The MMA Thread

[Soopercat]

I'm not even excited to see Silva or BJ fight. I think that they are both going to totally dominate their opponents.

I hope Maia drops down to 170 after this fight. He is going to get hurt in this fight, he's to small, too slow and Anderson doesn't fear his ground game. If BJ didn't have a chin, I would say Frankie had a punchers chance. Well BJ has one of the best chins in the game. Frankie is going to take a sure beating also, even more so that Diego did.

I see your point, but my gut says that won't happen. Lesnar's too aggressive of a man. Most likely Carwin is too. These guys are both beasts. I don't think either will be cautious. I think they'll both be going for the fences at all times.

+1
I agree with you but Brock is a poser and is going to take a beating like he's never seen before. This is a fight, Brock's never been in a real one with some one his own size who can punch. Brock Lesnar is the heavy weight version of Kimbo Slice. Looks the part, but not ready for REAL competition. No disrespect to Randy.

Kind regards,

 

[xivex]

I see your point, but my gut says that won't happen. Lesnar's too aggressive of a man. Most likely Carwin is too. These guys are both beasts. I don't think either will be cautious. I think they'll both be going for the fences at all times.

Absolutely. I'm a fan of both guys to be honest. I agree it wont go 5 rounds. I doubt it will go past 2 truth be had. I see it ending in KO or GnP as someone else mentioned...most likely KO win for Carwin if it stays standing and GnP win for Lesnar if he can take Carwin down....which honestly, I dont think anyone can stop Lesnar's takedowns. He's humongous, he's freakishly strong, and he's a world class wrestler...division I NCAA national champion???? I mean come on. Carwin is going to get taken down. The question is, can Carwin stand back up or defend himself successfully on the ground, or even reverse it?

X

PS -- I wanna see the GSP vs. Anderson Silva superfight. They've been talking about it on and off for last 2 years. GSP has added more weight and I think he could move up within a year if he tried. That would be phenomenal. The best striker vs. the best wrestler.

 

[TimmyBoston]

I agree with you but Brock is a poser and is going to take a beating like he's never seen before. This is a fight, Brock's never been in a real one with some one his own size who can punch. Brock Lesnar is the heavy weight version of Kimbo Slice. Looks the part, but not ready for REAL competition. No disrespect to Randy.

Kind regards,

Total nonsense. Comparing Brock to Kimbo is an absolutely ridiculous comparison. Yes, Brock often does act like a jackass, but he has some of the best wrestling credentials in the UFC not to mention is a freak of an athlete. (As is Carwin)

 

[xivex]

Total nonsense. Comparing Brock to Kimbo is an absolutely ridiculous comparison. Yes, Brock often does act like a jackass, but he has some of the best wrestling credentials in the UFC not to mention is a freak of an athlete. (As is Carwin)

+1. Yeah, love him or hate him, Brock Lesnar is a friggin' beast of a man. He is not a creampie or cupcake. He has serious competitive training and skills.

 

[The Nid Hog]

Penn knocks out Edgar in the third,
Maia surprises Silva with a brutal kneebar,
Hughes taps to strikes.

You heard it here first!

 

[xivex]

Hughes taps to strikes.

You heard it here first!

LMAO!! I hate matt hughes, I'd love to see this. Like Tito did with Chuck Liddell! However, I still think he's probably better than Renzo Gracie (even though I like Renzo better). Though Renzo definitely has a home court advantage in this fight as Abu Dhabi is his 2nd backyard. Still though, both fighters are over the hill and out of their prime. ...not the best fight.

 

[Sullybob]

Penn knocks out Edgar in the third,
Maia surprises Silva with a brutal kneebar,
Hughes taps to strikes.

You heard it here first!

I think Penn finishes it before the third. I think it ends in the second.

Thats the only way Maia is going to beat Silva. But i think Silva takes it.

Hughes takes Renzo.

 

[Mejnoon]

Total nonsense. Comparing Brock to Kimbo is an absolutely ridiculous comparison. Yes, Brock often does act like a jackass, but he has some of the best wrestling credentials in the UFC not to mention is a freak of an athlete. (As is Carwin)

I think Brock is overrated and largely untested, and I think Kimbo is underrated (dude's boxing is on par with or better than most of the division, he just doesn't have much else to offer yet), but I agree that the comparison is unfair. Brock is physically dominant in a way Kimbo will never be, and his core skillset (wrestling) allows him to dictate where the fight takes place against most of his opponents...those two factors alone make him very hard to beat. I say he's overrated because I think he makes a lot of mistakes that can be exploited by fighters with certain skills, or by a guy with similar physicality like Carwin. In particular he doesn't change levels to take guys down...he charges in and bullies them down. If Carwin times his rush and answers with a right hand, Brock's night is over.

