Can’t get an even edge

[Bayamontate]

This:

The bevel is the edge.
No bevel means no edge.
Learn to set the bevel so you can manage a shave with it. Then you're 'there' or close.
Progressing to finer grits before that level of bevel refinement is achieved is not advisable.-Gamma

 

[Slash McCoy]

The edge is the apex of a bevel. A bevel of course has two faces. The flattened and polished areas where you removed steel with the stones is a bevel face, even though it is interrupted by the hollowgrind, where the stone has no effect. A good bevel has the two faces meeting in steel. Disregard the actual shape of the razor and the width of the improved bevel face where the stone wore away the steel. All that matters is that the two bevel faces intersect in a good apex. The inconsistent width of the bevel face at the edge is purely (if the razor is honed properly) a product of the grinding of the razor. If it is wider at some spots than others, again assuming correct honing, it does not matter one bit. What is important is that the two faces do meet in a good edge.

As for the correct honing part, you must remember that both spine and edge contact the stone, and steel is removed from both, as a matter of course. However, when you hold the razor, you are holding the shank and it is inline with the spine. If you are careless, you will grind away a disproportionate amount of steel from the spine, and not give the edge proper attention. They must both lose steel in proper proportion. And so, you may have to consciously torque the edge downward a bit to endure that you are giving it enough love, and not just grinding away at the spine to no good effect.

Many beginners make the mistake of laying the stone on a fixed surface and trying desperately to control the razor with two hands. Inevitably this causes problems for the beginner, though many old pros bench hone with great success. So I suggest you hold the stone in hand, unsupported, and allow razor and stone to find their own alignment. They will, if you just let them.

You need to decide exactly how you will determine that the bevel is set. It is absolutely useless to continue honing on finer stones if the bevel is not properly and truly set. You can't just guess. VERIFY. You can do this visually, under a good loupe or USB microscope or handheld mocroscope like the Carson. My favorite optic by far is the 10x Belomo Triplet. It is by far the superior optic for honing, for various reasons and I won't write a book about it here so just remember I told you so, and do your own due diligence or just buy one. Not just any loupe, either. 10x Belomo. There are also various tests of the bevel but you have to test every single bit of the edge. You can also use the burr method or the hybrid burr method, then hone the burr off. It is fast and easy to understand.

Newbie Honing Compendium | Badger & Blade

 

[lightfoot]

After pondering over this thread for a while a few thoughts have come to mind:

1- Please get rid of this razor ASAP. (It’s not a good starting point to learn on)

2- Try to find a couple of razors that are ready to use upon arrival

3- If you decide you enjoy shaving with a straight razor be ready to throw down for quality stones. If you’re not willing to do that then this hobby may prove to be unfulfilling over time.

There’s lots of good advice on this thread but you’ll likely need to be honest with yourself as to whether or not you want to follow through with learning to hone.

 

[Frank Shaves]

All that matters is that the two bevel faces intersect in a good apex.

If you are careless, you will grind away a disproportionate amount of steel from the spine, and not give the edge proper attention. They must both lose steel in proper proportion. And so, you may have to consciously torque the edge downward a bit to endure that you are giving it enough love, and not just grinding away at the spine to no good effect.

My favorite optic by far is the 10x Belomo Triplet. It is by far the superior optic for honing, for various reasons and I won't write a book about it here so just remember I told you so, and do your own due diligence or just buy one. Not just any loupe, either. 10x Belomo.

Good advice!

If you are removing more steel from the spine than you want, try putting one layer of electrical tape (like 3M Scotch Super 88) on the spine. Tape is a tool and has its purpose. There are many threads about tape.

If the blade suffers from a small warp or uneven grind, you can hone the edge in sections. Try dividing the edge into 4 or 5 sections and using two hands place the index finger of your non-dominant hand toward the edge of the section you are focusing on to guide you. Do not consciously use the index finger to apply pressure and, instead, ask yourself "is the edge making contact and adjust accordingly. Trust your unconscious mind - the years of your brain's hand-eye coordination training - to do the right thing.

