Wow! This link's even better. I'm counting 623 pages, and it's nearly every month from 1918 including some from Gillette Canada. Looks like the original docs were (are?) held by the University of Michigan if someone up in that neck of the woods wants to check to see if they have any other issues.
What I found today and almost missed it!
- Thread starter IronHammer
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Wow! This link's even better. I'm counting 623 pages, and it's nearly every month from 1918 including some from Gillette Canada. Looks like the original docs were (are?) held by the University of Michigan if someone up in that neck of the woods wants to check to see if they have any other issues.
Check the post I made after yours Ironhammer. I found a much longer(623pg) PDF on google books. Unfortunately its locked so I can't copy the section I want but its on pg 158.
Its written by the employee who was asked to come up with a Gillette trademark by the Board, except King Gillette picked the Diamond and Arrow logo quite by accident so I think we can rule out the notion I had earlier of maybe a Board vs King C Gillette squabble over what the trademark was going to be. I will try to print and scan it tomorrow if you haven't DL'd the google book version by then.
Got through 325 pgs tonight, will hit the books again tomorrow.
Jay
- Thread starter
- #83
Jay,
I was able to download the PDF from google and read page 158. It's a great piece about the origins of the diamond trademark and the fellow that designed it. Positively fascinating reading! Unfortunately, there is no mention of the signature mark.
I wonder if anybody else has found this incredible piece of history?! I have never seen it mentioned anywhere but it has to have some clues about far more than just our signature series, but also many other unanswered questions about production over the years. But it sure is a lot of reading. Great stuff!
Now if only we could find some documents from 1908. I wonder if it is possible that KCG himself may have personal letters/memoirs/diaries that are available to the public, perhaps from his estate? Anybody ever heard of anything like that?
I was able to download the PDF from google and read page 158. It's a great piece about the origins of the diamond trademark and the fellow that designed it. Positively fascinating reading! Unfortunately, there is no mention of the signature mark.
I wonder if anybody else has found this incredible piece of history?! I have never seen it mentioned anywhere but it has to have some clues about far more than just our signature series, but also many other unanswered questions about production over the years. But it sure is a lot of reading. Great stuff!
Now if only we could find some documents from 1908. I wonder if it is possible that KCG himself may have personal letters/memoirs/diaries that are available to the public, perhaps from his estate? Anybody ever heard of anything like that?
I hear ya. The more I read about the company and the man the more interesting he is. A couple monthes further on there is an article about improving safety and the importance of going to the hospital if injured on the job. Lets face it that time in history was not much known for workers rights. Than later on he says if they get injured outside of work to go to the hospital and the company would take care of it! Sort of the first medical plan.
Anyways... The UofM tag got me thinking that we may need to start combing the Librarys of prominent Universities and Colleges, especially in areas were Gillette was big. Its very likely if someone died with a collection of info it probably would have been donated to a library. We can only hope some that maybe the records got digitized like this on.
I will try to skim through some more tonight but check out page 319. After all the debates in the blade forum on palm stropping, in 1918 a Gillette "Expert" check on the story of a soldier who used his blade for 71 shaves by gentle wiping it on his palm after use. And the soldier expected it to go to a hundred shaves!!!
I also found out the reason Gillette sold so many razors during WWI... Gas Masks!!! Since we joined the war late we had learned of gas attacks and the need to have a good seal to keep the gas out! Reading some of the stories it was a hallmark of the american soldiers that they were always clean shaven no matter how filthy they were in the trenches!
So much cool info! For anyone who hasn't DLd the google link and has an interest in Gillette I really recommend it. It provides some very keen insight into the everyday working that made our favorite razors number 1 on the world!
Jay
Anyways... The UofM tag got me thinking that we may need to start combing the Librarys of prominent Universities and Colleges, especially in areas were Gillette was big. Its very likely if someone died with a collection of info it probably would have been donated to a library. We can only hope some that maybe the records got digitized like this on.
I will try to skim through some more tonight but check out page 319. After all the debates in the blade forum on palm stropping, in 1918 a Gillette "Expert" check on the story of a soldier who used his blade for 71 shaves by gentle wiping it on his palm after use. And the soldier expected it to go to a hundred shaves!!!
