R
romsitsa
Thanks Glenn, wonder what caused the design change, ergonomic issues?
Adam
Adam
Gillette Adustables - Double Edge Razors: A Comprehensive Photo
- Thread starter GlennConti
- Start date
Great collection sir. You should be and must be -- proud!
- Thread starter
- #43
Thanks Jake. I appreciate your collection too...
For anyone interested I just bought a copy of this ad and some other adjustables ads too. I haven't seen an Aristocrat Slim ad so I jumped on this one. Prices are Australian dollars.
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that is one fine looking family photo
Did we mention, @GlennConti that you're now the chairman of our little club?
Order of Gillette Adjustables
Order of Gillette Adjustables
- Thread starter
- #46
Ha ha.. Nerd Alert!! Look at what I just added to my website. Anyone that can stomach reading it, I will greatly appreciate comments:
Classifying the Gillette Adjustable Razors: A Scientific Taxonomy.
Here is the complete family of Gillette Adjustable double edge razors. There are 18 different types or models in all. Each is unique in a special way. There are 3 major characteristics used to classify these razors in the family.
1) PLATING.The first characteristic is the type of plating or coating used by Gillette in the factory. There were two basic types; either nickel or gold but there is a sub-type. I have put the black painted 1-5 position Bottom Dial razor (#6) in a category of its own because originally this black paint coating was applied by Gillette at the factory. Please also note the 1-9 position Bottom Dial (#8) shown in the picture was originally plated in Nickel by the factory. So please do not be confused. The example shown in the photo was replated and restored with an aftermarket 24 karat gold plating but again was originally Nickel plated from the factory so that is how I have listed it. Again razor #8 was originally nickel plated but I didn't have an example of an original nickel plated Bottom Dial so I used a replated version for the photo. As far as I know there is no such thing as a from the factory "Gold 1-9 Position Bottom Dial".
2) MAX ADJUSTER POSITION.The second characteristic is the marked adjuster positions. All of the adjustables have 9 distinct adjustment positions; either 1 , . ,3 , . ,5 , . ,7 , . ,9 with a maximum indicated position of 9 or 9 distinct adjustment positions 1, . ,2 , . , 3 , . , 4 , . , 5 with a maximum indicated position of 5. I have listed them as either a 1-9 position or a 1-5 position. So in this category, there are two distinct types.
3) BILL OF MATERIALS (BOM)/MODEL.The third characteristic is generally the model name as identified by Gillette or the common slang name given to that model. If the manufacturing parts Bill of Materials was unique to that model then the razor got its own type. For example, the Gillette Aristocrat Slim (#13) has the same Bill of Materials as the more common nickel plated Standard Slim (#12) but because Gillette gave them separate names, they each are classified by me as a separate type. There are three different bill of material types of Toggles. The first is the 1-5 gold (#1) and the 1-5 nickel (#2). These each have the same parts Bill of Materials but are distinguished by their plating type. The second BOM type of Toggle is the "Chrome" Toggle type. I believe Joachim Duwe aka Mr-Razor, a great collector in Germany, first used this name to describe this BOM type. However it is a bit of a misnomer in that both razor #3 and razor #4 share the same BOM but there is indeed a gold plated version. The gold plated version of the "Chrome" toggle was discovered by Stan Hickam at AboveTheTie and was subsequently partially disassembled by master razor mechanic Chris Smith aka Captain Murphy so that he could indeed validate that the internal parts were plated in gold at the factory. The third and final toggle BOM type is the Gold 1-9 Position Standard Toggle (#5). No nickel version of this BOM type exists as far as I know. The Nickel 1-9 Position Red Dot Fatboy (#9) is a BOM type that does not have a gold plated version. The Nickel 1-9 Position Standard Fatboy (#10) has a different BOM than its cousin the Gold 1-9 Position Executive Fatboy (#11); the knurling on the TTO knob is different on each. The Standard Fatboy has a cross hatch knurling TTO knob and the Executive Fatboy has a vertical and horizontal knurling TTO knob.
One final note on the classification system. There are weird anomalous razor examples that have made it out into the hands of collectors. If there are strange stamping examples, they did not get their own category. For each of the different types they may have been produced for many years; each having the same BOM but different date code stampings; these are minor differences in my opinion. For example, I have an F-4 Red Dot Fatboy! This is a unique razor that I obtained from the great collector Tom Owens, but it did not get it's own standing in the classification system because it's BOM is identical to the D-1 Red Dot Fatboy. As another example there were minor changes to the Standard Fatboy such as the removal of the service notches on the cap at the bottom of the TTO knob. I do not consider that a major change. So, I don't have multiple different Standard Fatboys in the photo which are slightly different. Also, Tom Owens has a Standard Slim that was built by Gillette with a Super Adjustable metal base plate. There exist a couple examples of this razor sub-type. To me this was not enough of a difference to get it's own place in the taxonomy and because it wasn't a separate model of Gillette razor. Similarly this is why the Executive Fatboys with Standard Fatboy TTO knobs did not get their own place in the system. Others may differ with me on that decision but it is what it is.
nice collection and maybe you should submit that picture to a sticky?
Beautiful, just beautiful! I will be immersing myself in your site... Now where are the super speeds? 
- Thread starter
- #49
Beautiful, just beautiful! I will be immersing myself in your site... Now where are the super speeds?
Ha... A guy has to pick his poison. So many razors so little time. I had to concentrate on one genre. But, to me the Gillette Adjustables are the BEST! Almost no other razor type commands the price they do on eBay.
Sure - but conquer one mountain, head for the next...
I think you picked right, It's an amazing collection. Also, it is confirmation than the Super Adjustable existed in H1 '87 -- Still hunting for one...