I took @Slash McCoy's recommendation and love my x + x + x + x + x + x + x + x + x + x Belomo Triplet .

 

[Grizzly Chin Fluff]

Here in the US (where I live) you can buy good quality used vintage razors on eBay for 20 to 30 USD. Get yourself a couple of inexpensive used vintage razors to learn to hone on. Lots of good videos on YouTube.

Keith Johnson (@Gamma) has many good ones:

https://www.youtube.com/@KeithVJohnson1/videos

Alfredo (@Doc226):

@gary haywood:

And keep the questions coming.

Thanks!

 

[Grizzly Chin Fluff]

After pondering over this thread for a while a few thoughts have come to mind:

1- Please get rid of this razor ASAP. (It’s not a good starting point to learn on)

2- Try to find a couple of razors that are ready to use upon arrival

3- If you decide you enjoy shaving with a straight razor be ready to throw down for quality stones. If you’re not willing to do that then this hobby may prove to be unfulfilling over time.

There’s lots of good advice on this thread but you’ll likely need to be honest with yourself as to whether or not you want to follow through with learning to hone.

Thanks, that is my plan but why a ‘couple’? Don’t you just need one?

Do you think i can still learn to how hone with the it?

Do have any straight razor brand recommendations? Preferably not expensive.

 

[Grizzly Chin Fluff]

The edge is the apex of a bevel. A bevel of course has two faces. The flattened and polished areas where you removed steel with the stones is a bevel face, even though it is interrupted by the hollowgrind, where the stone has no effect. A good bevel has the two faces meeting in steel. Disregard the actual shape of the razor and the width of the improved bevel face where the stone wore away the steel. All that matters is that the two bevel faces intersect in a good apex. The inconsistent width of the bevel face at the edge is purely (if the razor is honed properly) a product of the grinding of the razor. If it is wider at some spots than others, again assuming correct honing, it does not matter one bit. What is important is that the two faces do meet in a good edge.

As for the correct honing part, you must remember that both spine and edge contact the stone, and steel is removed from both, as a matter of course. However, when you hold the razor, you are holding the shank and it is inline with the spine. If you are careless, you will grind away a disproportionate amount of steel from the spine, and not give the edge proper attention. They must both lose steel in proper proportion. And so, you may have to consciously torque the edge downward a bit to endure that you are giving it enough love, and not just grinding away at the spine to no good effect.

Many beginners make the mistake of laying the stone on a fixed surface and trying desperately to control the razor with two hands. Inevitably this causes problems for the beginner, though many old pros bench hone with great success. So I suggest you hold the stone in hand, unsupported, and allow razor and stone to find their own alignment. They will, if you just let them.

You need to decide exactly how you will determine that the bevel is set. It is absolutely useless to continue honing on finer stones if the bevel is not properly and truly set. You can't just guess. VERIFY. You can do this visually, under a good loupe or USB microscope or handheld mocroscope like the Carson. My favorite optic by far is the 10x Belomo Triplet. It is by far the superior optic for honing, for various reasons and I won't write a book about it here so just remember I told you so, and do your own due diligence or just buy one. Not just any loupe, either. 10x Belomo. There are also various tests of the bevel but you have to test every single bit of the edge. You can also use the burr method or the hybrid burr method, then hone the burr off. It is fast and easy to understand.

Newbie Honing Compendium | Badger & Blade

Thank you, i’ll take your words into account.

 

[Grizzly Chin Fluff]

Flattening whetstones on sandpaper is do-able, but it is important to verify flatness with a good quality straightedge.
Some people draw a pencil grid and lap it off, that doesn't mean the stone is flat.

Your stone looks like a 'BearMoo' - or one of the follow up brands they are sold under. The names keep changing so the bad reviews get washed away with a new listing. While it is possible to make some cheap stones work, it's not a path many find success with. I had two BearMoo stones from Amazon, they were not good quality and I returned them. I would not recommend them to anyone learning to hone razors.

Chamfering a stone is putting a 45 degree angle to the edges. Some roll the edge off with a radius, same thing. This keeps the edges 'safe'.