I hear a lot of people picking Renzo over Hughes...I hope they're right, but I don't think so. I don't like Hughes very much and he's declined a little bit of late, but he's still a top notch wrestler and grappler. I don't see Renzo getting top position, and I don't think he can submit Hughes from his guard. I think Renzo will do better than Royce did, but I don't think he'll win.

Maia can submit Silva, but I don't think he can take him down. That will be the story of this fight imo...unless he pulls off some Ryo Chonan style stuff he's gonna have a bad night. I just hope he realizes that looking like Thales Leites would be more embarrassing than looking like Forrest Griffin.

I like Edgar a lot, but I don't think he's got anything for Penn. I think they'll come out and box for a while...Edgar will get the worst of it and eventually try to shoot, but he'll get stuffed. I think if he gets frustrated or worn down Penn may drop him and either pound him out or submit him, but I could see it going the distance.

 

[xivex]

I think Brock is overrated and largely untested, and I think Kimbo is underrated (dude's boxing is on par with or better than most of the division, he just doesn't have much else to offer yet), but I agree that the comparison is unfair. Brock is physically dominant in a way Kimbo will never be, and his core skillset (wrestling) allows him to dictate where the fight takes place against most of his opponents...those two factors alone make him very hard to beat. I say he's overrated because I think he makes a lot of mistakes that can be exploited by fighters with certain skills, or by a guy with similar physicality like Carwin. In particular he doesn't change levels to take guys down...he charges in and bullies them down. If Carwin times his rush and answers with a right hand, Brock's night is over.

I hear a lot of people picking Renzo over Hughes...I hope they're right, but I don't think so. I don't like Hughes very much and he's declined a little bit of late, but he's still a top notch wrestler and grappler. I don't see Renzo getting top position, and I don't think he can submit Hughes from his guard. I think Renzo will do better than Royce did, but I don't think he'll win.

Maia can submit Silva, but I don't think he can take him down. That will be the story of this fight imo...unless he pulls off some Ryo Chonan style stuff he's gonna have a bad night. I just hope he realizes that looking like Thales Leites would be more embarrassing than looking like Forrest Griffin.

I like Edgar a lot, but I don't think he's got anything for Penn. I think they'll come out and box for a while...Edgar will get the worst of it and eventually try to shoot, but he'll get stuffed. I think if he gets frustrated or worn down Penn may drop him and either pound him out or submit him, but I could see it going the distance.

Interesting point about Lesnar not taking opponents down, and rather more just "bullying" them down. I tend to agree though I hadn't thought of it until now...but isn't the "bullying" just a kind of Greco-Roman wrestling takedown? Randy Couture does this type of thing a lot. I guess whatever works, bullying or smooth technical takedown. As long as Brock is on top, I think very few people stand a chance due to his strength.

Also, as good as Maia's jiu jitsu is, don't forget Anderson Silva's a BJJ black belt under the Nogeiura brothers. I dont' think Silva's BJJ compares to Maia's BJJ, but nontheless, the Spider knows how to handle himself on the ground. I still am convinced the Spider KO's maia in round 1 or 2. Anderson is just on an entirely different level than anyone else in MMA as a striker imho. Dude is just sick...the spider is the perfect nickname for him. Strikes coming from every angle and pinpoint accuracy.

Silva makes everyone he faces look horrible. That is the mark of a true champion.

 

[SRock]

I see your point, but my gut says that won't happen. Lesnar's too aggressive of a man. Most likely Carwin is too. These guys are both beasts. I don't think either will be cautious. I think they'll both be going for the fences at all times.

I agree Tim, I think this will be a war.

+1
I agree with you but Brock is a poser and is going to take a beating like he's never seen before. This is a fight, Brock's never been in a real one with some one his own size who can punch. Brock Lesnar is the heavy weight version of Kimbo Slice. Looks the part, but not ready for REAL competition. No disrespect to Randy.

Kind regards,

That might be the funniest thing in this thread. Is Brock new, yes! Has Brock been tested, Yes! He didn't fight Tomato Can Harry, he decimated Frank Mir, not once but twice. If it weren't for the fortunate heel hook Frank would have been destroyed. Frank Mir is a respectable fighter. I do agree that Brock is likely a bit over rated because of his ridiculously fast rise to the top but he is no poser.

Total nonsense. Comparing Brock to Kimbo is an absolutely ridiculous comparison. Yes, Brock often does act like a jackass, but he has some of the best wrestling credentials in the UFC not to mention is a freak of an athlete. (As is Carwin)

+1 Brock may very well be THE best wrestler in the UFC certainly he has some of the very best wrestling credentials. I didn't want him to get the title shot when he did and to be honest I didn't want him to win, but now that he is there I'd hate to see him lose it so soon. Brock is an extremely rare type of athlete. I think he IS faster than Carwin, but Shane has the heavy hands.

