Steaming a knot loose

[GordyN]

I've got a Vulvix with a pure Badger knot that has no backbone, I want to replace the knot and use the same handle, which option would be best to remove the knot? I was going with the steam method, wondering if the vulvix handle will be able to "handle" the heat and remain intact, anyone that has done this with a vulvix handle would like to know how it turned out.

I've done a few re-knots on Vulfix handles and while you can steam them, just don't! The material softens through steaming and you can easily tear it......I mean REALLY easily!
Best to cut the bristles just above the base of the knot and remove the knot with a Dremel tool or similar. There are a few specific bits you can use. They are great for sanding the hole out to get rid of all the adhesive. Be sure to wear a dust mask though!

 

[California Cajun]

I'm sure this is old news to many of you. Steam works great for removing a knot that's been epoxied in. Their are a number of youtube videos on how to do this.

This summer I ordered a custom brush. The handle is magnificent. The knot is not. I have been trying synthetic knots all summer and love the latest generation. Ordered my custom handle with a new generation syn knot and hate the thing. Worst of all, their is a glue stalagmite sticking up from the glue bump. Its sharp and scratched me one too many times. I was going to send the handle back to the gentleman that turned it for me, but wasn't sure exactly what I was going to use for a knot so I decided to remove the crummy synthetic knot myself. Gulp. It was an expensive handle.

Boiled 3 cups of water in a large kettle. Placed the brush in a glass bowl, put the bowl in the boiling water, covered, and let it simmer for 30 minutes. Carefully removed the brush, held the handle firmly (wearing gloves...its hot) twisted and pulled on the knot, and it popped right out. No mess, no damage to the custom handle.

I haven't decided on what knot I will be putting in the custom handle, but the job of removing the old knot was so clean that its going to be a piece of cake to get this beautiful handle back into service.

That's terrific. I have drilled out all my knots and it's a lot of work.

I would suspect, however, that no method is 100% infallable. Just about everything has a degree of risk.

 

[Jopete]

I've done a few re-knots on Vulfix handles and while you can steam them, just don't! The material softens through steaming and you can easily tear it......I mean REALLY easily!
Best to cut the bristles just above the base of the knot and remove the knot with a Dremel tool or similar. There are a few specific bits you can use. They are great for sanding the hole out to get rid of all the adhesive. Be sure to wear a dust mask though!

Thank you! My Dremel is currently not working properly, I can't seem to attach any type of dremel bits, the collet doesn't tighten enough to hold any of the Dremel tools, I'm not sure which part to replace, I do have a larger size kyobi drill that holds smaller drill bits, so basically I just need to cut the bristles and drill through it to remove the knot?
Excuse my ignorance I have never tried removing bristles from any brush before.

 

[GordyN]

Thank you! My Dremel is currently not working properly, I can't seem to attach any type of dremel bits, the collet doesn't tighten enough to hold any of the Dremel tools, I'm not sure which part to replace, I do have a larger size kyobi drill that holds smaller drill bits, so basically I just need to cut the bristles and drill through it to remove the knot?
Excuse my ignorance I have never tried removing bristles from any brush before.

It sounds like you need a new collet, not hard to get. I use a single edge blade to slice through the bristles. Drill some holes more towards the centre of the knot and use a pair of radio/long nose pliers to pull it out bit by bit. I don't know what else to suggest to sand the hole if needs be. This is where the Dremel comes in really handy. Just go slow and more careful the closer you get to the edge. If you need any more advice, just shout or even PM me.

 

[ddillas]

I think one needs to weigh the potential damage against what one is trying to accomplish. I personally steamed a synthetic knot out of a Whipped Dog handle with the express intention of resetting it at a different loft and had little or no problems. But this was a $20 brush. Not sure if I would try this with an expensive badger knot or a custom or vintage handle that could not easily be repaired or replaced.

Oh.. I had a Larry set a 20mm synthetic at a -5 depth. I didn't care for it so I steamed the knot out, cleaned the bore, epoxied in two nickels then reset the knot at the new depth with good success.

 

[Badger in the Sun]

While crossing my fingers, I tried the steaming method on an acrylic handle today. It worked great. The handle had a TGN 2-band held with epoxy. After 15 minutes of steaming, it came out easily.

Both handle and knot seem perfectly fine.