I am not familiar with Beard Boys or your razor and I am not fond of guessing or investing work into unknown things. I am also not a member of the 'silk purse/sow's ear' club. When asked for direction, I usually suggest starting off with a decent vintage razor from a known and trusted source.

Oh ok, yeah i did the same, pencil marked the whetstone and sanded it (on a flat surface) till the lines disappear. And I actually did chamfer it.

I wish i came to this site before buying stuff Straight razor shaving is like a rabbit hole. So many things to know. I didn’t know what i was getting myself into. Nevertheless, i still want to try it. Next step is to get a proper razor, have any advice? Or a link sending me to good advice?

I also don’t like the ‘silk purse/sow’s ear‘ club, but beggars can’t be choosers.

Thanks so far for all the help.

 

[lightfoot]

Thanks, that is my plan but why a ‘couple’? Don’t you just need one?

Do you think i can still learn to how hone with the it?

Do have any straight razor brand recommendations? Preferably not expensive.

Yes I would definitely recommend more than one razor. This is primarily because of the inevitability of compromising the edge while you learn to strop. You’re going to do it, I did it, we’ve all done it…

As far as razor brands go I recommend anything from Germany or even a gold dollar honed to shave ready by a member here.


You might try and reach out to @Bayamontate and see if he might be able to get you set up with something that would fit the bill.

 

[Gamma]

Oh ok, yeah i did the same, pencil marked the whetstone and sanded it (on a flat surface) till the lines disappear. And I actually did chamfer it.

I wish i came to this site before buying stuff Straight razor shaving is like a rabbit hole. So many things to know. I didn’t know what i was getting myself into. Nevertheless, i still want to try it. Next step is to get a proper razor, have any advice? Or a link sending me to good advice?

I also don’t like the ‘silk purse/sow’s ear‘ club, but beggars can’t be choosers.

Thanks so far for all the help.

Straight shaving comes with a learning curve, yeah.

If you want to hone razors from start to finish, tools that work well make life easier and achieving goals easier or at least possible. A lot of us bought our gear incrementally, over time, to offset costs. Most of us face budgetary concerns regularly.

If you want to maintain an already sharp razor - get a good razor with a good edge, and get a touch up option like maybe a pasted strop. Keeping an edge going for a while on pastes is do-able.

 

[bluesman 7]

why a ‘couple’? Don’t you just need one?

Start with the premise that you get two razors in shave ready condition. Eventually one of the razors (razor A) will start under performing razor B. You can now hone razor razor A until it out performs razor B. Once you can accomplish that you can now work on razor B and leapfrog your honing skills while always having a good performing reference to fall back on.

 

[StellaNova]

In addition to the fantasic advice already given, I would suggest spending a lot of time reading all about the various aspects of straight razor shaving on this site, including the very imortant stropping section before buying anything else.
Avoid overpriced restored ebay razors, even if they are advertised as being shave ready. If you are patient, you can get a very good razor for $20-30.
There are a few members names that come up regularly when somebody asks for reccommendations when they need sombody trusworthy to send their razors to for honing. Consider making use of their services at least once. In the past most men who shaved themselves sent their razors to professionals for honing.
Some guys start off by learning to use a replaceable blade type razor that looks like a straight and is handled the same way. This may be a cheaper way to get an idea of whether or not straight shaving is for you since you don't have to worry about honing and stropping. Just an idea and not something that I have tried myself.

Here is an interesting link that was posted by Legion a while back, but the entire thread is woth reading:
What do I need to get started? - https://www.badgerandblade.com/forum/threads/what-do-i-need-to-get-started.635531/#post-12104806

 

[Frank Shaves]

@Grizzly Chin Fluff, I will keep an eye out for a nice, inexpensive razor and private message (PM) you if and when I see something. Here are examples of what I am talking about.

Union Spike before.

After.

Robeson 15A250 before.

After. She ain't no beauty queen, but she shaves quite nicely.