- Thread starter
- #51
Thank you sir! I have all sorts of sneaky saved searches set up on eBay. I'm just waiting for my emails.
- Thread starter
- #52
Hey Adam... So, I have been thinking about this. The 1-5 Serial Toggle lever is asymmetrical; one side for rinsing the blade and the other side for changing the blade. This may have been costly produce or less reliable in daily use? I am not sure, but it is interesting to think about. They had three versions of Toggle levers and they ultimately dropped the lever design altogether for a TTO knob. They were happy with the TTO knob for forever. I will keep my ear to the ground.
Glenn, I am an acquisitor, not a collector, but I did bookmark your site when you first dropped it. Christmas of '58 I didn't even shave yet but I wanted the 195 Adjustable (Fatboy D4, I guess). My parents laughed and we all moved on. I bought a brand new L1 Slim when I was in college and used it as my daily driver for the next 48 years.
Your site, and your contributions to B&B like this one, keep shining my old (but young) memories. I am basking in the glow; thank you!
Tom
Your site, and your contributions to B&B like this one, keep shining my old (but young) memories. I am basking in the glow; thank you!
Tom
*Bump* This deserves to be seen.
Hi,
My Dad had an early 1-5 toggle that had a nasty tendency to pop the lever whilst shaving, which would lead to a nasty cut. I think I now know why, and that directly would lead to a redesign if it were happening to other units.....
Stan
My Dad had an early 1-5 toggle that had a nasty tendency to pop the lever whilst shaving, which would lead to a nasty cut. I think I now know why, and that directly would lead to a redesign if it were happening to other units.....
Stan
- Thread starter
- #56
Hey Stan, I've read the story how your father beat it with a hammer so no one would use the thing; it was so dangerous. Do you think that was a one-off assembly problem or indicative of a more general problem with the design? Yes they did redesign the lever three times before dumping it for a TTO, but they did go to production with the thing. Just wondering if the design was just impractical to assemble or just most people had a problem with it. I have only shaved with a 1-5 Position Toggle once and it worked great - but who knows - one is not a sample size.
Hi,
Exactly: One is a terrible sample size! And, that was all we had, too. And, Dad just didn't want *me* to be tempted to use that one. At, what?, 16 or 17 years old. He was plenty content to toss it in the back of a drawer and forget about it.
And, I wasn't going to tell about his method of Adjustment again. That part causes a lot of pain!
When I read your description of the way the very first ones operate, and how they changed it, then changed it yet again, something clicked. I know all too well how new ways of doing things tend to, well, backfire. And, I suddenly saw in my mind's eye a meeting where they were all sitting around discussing how some units tended to pop open a tad too easily.
Redesigns of early units tend to be for reasons like that. The 'gotchas' as I refer to them. Later redesigns tend to be for cost reduction reasons. Easier to put together. Parts count reductions. Lower cost parts incorporation. Things like that.
Stan
Exactly: One is a terrible sample size! And, that was all we had, too. And, Dad just didn't want *me* to be tempted to use that one. At, what?, 16 or 17 years old. He was plenty content to toss it in the back of a drawer and forget about it.
And, I wasn't going to tell about his method of Adjustment again. That part causes a lot of pain!
When I read your description of the way the very first ones operate, and how they changed it, then changed it yet again, something clicked. I know all too well how new ways of doing things tend to, well, backfire. And, I suddenly saw in my mind's eye a meeting where they were all sitting around discussing how some units tended to pop open a tad too easily.
Redesigns of early units tend to be for reasons like that. The 'gotchas' as I refer to them. Later redesigns tend to be for cost reduction reasons. Easier to put together. Parts count reductions. Lower cost parts incorporation. Things like that.
Stan
Hi,
Glenn, I have a question which I would love to find the answer out for myself, but that is pretty unlikely. You would know, so.....
With a Bottom Dial, do you find that the placement of that dial to be of assistance during a shave, or a hindrance?
I can envision where it might make for a comfortable grip *and* can also envision where it might well be too far up the handle and actually be in the way....
The reason why I will probably never be able to answer that one myself I suspect we all can envision!
Stan
Glenn, I have a question which I would love to find the answer out for myself, but that is pretty unlikely. You would know, so.....
With a Bottom Dial, do you find that the placement of that dial to be of assistance during a shave, or a hindrance?
I can envision where it might make for a comfortable grip *and* can also envision where it might well be too far up the handle and actually be in the way....
The reason why I will probably never be able to answer that one myself I suspect we all can envision!
Stan
- Thread starter
- #59
Hi,
Glenn, I have a question which I would love to find the answer out for myself, but that is pretty unlikely. You would know, so.....
With a Bottom Dial, do you find that the placement of that dial to be of assistance during a shave, or a hindrance?
I can envision where it might make for a comfortable grip *and* can also envision where it might well be too far up the handle and actually be in the way....
The reason why I will probably never be able to answer that one myself I suspect we all can envision!
Stan
Hey Stan, I always grip my razors about 60% of the way down the handle from the base plate on the head. Some guys like to steady the razor with a finger on the bottom of it; except for a Super-109 which is kind of long to do that. I never needed any longer of a handle because of the way I grip. I like a Fatboy or Super-84 because they are smaller. The Bottom Dial doesn't figure into it for me or bother me one way or another.
Never say never Stan; you may get a Bottom Dial one way or another. Lucky find or monetary windfall. When I first became aware of these they were about $800 w/o a case. The last one on the bay went for like $3000 with out a case. A Bottom Dial case only went on the bay for $600 not too long ago and it was partially damaged. So, if things keep trending that way, it might not be a bad way to spend a monetary windfall. But you never know - it's a gamble - or, it's an investment. Best way to get one is to find it in an out of the way vintage shop or such for like $30!!!
Ooh. All those adjustables. Nice.
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