We'll see. I really don't think I could bet on this fight at all!

 

[Kenno]

I see your point, but my gut says that won't happen. Lesnar's too aggressive of a man. Most likely Carwin is too. These guys are both beasts. I don't think either will be cautious. I think they'll both be going for the fences at all times.

Both are argressive but Lesnar hasn't fought someone of this size and striking power? He might be a little cautious of Carwin and Carwin of him. Both of em could also run outta gas, big guys n all, although Brock is probably in better shape to capitilize on this in the later rounds if need be.

If I were Carwin I'd start throwing some bombs to make Lesnar think twice, otherwise Lesnar is gonna take him down and get him. I'm not sure if Carwins punching is good enough to always hit Brock, plus Brock hasn't really fought good punchers with this power so his ability to avoid punches hasn't really been tested.

In the end I think Brock the rock gets him. For a big guy he's got some speed on his feet in quick spurts and will use this to get close to Carwin and take him down.

 

[Barbash]

I agree that Brock was probably given his title shot at too early a stage in his career, but he won it and he has looked impressive in all of his fights including when Mir made him tap.
To compare him to Kimbo is just unfair and sounds like someone didn't watch Kimbo try to fight on TUF. Kimbo has no take down defense and can't do anything from the ground. Sure he has heavy hands, but that is it.
I like Carwin and think he offers up a better challenge to Brock than anyone he has fought thus far, but I think Brock's wrestling skills will allow him to controll the fight and get the win. I think this fight could go 4 or 5 rounds with Brock just riding Carwin like he did against Herring for most of the match.

 

[thecoalition]

PS -- I wanna see the GSP vs. Anderson Silva superfight. They've been talking about it on and off for last 2 years. GSP has added more weight and I think he could move up within a year if he tried. That would be phenomenal. The best striker vs. the best wrestler.

99% sure this won't happen ever. GSP has said multiple times that he is happy where he is at because he feels he is still getting challenges. He has also said, in general speaking, that he fights to be and stay champion. Since he is already a champion he doesn't need to prove anything anymore.

Essentially to me it sounds like a bit of he is happy being on top and is maybe nervous that if he goes up he won't get to the top again.

 

[xivex]

99% sure this won't happen ever. GSP has said multiple times that he is happy where he is at because he feels he is still getting challenges. He has also said, in general speaking, that he fights to be and stay champion. Since he is already a champion he doesn't need to prove anything anymore.

Essentially to me it sounds like a bit of he is happy being on top and is maybe nervous that if he goes up he won't get to the top again.

No way! I do belive this fight will still happen, it may be another year or two off, but it will happen in my opinion. Last I read GSP said he would move to middleweight when he naturally weighs 200 lbs. He said he is walking around at about 194 right now before cutting to 170lbs for welterweight. Thats a huge cut. He said his body wouldn't be able to take the cut as easily when he's 200 lbs. + naturally as that'd be a 30 lbs cut then. Thus, when he is walking around at 200 lbs. he said he would fight at middleweight (185 lbs) because its a much easier cut and less harsh on his body. He weight 194 lbs naturally right now, So another 6 lbs. of muscle and he'd be ready. That could happen in a year or two.

The problem, in my eyes, is that GSP would be small for a middleweight, and that might prevent the fight from happening. However, as you stated GSP is all about the competition..problem is...who is left at welterweight for him? He's cleaned out the division more so than Anderson Silva has at middleweight (at least Silva has Marquardt, Maia, Belfort, and several others before the fights start sounding boring)....who does GSP have left to fight at welterweight that would be interesting? No one. Seriously..name someone that would be worth watching him destroy? I can't.

X

 

[thecoalition]

yea it's hard to say...unfortunately fitch is his closest competition and as much as I like fitch he got wrecked that last time they faced off. granted dude is tough as nails taking some hits that would knock anyone else out cold.

 

[Soopercat]

Total nonsense. Comparing Brock to Kimbo is an absolutely ridiculous comparison. Yes, Brock often does act like a jackass, but he has some of the best wrestling credentials in the UFC not to mention is a freak of an athlete. (As is Carwin)

Kimbo is fighting catch weight fights on his way down to 205, because skilled fighters like Roy Nelson crushed him. Roy doesn't look the part but has trained his MMA skills. To bad he is also in tough against the super heavies. Brock doesn't have the same out, he can't get out of the way of a "technically skilled fighter" he will lose and have to work his way back up the ladder. Which is my point regarding Kimbo. This won't be a wrestling match, Shane is trained by Greg Jackson, one of the better tacticians and strategists based on his fighters skill sets .. they will prepare for the instinctive blind bull rush. Both men are far enough removed from their respective College Div I and Div II Heavyweight Championship days that it's a non issue when it comes to MMA.

