Truefitt & Hill Customer Service Concerns

[zoom]

I'm with these fellers.

I bought this kit, got great customer service ad am extremely pleased with the transaction.

Not only did they offer a coupon code to the forum members, they accepted it on essentially a clearance item. In case you're not counting, you got the entire kit for less than the price of the EDT and Cream shipped. Free ASB, brush and bag.

They've offered to make it right, and now this thread has turned into a witch hunt by newer members. You don't see GFT or TOBS posting here and offering 1)a really nice discount 2)a manager posting to try to fix a bad transaction, and you definitely won't see it with this type of behavior.

/$.02

I'm with these guys too. I ordered the set in question last week. The description of the kit said pure badger. I looked under the brush section and saw it was the cheapest brush they had. I ordered it any way because the price was good, especially after the BB discount, and I needed a brush to get me started. The dopp kit was a nice extra too. I was not buying the kit for a nice brush and the dopp kit, though.

Now, I wouldn't mind getting a nicer brush, but what's to distinguish me, who knew what he was getting, from the others who looked at the other page with a nicer brush in the description? Should we all get them?

Obviously, I have no personal reason to be dissatisfied. As for how they treated others, I don't think their offer for a refund and shipping is extraordinary, but I think it's nothing to be mad about.

By the way, I was pretty stoked that I received the set the day after I ordered it and it had to cross state lines. That's fast service.

 

[bro-ham]

To make a long story short, I need my money now and prefer to not wait over a week for the box to be shipped to T&H and then wait for my money to be refunded. I've therefore decided to never use T&H again and just sell the items on B/S/T to recoup my costs.

Keep in mind, I'm not complaining about this. I'll probably break even fairly quickly on B&B by selling these items. I'm just advising anyone that may be interested in buying one of these sets so you know exactly what you'lll be getting. Regardless of whether it still turned out to be a good/fair deal money-wise, it's more of an integrity/honesty issue for me and I'd like fellow B&B members to be aware.

thanks

I am a bit confused; they offered to refund your money for the their mistake and your justified dis-satisfaction. They have also fixed the website after the problem was explained to them. It is better to be treated with exceptional customer service all the time and T&H did not deliver in this case. But your words and actions say it wasn't a big deal.

If they were trying to be crooks, or do a bait and switch, I don't think they would have offered your money back upon return of the stuff.

 

[mretzloff]

I'm with these fellers.

I bought this kit, got great customer service ad am extremely pleased with the transaction.

Not only did they offer a coupon code to the forum members, they accepted it on essentially a clearance item. In case you're not counting, you got the entire kit for less than the price of the EDT and Cream shipped. Free ASB, brush and bag.

They've offered to make it right, and now this thread has turned into a witch hunt by newer members. You don't see GFT or TOBS posting here and offering 1)a really nice discount 2)a manager posting to try to fix a bad transaction, and you definitely won't see it with this type of behavior.

/$.02

You're missing the point.

What T&H did is fraud. They advertised a product but sent a completely different one. That is not right, regardless of the "deal" he got. Even with this "deal", I bet T&H still has a huge profit margin.

They offered to make it right? No, they did not. T&H merely offered a refund. That is not enough. If you bought a diamond ring for your wife but it turned out to just be CZ stone, would a refund be enough for you? I doubt it.

What do you mean you don't see TOBS or GFT here? The reason they're not here is because they don't do stupid things like this. TOBS and GFT rely on honest business practices. They don't have to be sleazy to make a living.

In my opinion, a full refund and being able to keep the kit is the least T&H could do.

 

[mretzloff]

I am a bit confused; they offered to refund your money for the their mistake and your justified dis-satisfaction. They have also fixed the website after the problem was explained to them. It is better to be treated with exceptional customer service all the time and T&H did not deliver in this case. But your words and actions say it wasn't a big deal.

If they were trying to be crooks, or do a bait and switch, I don't think they would have offered your money back upon return of the stuff.

They only offered a refund because they got busted. If Bernie Madoff had offered a "refund" after he got busted, would that have been ok?

Also, T&H just changed the website so no one can prove they ever advertised it incorrectly.

 

[gollum83]

That doesn't negate the fact that they clearly shipped a different and inferior brush to they buyer rather than the one pictured (still) and described (conveniently changed since this blew up) in the ad.

Under Illinois law, that is ILLEGAL! Period. End of discussion. We do still have consumer protection laws in this country.

Merely offering the cheapest/minimal route out of this debacle (i.e. ship it back to us, and we'll give your money back so we can rip off some other unsuspecting consumer with the kit) is not satisfactory. Exchanging for the brush that was advertised (promised) in the first place is the only satisfactory out in my opinion.

FWIW, I don't have a problem with the dop kit. It clearly was not presented as the more expensive version, and I think it is fine value for what I paid. The brush is a frickin' toy.