I also found out the reason Gillette sold so many razors during WWI... Gas Masks!!! Since we joined the war late we had learned of gas attacks and the need to have a good seal to keep the gas out! Reading some of the stories it was a hallmark of the american soldiers that they were always clean shaven no matter how filthy they were in the trenches!
So much cool info! For anyone who hasn't DLd the google link and has an interest in Gillette I really recommend it. It provides some very keen insight into the everyday working that made our favorite razors number 1 on the world!
Jay
- Thread starter
- #85
I had read that KCG was not only a real visionary and business genius, but that he was a true humanitarian. It's great to know that the man, himself, was so likable and decent!
I can't even imagine where other documents may be stored but with so many universities digitizing their libraries, it makes them a little easier to find, I would think.
- Thread starter
- #86
It's a little frustrating that I can't search the PDF version of The Gillette Blade, yet Google Books allows for searching them. Jay, are you able to search for text in the PDF you downloaded?
- Thread starter
- #87
Starting on Page 52 of the PDF is a positively fascinating and intimate story, told by King Gillette himself, of how he went about inventing his razor and the trials and tribulations involved with inventing something he had no technical training on. In his own words, as regards the great difficulty in actually making a razor blade sharp enough to shave with but thin enough to use in his razor, he gets discouraged at one point and says "If I had been technically trained, I would have quit or never would have begun"
I highly recommend this PDF if you don't already have it! Here is the link again, in case you missed it.
The Gillette Blade - Starting with Vol 1 in 1918
I highly recommend this PDF if you don't already have it! Here is the link again, in case you missed it.
The Gillette Blade - Starting with Vol 1 in 1918
I'm embarassed to say I like doing it the old fashioned way. I never even thought to try searching I just jumped in reading and skimming a page at a time. But I will tell you after a couple volumes you start to get a real feel for the company. For instance each dept got a weekly bonus based on 95% attendance and 97% promptness. The bonus was $.50 for each half so if all the workers in a dept showed up and on time for the week they earned a extra dollar. At a time when $10 a week was the average thats a nice 10% bonus a week! So many insights and stories. I think if we keep at this we may find some more clues, perhaps a story by KCG or a Board member recalling something they did. As well after I get through this batch I will start internet combing the east coast university librarys, especially Boston, New York, and Chicago as those are the 3 Offices listed on all the 1908 ads I have seen.
Jay
- Thread starter
- #89
I have been reading/skimming the Gillette Blade as time permits. It really gives the reader insight as to the inner workings of the company. I sure hope we are not on some wild goose chase! The "signature" series of razors exist... we can see them, that is a fact. I hope that we are able figure out the meaning of them!
If you ever go back to work, Jay, we are in big trouble!
Seriously, I hope things are tolerable for you while you are not working.
If you ever go back to work, Jay, we are in big trouble!
Seriously, I hope things are tolerable for you while you are not working.
- Thread starter
- #90
I believe we can safely rule out the "Used as a Trademark" theory. If the signature had been considered as any kind of official trademark at all, it would almost certainly have been mentioned in that article, since it was written by the designer of the trademark and was a very in-depth article. It made no mention of any marks being used until his designed was chosen by KCG.
If the signature wasn't used as a trademark, that leaves two other possibilities that have so far been proposed:
1. Used only for special sets
- employee award/gift sets
- personal gifts given by KCG, himself
- special anniversary set
2. Used in a promotion of some kind (Golden Ticket Theory)
Yes I had in mind KCG fighting with the Board over his signature vs their Gillette Arrow & Diamond. That is clearly not the case as A) He had no prior knowledge of the employees assignment B) He is the one who picked it while it was still in the sketching phase, and seemingly quite cordially.
List 1
1.Employee Award-Might make sense if we discount the box you have that lists the retailer
2.Personal Gift-Again we have to discount your box & why not Combination Sets? If you want to impress... But I have seen reference to him always having blades on him and handing those out every where he went.