 

[CigarSmoka]

@Badger in the Sun Thank you sir! I've been wondering how it would hold up under steaming. True acrylic (Lucite, etc) melts at 320F but I didn't know if boiling or steam would affect it to the point of being pliable or losing its shape. I'm sure the temp is different for polyester or urethane resins (the two most common for home casting) but still this is good info. Do you happen to know for certain the type of resin your brush was made from? ie a true acrylic or different type of resin

 

[Badger in the Sun]

@CigarSmoka, I'm so glad you responded. After your post I realized I'm not actually 100% sure my brush is acrylic. I assumed it was, which was stupid of me.

It is a custom beehive handle made by ShaverJoe. I assumed that he, like Rudy Vey and other brush makers, use acrylic resin. But it could be something else. ShaverJoe no longer makes brushes, so I can't check his site.

I'm going to try to edit my previous post to make it clear that I don't know what type of resin it is. I'd hate for someone to ruin a handle because of my sage wisdom! Below are photos of the handle in question.

 

[CigarSmoka]

@Badger in the Sun Nice looking brush! It's pretty much impossible to tell from just looking at it, but I'm leaning towards it being acrylic mainly because it looks similar in a few ways to acrylic blanks I've seen, and it doesn't appear to be a homemade job. The way the colors are well defined even though they're mixed is indicative of a manufactured blank. Making true acrylic blanks can only be done in an industrial setting (but by no means does that mean a huge manufacturing plant) so the only way to get acrylic blanks is to buy them, they just can't be made at home. To make matters worse, I highly suspect some blanks being sold as acrylic aren't true acrylic at all but some other resin. Regardless, you have a nice brush there and steaming the old knot out didn't cause any problems, and that's all that matters!

 

[gwsmallwood]

Definitely don't steam the cheap VDH handles. The top layer of plastic started to de-laminate on mine. I like the handle shape, so I used it anyway. At least it's unique...

 

[CigarSmoka]

Live and learn @gwsmallwood !

 

[gwsmallwood]

Live and learn @gwsmallwood !

Ugly as it is, it might just be my new favorite face lathering brush. A bit too small for head shaving, but perfect for the neck.

 

[jmudrick]

Today I steamed the knot out of a new Omega Pro 48 with no damage to knot or handle. I double wrapped the bristles in foil to protect them. Took about 12 minutes.

 

[Vladislav]

Can l use this method to remove the knot on a Semogue 1305? I'm asking because the knot is "secured" with a metal ring. Basically l'd like to remove the knot because it's shot, drill the handle from 22 to 24mm and fit in a Whipped dog silvertip. I don't quite like Larry's handles, this Semogue kinda grew on me. Is this at all possible?

 

[gwsmallwood]

Can l use this method to remove the knot on a Semogue 1305? I'm asking because the knot is "secured" with a metal ring. Basically l'd like to remove the knot because it's shot, drill the handle from 22 to 24mm and fit in a Whipped dog silvertip. I don't quite like Larry's handles, this Semogue kinda grew on me. Is this at all possible?

Possible, yes, but I can tell you from experience that steaming out a knot will always carry the risk of ruining the handle. Too much heat, which isn't all that easy to control when steaming, and the resin can warp. My experience with those Semogues handles is that they have a tendency to wear out rather quickly. Why not just pick up a new handle. Quite a few Etsy vendors with great prices these days, or if you just want something inexpensive, but different from Larry's offerings, check out TGN.

 

[Bratwurst]

Just did it on my RazoRock 400 Silver. Ten minutes of steam and the knot did kome out after I twisted and pulled it, no big deal.
I guess the aluminium handle tranferd the heat to the glue the best way possible.

 

[Navitimer]

I have a Leonidam handle that's set at 54mm and it was just too floppy for me.I went all or nothing and it worked out. Wrapped the handle and the upper part of the brush in a thin plastic bag and steamed it at 70 degrees centigrade for 25 minuted, one small twist and it was out. It looks like nothing got damaged except the epoxy and I'm looking forward to set it a bit deeper now. However I would not recommend this approach in a pan. I did it in a steamer which controls the temperature accurately to one degree.

 

[SliceOfLife]

I've tried it on about a half dozen vintage brushes.


Worked for 1 to give me a clean removal of the knot
Worked for 1 to completely dissolve the knot so I could pull all the hair out in clumps

The rest it failed. No handles were destroyed, but several were discolored (even butterscotching turned patchy)... and glue was unaffected.

Depends on the glue it seems, but at least the majority it's not much help.