They admitted to the mistake and have offered to deal with the entire problem including a full refund and return of the merchandise free of charge. Seems to me they solved the issue in a timely and fair fashion. Hardly any reason to make a legal issue out of this.

Finally if you are truly that displeased, don't purchase anything from them ever again. End of discussion as far as I am concerned.

 

[mretzloff]

They admitted to the mistake and have offered to deal with the entire problem including a full refund and return of the merchandise free of charge. Seems to me they solved the issue in a timely and fair fashion. Hardly any reason to make a legal issue out of this.

Finally if you are truly that displeased, don't purchase anything from them ever again. End of discussion as far as I am concerned.

Offering a refund does not negate the fact that what they did is a crime (at least in the US). A simple refund sends the message they only care about themselves. If they cared about keeping customers, they would go the great lengths to solve this (e.g. refund and allowing the OP to keep the kit).

 

[gollum83]

You're missing the point.

What T&H did is fraud. They advertised a product but sent a completely different one. That is not right, regardless of the "deal" he got. Even with this "deal", I bet T&H still has a huge profit margin.

Do you have access to their finances? I certainly don't. Fact of the matter is that unless any of us does, we can't make any assumptions about their profit margins.

They offered to make it right? No, they did not. T&H merely offered a refund. That is not enough. If you bought a diamond ring for your wife but it turned out to just be CZ stone, would a refund be enough for you? I doubt it.

If it was an honest mistake, yes a full refund would be enough. Beyond that, I wouldn't take any other action other than not shopping at that jeweler ever again. Seems to me some of you are convinced that T&H are out to get you. If you're that displeased, don't buy any of their products. Why turn this into a hanging offense?

What do you mean you don't see TOBS or GFT here? The reason they're not here is because they don't do stupid things like this. TOBS and GFT rely on honest business practices. They don't have to be sleazy to make a living.

In my opinion, a full refund and being able to keep the kit is the least T&H could do.

A full refund plus keeping the kit? I have never heard of such thing. Let's leave my thoughts at that.

Offering a refund does not negate the fact that what they did is a crime (at least in the US). A simple refund sends the message they only care about themselves. If they cared about keeping customers, they would go the great lengths to solve this (e.g. refund and allowing the OP to keep the kit).

See my above response. Keep in mind they don't have to offer to cover shipping.

 

[mretzloff]

Do you have access to their finances? I certainly don't. Fact of the matter is that unless any of us does, we can't make any assumptions about their profit margins.



If it was an honest mistake, yes a full refund would be enough. Beyond that, I wouldn't take any other action other than not shopping at that jeweler ever again. Seems to me some of you are convinced that T&H are out to get you. If you're that displeased, don't buy any of their products. Why turn this into a hanging offense?



A full refund plus keeping the kit? I have never heard of such thing. Let's leave my thoughts at that.



See my above response. Keep in mind they don't have to offer to cover shipping.

I do not think that T&H is out to get me, however, they knowingly sold advertised a kit with better contents and then sent a cheaper one. That is what gets me. They KNOWINGLY cheated several customers out of money.

I agree with you that they do not have to do anything, but if they care about their image, they should definitely do something. A simple refund is not enough considering they knowingly committed fraud. If the kit was mixed up by accident, a refund would suffice, but not in this case.

 

[Sam Harmon]

We can argue about this until we're blue in the face. Personally, I'm just going to let the Illinois Attorney General's office deal with it.

What they did--regardless of whether it was an incompetent mistake or cynical bait and switch--is, in all likelihood, against the law of the state where the transactions took place. Let the experts decide.

 

[mretzloff]

We can argue about this until we're blue in the face. Personally, I'm just going to let the Illinois Attorney General's office deal with it.

What they did--regardless of whether it was an incompetent mistake or cynical bait and switch--is, in all likelihood, against the law of the state where the transactions took place. Let the experts decide.

Let us know how it goes.

 

[gollum83]

I do not think that T&H is out to get me, however, they knowingly sold advertised a kit with better contents and then sent a cheaper one. That is what gets me. They KNOWINGLY cheated several customers out of money.

So they aren't out to get you, but they knowingly did this? This seems a bit contradictory to me.

Additionally, they seem to have changed the description for the kit since then. That in itself implies to me that all T&H is guilty of is doing a poor job of proofreading their website. That's all. This hardly constitutes fraud in my opinion.

I agree with you that they do not have to do anything, but if they care about their image, they should definitely do something. A simple refund is not enough considering they knowingly committed fraud. If the kit was mixed up by accident, a refund would suffice, but not in this case.

I'm sorry but none of this gives you the right to get a $140 kit for free. Again, let's leave it at that.