3.Special Anniversary-Again box must be discounted, as well we again run up against the Combinations Set question.
List 2
Golden Ticket Theory- Obviously I would love for this to be right as I thought of it
. However... we haven't, as yet, found a single ad or scrap of proof to support that.We also can discount the Service Campaign. I had found an early reference to the Second Service Campaign in the fall of 1918, the First Service Campaign was earlier in the year
. But as I said we will keep on it and since I am on the comp send resumes it gives me a good reason to take a break and read a bit. Definitely cool reading, especially some of the stories from the front.Jay
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this 1922 New Improved was a personal gift with the King C Gillette signature in the case. The guarantee card was signed by Mr. Gillette personally. Maybe the 1908 signed Single Rings are a early personal gift. 
- Thread starter
- #93
this 1922 New Improved was a personal gift with the King C Gillette signature in the case. The guarantee card was signed by Mr. Gillette personally. Maybe the 1908 signed Single Rings are a early personal gift.
Yeah, I think that is exactly the style Jay is saying they would have been if they were, indeed, gift sets. I am still not convinced that we can rely on their current cases being the correct ones. It would have been just too easy to find a used case a "signature" single ring that had lost it's case. It would help if there were more examples of signature single rings with cases.
this 1922 New Improved was a personal gift with the King C Gillette signature in the case. The guarantee card was signed by Mr. Gillette personally. Maybe the 1908 signed Single Rings are a early personal gift.
That actually helps Achim! I had it in my head that if he gave away razors for presentation they would be the fancier models. Since thats pretty much a base model New Improved it shows that he gave away, at least some, low end models.
Thanks!
Jay
- Thread starter
- #95
You know, there is also no mention at all in that article of the Gillette script logo used in Standard Sets and in advertising of the time. Perhaps KCG chose the script logo from the artists works, at the same time that he approved the diamond trademark. Perhaps he decided to use it as an alternative, simpler logo. Maybe it was simpler for the printers to use than the diamond logo on some things like print ads and silk screens for the standard sets. I am just thinking out loud...
Ironhammer I am sad to report that I have made it through all the 1918 US Gillette Blade newsletters with nary a clue more. I perused one copy of the Canadian version and they only seem to mention things concerning the Canadian plant. It looks like there are only 3-4 issues so I will try to get through them tonight.
I probably won't work on this to much this weekend as its going to be a 100* here this weekend and so I will be languishing away on the beach,beer in hand, along the Colorado river.
As time permits I will start the university library search to see if we can find any more digitized records like this. You did spur me with that memoir comment so I may start with some southern California universities since thats where KCG lived untill his death.
Jay
I probably won't work on this to much this weekend as its going to be a 100* here this weekend and so I will be languishing away on the beach,beer in hand, along the Colorado river
. As time permits I will start the university library search to see if we can find any more digitized records like this. You did spur me with that memoir comment so I may start with some southern California universities since thats where KCG lived untill his death.
Jay
Found a reference to a "Silver Jubilee Issue" of the Gillette Blade on their 25th anniversary. It appears to be a 1901-1926 retrospective and might have some interesting information if anyone's near any of the listed libraries.
http://www.worldcat.org/title/gille...er-28-1926/oclc/5691132&referer=brief_results
http://www.worldcat.org/title/gille...er-28-1926/oclc/5691132&referer=brief_results
If you guys keep this research up (especially you Jay), I'm expecting a book out of you. Or a least a great Wiki addition (now I'm looking at you Todd). 
Or a least a great Wiki addition (now I'm looking at you Todd). - Thread starter
- #99
If you guys keep this research up (especially you Jay), I'm expecting a book out of you.
Hey, if we solve this riddle, it will be huge! I'll do a nice, complete Wiki writeup for the whole world to use as a reference!
DOH!!
And here I thought I had forund something so interesting! The digitizations have been at (Oops- A Banned Vendor) the whole time. Damn you razor gods!
Jay
And here I thought I had forund something so interesting! The digitizations have been at (Oops- A Banned Vendor) the whole time. Damn you razor gods
!Jay
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