimy
Yeah, new razors often shave quite differently than one would imagine going by the specs and looks.
On the plus side, one can always be positively surprised. But also negatively.
On the plus side, one can always be positively surprised. But also negatively.
Obvious example of tomfoolery.
- Thread starter
- #5
Perhaps I'm cheap and picky, but I've mostly been negatively surprised after actual shaving with a given razor based on its reviews, product info ("mild enough for daily shaving", etc.) and forum feedback
I personally think you can make most razors work quite well for you if you take the time to learn the razor. Each razor will have its own sweet spot and it takes a bit to find it. Stick with the same razor for 2-3 weeks straight and you will most likely find it.
We had a rather lengthy discussion, or three, about this recently. Ultimately, the razor is a blade holder. I like to think of it's properties as modifying how that blade shaves; you bend more or less, you put a safety bar that limits it's contact with skin, you devise a clamping scheme that keeps it rigid, etc. The classic Tech razor is a specific combination of features, but it's inherent geometry is the basis, or starting point, of a lot of modern razors. By geometry, I am referring to how it holds the blade only. With all of the other engineering tools available, it is possible to create something so evolved that it's origins aren't recognisable anymore.
Blade gap has some positives and some negatives, but is ultimately done by dropping the safety bar not modifying how the blade is held. Blade exposure is more relevent and informative of how a razor will feel, but is also accomplished by moving the safety bar either down and/or inward. The effect of this is to steepen the shaving angle which will have an impact on how the razor feels. Combining many little changes can compound each other; that steeper angle may have negative consequences that the designer doesn't intend and they have to offset it by curving the blade more so it is not pointing straight out. At the end of the day, you have to spend some time with a razor that you can at least live with in order to understand what you want in a razor. Understanding these parameters and thinking about how they affect your current razor will help you to understand what specifications or features you want in the next razor.
Blade gap has some positives and some negatives, but is ultimately done by dropping the safety bar not modifying how the blade is held. Blade exposure is more relevent and informative of how a razor will feel, but is also accomplished by moving the safety bar either down and/or inward. The effect of this is to steepen the shaving angle which will have an impact on how the razor feels. Combining many little changes can compound each other; that steeper angle may have negative consequences that the designer doesn't intend and they have to offset it by curving the blade more so it is not pointing straight out. At the end of the day, you have to spend some time with a razor that you can at least live with in order to understand what you want in a razor. Understanding these parameters and thinking about how they affect your current razor will help you to understand what specifications or features you want in the next razor.
Iridian
Cool and slimy
The "mild enough" ones were too aggressive? It was not all for nothing, you learnt that this razor is already too much. It's all relative, you have to try a few razors to get an idea if you are rather in the mild or the aggressive camp, or if you like to shave rather steep or shallow.
For instance, I started with the R89 and didn't manage to shave better than with a Gillette Fusion. I even got better along with a Merkur head. The R41 on the other hand then blew me away.
You will figure out your preferences and find your first "wow!" razor. Just takes some experimentation. I suggest trying some Razorock razors, they have a nice razor scale on their homepage as well.
You should also try a Tech or a Yuma, you can always say that when you have no other idea what to do, because they simply work!
Blackland Blackbird
Gap: 0.58 mm
Exp.: Positive
Source: An excellent review of Jose Maria (Hosay18) from Sin Corte No Hay Gloria - Revisión: Blackland Blackbird XL
Gap: 0.58 mm
Exp.: Positive
Source: An excellent review of Jose Maria (Hosay18) from Sin Corte No Hay Gloria - Revisión: Blackland Blackbird XL
Sometimes it is a simple as narrow down the list, buy and try...
You don't have to spend 200 bucks for a DE that can give you a great shave.
Remember, the magic and the skill comes from the wizard and not the wand. The wand will pick you.
BFX
You don't have to spend 200 bucks for a DE that can give you a great shave.
Remember, the magic and the skill comes from the wizard and not the wand. The wand will pick you.
BFX
But sometimes the wizard (or the hand
) is a little dumb (like me), and need a wizard wand or with autopilot 
. For me the mild razors are the best choice.
I think another issue comes into play and is very much underestimated - confirmation bias.
I've only been at this game for 8 or 9 months, and on this forum shortly after starting. In this short time I've identified very few individuals whose comments I can translate into ones that are meaningful to me.
Most everyone else's are hit or miss at best - especially those from the "I need an efficient razor crowd". I can't remotely relate to this in my experience.
If I look at my face cross-eyed, I suffer prickly itchy post shave irritation.
My technique has evolved past the point where I recognize the paradox of the mild and inefficient razor - too many passes to get the job done yields irritation. It's not about "milder" dimensions being better. I get that.
Still, this junior wizard needs the right wand in order to develop his skills. Currently this is an Overlander.
This brings me to confirmation bias. My understanding is that it has less exposure than reported, and yet the wide range of shavers who love this razor have me scratching my head. Many are from the church of high gap / high exposure.
How many of you would categorically dismiss this razor if its real numbers were published. I can understand why some razor designers are hesitant to publish dimensions.