 

[H Brad Boonshaft]

Love the Robeson’s collarless domed pins, hammer finished tangs and blades that will take a screaming edge.

Have several.

 

[Grizzly Chin Fluff]

In addition to the fantasic advice already given, I would suggest spending a lot of time reading all about the various aspects of straight razor shaving on this site, including the very imortant stropping section before buying anything else.
Avoid overpriced restored ebay razors, even if they are advertised as being shave ready. If you are patient, you can get a very good razor for $20-30.
There are a few members names that come up regularly when somebody asks for reccommendations when they need sombody trusworthy to send their razors to for honing. Consider making use of their services at least once. In the past most men who shaved themselves sent their razors to professionals for honing.
Some guys start off by learning to use a replaceable blade type razor that looks like a straight and is handled the same way. This may be a cheaper way to get an idea of whether or not straight shaving is for you since you don't have to worry about honing and stropping. Just an idea and not something that I have tried myself.

Here is an interesting link that was posted by Legion a while back, but the entire thread is woth reading:
What do I need to get started? - https://www.badgerandblade.com/forum/threads/what-do-i-need-to-get-started.635531/#post-12104806

The thing is i live in South Africa, so i’d have to send my razor over seas to get it honed by one of these members. There are probably some experienced honers in SA, but i’d have to look for them. You’re right though, i should probably first try straight razor shaving before getting into the nitty-gritty of sharpening the blade

Thanks! I’ll give that book a read.

 

[Grizzly Chin Fluff]

@Grizzly Chin Fluff, I will keep an eye out for a nice, inexpensive razor and private message (PM) you if and when I see something. Here are examples of what I am talking about.

Union Spike before.

View attachment 1709298

After.

View attachment 1709299

Robeson 15A250 before.

View attachment 1709300

After. She ain't no beauty queen, but she shaves quite nicely.

View attachment 1709301

Thanks, i’d appreciate that a lot. Something to consider though, is that i live in South Africa so shipping can be really expensive. But family of mine are coming to SA from America in November, so i could send something with them if everything lines up.

Do you know anything about transporting a straight razor in flight baggage?

 

[JPO]

The thing is i live in South Africa, so i’d have to send my razor over seas to get it honed by one of these members. There are probably some experienced honers in SA, but i’d have to look for them. You’re right though, i should probably first try straight razor shaving before getting into the nitty-gritty of sharpening the blade

Thanks! I’ll give that book a read.

Jacques, also known as dapper shaves on youtube is located in South Africa. He will probably be able to help you out with both honing and hooking you up with a razor.
You also have Trevor Woolfson, who makes custom razors in South Africa if you like to go for a custom razor at some point (WoolfBlades).

 

[Grizzly Chin Fluff]

Straight shaving comes with a learning curve, yeah.

If you want to hone razors from start to finish, tools that work well make life easier and achieving goals easier or at least possible. A lot of us bought our gear incrementally, over time, to offset costs. Most of us face budgetary concerns regularly.

If you want to maintain an already sharp razor - get a good razor with a good edge, and get a touch up option like maybe a pasted strop. Keeping an edge going for a while on pastes is do-able.

Jacques, also known as dapper shaves on youtube is located in South Africa. He will probably be able to help you out with both honing and hooking you up with a razor.
You also have Trevor Woolfson, who makes custom razors in South Africa if you like to go for a custom razor at some point (WoolfBlades).

Thanks! It would help to know some experienced locals WoolfsBlades is actually pretty close to me.

 

[Biltong & Boerewors]

A good way to start, keeping to a tight budget , is to start with a shavette. A shavette is a disposable blade razor that uses in most cases a normal razor blade snapped in half, but some use a full blade. It will teach you how to shave with a straight, and you won't have to worry about the honing until you are sure you are enjoying the experience.

If you are interested, don't rush off and buy a shavette that looks good, buy one recommended by an experienced member. Just watch out, some shavettes use specific blades, like the Feater Artist Club. Great razor but quite pricey.

If you cant find something from the South African barber shops, look on Aliexpress.

Here is a pic of one on their site that will work well and will be cheap: