Or, supplier calls up from Indonesia and says: "Hey, we can supply pre-made soap noodles to you really cheap. We can make it all right here now. Yes, of course, it's based on palm oil, we've got plenty of palm oil here. We're adding value by making the soap here in our state-of-the-art sweatshop. There's no need to pay for those expensive first-world wages and benefits any more."
The “other” components in the reformulated MWF shaving soap.
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Or, supplier calls up from Indonesia and says: "Hey, we can supply pre-made soap noodles to you really cheap. We can make it all right here now. Yes, of course, it's based on palm oil, we've got plenty of palm oil here. We're adding value by making the soap here in our state-of-the-art sweatshop. There's no need to pay for those expensive first-world wages and benefits any more."
That's possible, but the fact they are keeping tallow in their hand soap tells me they recognize it's a valuable ingredient. I am just guessing, so nothing I am saying is based on actual knowledge.
Just give it some time. Maybe they can't switch everything over all at once. Yes, I can be cynical.
Probably they get their handsoap base from a different supplier. Or, they have a ton of it in stock so they don't need to worry about it at the moment.Just give it some time. Maybe they can't switch everything over all at once. Yes, I can be cynical.
Nice scenario. Here's what most of us probably think happened:
MWF Purchasing "Hey, Giant Soap noodle manufacturer A, we'd like to order a whole bunch of our regular shave soap base. Load us up."
Giant Soap noodle manufacturer A "No problem. By the way, we aren't offering your regular soap base any longer since it uses grade 3 tallow, but we have soap base B, that's vegan for £.30 less per puck, or we have one that is tallow, but because it uses grade 1 tallow, your cost will go up £1 per puck."
MWF Purchasing "What's the difference?"
Giant Soap noodle manufacturer A "Nothing much. Just substituting some ingredients. The customers probably won't even notice if you go with the vegan formula. They might even be happier."
MWF Purchasing (nervously checking on hand stock versus undelivered customer orders) "What ingredients?"
Giant Soap noodle manufacturer A "We dropped Tallow. Substituted palm. Barely an inconvenience. Your customers won't notice a thing. Who reads product labels?"
MWF Purchasing (breaking out into a sweat) "Let me call you right back."
Their hand and bath soaps are made by a different company than the shave soap.
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It also might be an indication where MWF’s priorities lie.
I wonder a) whether MWF is even aware that for us fussy shavers the list of ingredients in MWF shaving soap is of considerable interest and b) whether buyers of other MWF products pay much attention to ingredients other than wool fat.
MWF chose to remove the tallow from the shaving soap, but kept it for other products.
I doubt that it would have been impossible for MWF to find a supplier of a quality soap base with tallow or at least with less problematic ingredients than palm oil and palm kernel oil. I also would have thought that if MWF wanted to remove tallow, for cost reasons or otherwise, they would have started with other products than their shaving soap first.
But they don’t specify any ingredients except wool fat on their website and just state:
“We guarantee only the very highest quality of ingredients, including the purest and most preservative free wool fat, are used in the production of Mitchell’s Wool Fat Soap products.”
In other words, MWF is a one-trick pony and anything other than wool fat (a.k.a. lanolin) is secondary to them.
They may be sitting in West Yorkshire, gaze in wonderment at their grazing sheep, scratch their heads and wonder what all this entirely unexpected kerfuffle from a small group of shaving enthusiasts is all about…
B.
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They may be sitting in West Yorkshire, gaze in wonderment at their grazing sheep, scratch their heads and wonder what all this entirely unexpected kerfuffle from a small group of shaving enthusiasts is all about…
Honestly, it would be great to see some engagement from them on the topic. I can't believe that they are unaware of the discussion that's taking place and it wouldn't surprise me if Paul from Connaught's has already mentioned to them that this isn't going to be a popular move with his customer base!
So did anyone ever figure out what the problematic preservative in the old MWF soap was, that led to it's reformulation? I know the broad assumption was tetrasodium EDTA, but... that stuff is in the new formula soap too. I've cross referenced and removed any ingredients that were also in the new formula.
That gives us some soap stuff.
Sodium Tallowate
Potassium Cocoate
Some smelly stuff. These are generally thought of as being additional elements of the MWF fragrance.
Alpha-Isomethyl Ionone
This makes a flowery scent, with a Violet undertone.
Hexyl Cinnamal
Adds a Jasmine like odor.
Linalool
Floral, musky, with a hint of spice. A cheap "lavender" substitute.
Hydroxycitronellal
Produces a scent similar to Lilac, Lily, and Lily of the Valley.
Preservatives, Fillers, and Chelators?
Sodium Gluconate
A water softener, pH balancer, and foaming agent.
Sodium Silicate
Sodium silicate is an odd one to find in a shaving soap. It can alter the pH balance of the soap, it's a water softener, and it bulks soaps up without adding soap.
Sodium silicate is capable of precipitating calcium and magnesium present in water, and thus reduces hardness of water.
It's also a cheap additive that replaces soap with filler.
Magnesium Sulphate
Another odd additive you wouldn't normally find in shaving soap. Perhaps it acts as a binder for the lanolin? It's also an emulsifier.
That gives us some soap stuff.
Sodium Tallowate
Potassium Cocoate
Some smelly stuff. These are generally thought of as being additional elements of the MWF fragrance.
Alpha-Isomethyl Ionone
This makes a flowery scent, with a Violet undertone.
Hexyl Cinnamal
Adds a Jasmine like odor.
Linalool
Floral, musky, with a hint of spice. A cheap "lavender" substitute.
Hydroxycitronellal
Produces a scent similar to Lilac, Lily, and Lily of the Valley.
Preservatives, Fillers, and Chelators?
Sodium Gluconate
A water softener, pH balancer, and foaming agent.
Sodium Silicate
Sodium silicate is an odd one to find in a shaving soap. It can alter the pH balance of the soap, it's a water softener, and it bulks soaps up without adding soap.
Sodium silicate is capable of precipitating calcium and magnesium present in water, and thus reduces hardness of water.
It's also a cheap additive that replaces soap with filler.
Magnesium Sulphate
Another odd additive you wouldn't normally find in shaving soap. Perhaps it acts as a binder for the lanolin? It's also an emulsifier.
Or, we could get our "bio fuels" from deep underground and be done with this nonsense.
I've recently been able to crack MWF (thus promoting me to Ascended Shaver status, yay me) but the puck I obtained was pre-formulation. There's no problematic preservative in there: ordinary table salt might count as preservative, but that one's as old as time, so no problem there. Likely this is just another marketing tactic, as you are undoubtedly well aware that 'problematic preservative' has all consumers (save those with a background in chemistry) up in arms.
As for sodium gluconate and sodium silicate: the gluconate is a chelating agent, and the silicate is a thickening agent. You can find videos on Youtube showing the properties of water-sodium silicate mixtures. Anyone who uses MWF on a regular basis knows that its lather is, well, thicker than normal non-silicate containing soaps. I'd hazard that the silicate allows a shaver to use less soap in creating a lather, thus lowering the risk of skin irritation. But that would depend on individual skin qualities, of course.
In any case, as was written on the previous page, palm oil really is a tough customer to beat. The oil palm produces 4 times more oil in weight per surface area than any other known plant. If it could tolerate moderate climates, we wouldn't be growing sunflowers and rapeseed there at all. And finding a different and equally cheap source of saturated C₁₆ fatty acids is hard. I consider it a wasted opportunity for soap makers to indicate they obtain their palm oil from reputable sources. That would immediately remove the most pressing argument against the use of palm oil in their formulations. Perhaps in another decade or so.
Those really should remain where they are; or at the very least no longer be used as an energy source. I really can't see how the ethylene-based chemical industry can be replaced with difficult bio-friendly alternatives anytime soon, especially since ethylene-based chemistry accounts for but a fraction of total oil production. Perhaps once genetic manipulation of bacteria and yeasts has sufficiently advanced that the then old-fashioned approach is finally shut down.
Palm oil is the cheapest vegetable oil you can buy.
Beef tallow is one of the most expensive fats that you can buy.
They essentially replaced the most expensive ingredient in their Shave soap with one of the cheapest. And never offering to adjust the price.
Palmolive cream is one of the cheapest shaving products you can purchase and that’s primarily because the main ingredient is palm oil. I just can’t see people purchasing this new shave soap with those ingredients at that price.
Beef tallow is one of the most expensive fats that you can buy.
They essentially replaced the most expensive ingredient in their Shave soap with one of the cheapest. And never offering to adjust the price.
Palmolive cream is one of the cheapest shaving products you can purchase and that’s primarily because the main ingredient is palm oil. I just can’t see people purchasing this new shave soap with those ingredients at that price.
You joke, but probably close to the truth. These companies do anything to save a dollar.
If they had legitimately substituted palm oil for tallow, and dropped the price to reflect the change, I would not have as much issue with it. Just seems like trying to gouge the customer. People unsuspecting will buy the soap believing it’s the same product with the great reputation.