... Thom
I've only been at this game for 8 or 9 months, and on this forum shortly after starting. In this short time I've identified very few individuals whose comments I can translate into ones that are meaningful to me.
Most everyone else's are hit or miss at best - especially those from the "I need an efficient razor crowd". I can't remotely relate to this in my experience.
If I look at my face cross-eyed, I suffer prickly itchy post shave irritation.
My technique has evolved past the point where I recognize the paradox of the mild and inefficient razor - too many passes to get the job done yields irritation. It's not about "milder" dimensions being better. I get that.
Still, this junior wizard needs the right wand in order to develop his skills. Currently this is an Overlander.
This brings me to confirmation bias. My understanding is that it has less exposure than reported, and yet the wide range of shavers who love this razor have me scratching my head. Many are from the church of high gap / high exposure.
How many of you would categorically dismiss this razor if its real numbers were published. I can understand why some razor designers are hesitant to publish dimensions.
... Thom
This is going to be a strange response and I may be wrong in this, but follow me a minute. From what I have gathered from the more experienced here that seem to have or have tried every enthusiast razor, the mild-but-efficient razors fill a hole in their lineup. What I mean is that they have so many aggressive razors that a mild one that is intriguing in some way might have a place in their den. I mean I do have one, it's the Masamune with Nodachi cap and it probably has a similar blade feel if not exposure which is deceptively present. I don't know what it is that I enjoy about having it and I don't use it all that often, but it scratches a particular itch. I just don't have any interest in any more razors like this is all. Now the Wolf crowd might be another story altogether, but I know some of them with multiple razors are purchasing the milder options as their sixth one. There is something to this, but it may not be as profound as you might think. It might just be filling holes in their collections.
As you know, I did categorically dismiss the Overlander once I saw photos of its exposure. But that was for me and not for anybody else. I try to be diplomatic about my comments and look for positives that others may enjoy, but I reserve the right not to open my pocket book to make definitive judgements. I leave open the possibility that I might be surprised, but I don't get along well with sharper blades that these razors need. I was happy to read today that Dan decided to keep his Athena because it tamed the Feather for him, that's a decision that I would have a hard time making myself and I try not to even put myself in a position where I have to make those decisions. However, the Aylsworth right now is frustrating the heck out of me in spite of it's actual moderately positive exposure so specs aren't everything. Perceived blade feel is more important to me whether my Blackbird has 0.14 or 0.22mm of exposure, it's a substantial amount. Some razors like the Overlander may be a sufficient amount, but I am not biting.
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I can see your point, and I certainly value both your thoroughness as well as how you add context to clearly identify your preferences and frame your descriptions from that perspective. I can take them to the bank ;-)
Perhaps you nailed it - that even the high exposure crowd needs an occasional vacation. I can't recall reading any comments to this effect, but it makes sense.
To date, I've found myself gravitating toward medium sharp blades + mild to medium razors. I've yet to explore the reverse combination, and hopefully, I'll remember your comments as a possible approach to taming these wild beasts (which currently frighten me
).... Thom
Iridian
Cool and slimy
For what it is worth, most know I usually take aggressive razors, though the recent themed months make me use all razors of type fitting the theme in succession... I am always surprised which razor I like in the end and which one not.
Despite years of trying several dozens of razors. Most surprisingly was that I also like some rather milder razors, though the super mild ones still just never work for me.
I marveled about the mild but efficient Ares and Athena, and so did many others, but also among my favorites are two quite polar opposites: Yaqi Mellon and Yaqi Harlequin.
The only thing I am quite sure about is that I prefer open comb designs, and rather heavy handles. The Milano handle of my Lupo Clone again being an exception. That one fits perfectly.
I can also state that light weight and rigid, guided shaving and matte finishes don't do it for me. Two highly rated razors of those type are just not doing it for me, the Henson Medium and the Rockwell 6S.
Recently the forum had quite some questionnaire type threads with people asking around, hoping to make sense of the responses they got and finding a consensus.
It's heartbreaking to read these thread at times. I try to help people making an educated guess, but in the end nobody will be able to tell their favorite. I am fairly sure many will be surprised what razors they will like in the end.
Despite years of trying several dozens of razors. Most surprisingly was that I also like some rather milder razors, though the super mild ones still just never work for me.
I marveled about the mild but efficient Ares and Athena, and so did many others, but also among my favorites are two quite polar opposites: Yaqi Mellon and Yaqi Harlequin.
The only thing I am quite sure about is that I prefer open comb designs, and rather heavy handles. The Milano handle of my Lupo Clone again being an exception. That one fits perfectly.
I can also state that light weight and rigid, guided shaving and matte finishes don't do it for me. Two highly rated razors of those type are just not doing it for me, the Henson Medium and the Rockwell 6S.
Recently the forum had quite some questionnaire type threads with people asking around, hoping to make sense of the responses they got and finding a consensus.
It's heartbreaking to read these thread at times. I try to help people making an educated guess, but in the end nobody will be able to tell their favorite. I am fairly sure many will be surprised what razors they will like in the end.
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