 

[zoom]

We can argue about this until we're blue in the face. Personally, I'm just going to let the Illinois Attorney General's office deal with it.

What they did--regardless of whether it was an incompetent mistake or cynical bait and switch--is, in all likelihood, against the law of the state where the transactions took place. Let the experts decide.

Let's keep some perspective.

I don't see the AG getting bent out of shape over whether a shaving brush is "pure badger" or "super badger", especially when a full refund has been offered and refused.



There are a lot more heinous crimes out there.

 

[mretzloff]

So they aren't out to get you, but they knowingly did this? This seems a bit contradictory to me.

Additionally, they seem to have changed the description for the kit since then. That in itself implies to me that all T&H is guilty of is doing a poor job of proofreading their website. That's all. This hardly constitutes fraud in my opinion.



I'm sorry but none of this gives you the right to get a $140 kit for free. Again, let's leave it at that.

You need to look at the other side of the story. T&H might have changed their website as to avoid any further accusations, essentially just to cover themselves.

The kit was $111, not $140. What gives T&H the right to rip a customer off? From what the customer service lady told the OP, it seems that T&H fully knew what was going on.

 

[Sam Harmon]

I'll also add that ignorance, ineptitude or "honest mistakes" are not legitimate defenses against committing a crime. They might be mitigating factors for sentencing but in no way excuse the original commission of the crime.

After reading the OP, I'll concede that there is a possibility that it could have been an honest mistake provided that T&H has a paper trail showing intent to change the website advertising to coincide with the sale--a change that, for whatever reason, was not carried through. We, however, don't know this. All we do know is that they advertised a different, superior product to what was shipped. That's the very textbook definition of bait and switch.

Again, in all likelihood a law was broken. Whether this was done through ignorance, "mistakes" or criminal intent is irrelevant.

 

[gollum83]

You need to look at the other side of the story. T&H might have changed their website as to avoid any further accusations, essentially just to cover themselves.

The kit was $111, not $140.

They list the kit as $140 on their site without the discount, so that's the price I cited. Sorry you paid less?

What gives T&H the right to rip a customer off?

Okay let me ask you this: Why would you insist on keep a product after being refunded that you're unhappy with? It doesn't make any sense to me.

From what the customer service lady told the OP, it seems that T&H fully knew what was going on.

First of all, you're basing this off the OP's word, not the actual communique. All you have to backup your claim is hearsay. Further more Todd Fisher's reply seemed rather cordial and understanding if you ask me.

 

[BarryR]

Why is demanding a vendor to follow through and deliver the item pictured and described in their advertisement and holding them accountable when they fail to do so a "witch hunt."

I'm sorry if I'm not willing to bow down to T&H over free return shipping. This is merely their attempting to weasel out of a bad--most likely ILLEGAL--mistake on their part at the bare minimum out of pocket cost.

If they were truly interested in making this right, they would ship the brushes advertised. Anything short of that is merely corporate damage control.

While I agree that it would be nice if they did a little something to compensate you for your bothers and annoyance, I agree with the above posters that if they're completely refunding your cost including return shipping, that's adequate. As far as it being illegal, that's probably a stretch and unless you're going to bring them to small claims court, it's academic.

Nothing I've read would stop me from ordering from them, particularly with the 20% B&B discount. If I were to order a set though, I'd probably check the specific contents with them.

 

[mretzloff]

Ok, I am done arguing. I am sorry that I am so wrong to expect good customer service. I am sorry that I am so wrong to expect companies to abide by the law. I am sorry that I am so wrong to not put up with sleazy sales tactics.

If you don't mind being ripped off, I cannot say anything.

 

[lsbrodsky]

Seems like our society is at a point in time where too many people want something for nothing. Maybe T&H should have posted a discount for a different quality kit than the standard offering. That would have eliminated any errors or misunderstandings and would have been an interesting test as to whether people wanted a lower price, lower quality or just a reduced price on the higher quality kit. I can't determine whether T&H was deliberate in anything that happened, but when anyone wants something for nothing as a remedy, that is way beyond what makes any sense. I would hope the Illinois AG, if this ever gets there, says this is all baloney and that prosecuting Illinois politicians is higher priority. Again and finally, I am satisfied with my transactions with this vendor and I am satisfied that they offered a fair remedy to those who had problems.
Larry

 

[mmack66]

I guess they don't know about CYA up at T&H customer service. For someone to have gotten on the phone and told the OP what he says they told him is incredible.

 

[TiltbackJack]

I think the only way to rectify this problem would have been for them to send the right items, not a refund. Now an entire shaving community is shown that their customer service is not very good IMO. They could have just sucked it up, sent the right stuff and this post probably would not have happened. Now they will lose customers due to this, myself included. Its a bigger hit to their finances in the long run to loose potential life-long customers than to make one situation right and maybe take a slight hit.