That might be the funniest thing in this thread. Is Brock new, yes! Has Brock been tested, Yes! He didn't fight Tomato Can Harry, he decimated Frank Mir, not once but twice. If it weren't for the fortunate heel hook Frank would have been destroyed. Frank Mir is a respectable fighter. I do agree that Brock is likely a bit over rated because of his ridiculously fast rise to the top but he is no poser.

+1 Brock may very well be THE best wrestler in the UFC certainly he has some of the very best wrestling credentials.

Frank is 230 pumped up to 265 without the natural power. He is a respectable fighter if he fought at a 240 upper limit. Those wrestling credentials are a great base, but won't win a fight against someone with your own size power and better striking ability. This fight starts on the feet and Brock broadcasts his take downs like no one I've ever seen before.

I agree that Brock was probably given his title shot at too early a stage in his career, but he won it and he has looked impressive in all of his fights including when Mir made him tap.
To compare him to Kimbo is just unfair and sounds like someone didn't watch Kimbo try to fight on TUF. Kimbo has no take down defense and can't do anything from the ground. Sure he has heavy hands, but that is it.

Brock jumped the line for a Dana White promo, which is okay, now he gets to do it the right way. Brock has not been tested against guys his own size or with good stand up skills. Dana always provided the prefect mismatch. Let's say he had to do it like everyone else. Fight through the up and comers and vets alike to earn his stripes. Say, Junior Dos Santos, Paul Buentello, Cain Valasquez up to now. He may not be the same guy after the first loss to Frank Mir. Which should have put him down amongst that pack. Nope he gets Heath Herring who's only credible win in the UFC was a wrestling match against of all people Cheick Kongo, and an undersized Randy Couture. Dana positioned this exactly the way he should have, and I congratulate him for keeping the heavy weight division interesting. So we can have discussions like this.

Kind regards,

 

[TimmyBoston]

Kimbo is fighting catch weight fights on his way down to 205, because skilled fighters like Roy Nelson crushed him. Roy doesn't look the part but has trained his MMA skills. To bad he is also in tough against the super heavies. Brock doesn't have the same out, he can't get out of the way of a "technically skilled fighter" he will lose and have to work his way back up the ladder. Which is my point regarding Kimbo. This won't be a wrestling match, Shane is trained by Greg Jackson, one of the better tacticians and strategists based on his fighters skill sets .. they will prepare for the instinctive blind bull rush. Both men are far enough removed from their respective College Div I and Div II Heavyweight Championship days that it's a non issue when it comes to MMA.


,

I just gotta laugh reading this. First off, Kimbo's next fight is at Heavyweight against Matt Mitrione. Not 205.

You actually think neither one of these men will use their wrestling in this fight? Like seriously? That's ridiculous. The ONLY way that won't happen is if there is an a very swift knockout and neither one gets the chance to do so.

It's also funny how you're viewing Carwin as this technically skilled fighter. I like Carwin, a lot, so I'm not being disparaging, but the man's a wrestler, a dirty boxer and a brawler. That's all he's ever shown in his fights, period.
In terms of a "technical fighter" Mir is one of the best in the Heavies. He has great jiu jitsu, not to mention very good boxing. Remember his decimation of Cheick Kongo?

 

[Soopercat]

I just gotta laugh reading this. First off, Kimbo's next fight is at Heavyweight against Matt Mitrione. Not 205.

You actually think neither one of these men will use their wrestling in this fight? Like seriously? That's ridiculous. The ONLY way that won't happen is if there is an a very swift knockout and neither one gets the chance to do so.

It's also funny how you're viewing Carwin as this technically skilled fighter. I like Carwin, a lot, so I'm not being disparaging, but the man's a wrestler, a dirty boxer and a brawler. That's all he's ever shown in his fights, period.
In terms of a "technical fighter" Mir is one of the best in the Heavies. He has great jiu jitsu, not to mention very good boxing. Remember his decimation of Cheick Kongo?

I know, his next fight is at the Bell Centre in Montreal, about half hour in a puddle jumper from me. I hope to be there. He won't stay a heavy for long he just isn't big enough. He has real trouble with the cut against Huston Alexander.

I don't see them on the ground except for a stuff and sprawl. Then back to the feet. Up against the cage dirty boxing yes, but only until Carwin hit's him.

I don't disagree with you, that Mir is more technically skilled than Carwin on the ground, for sure he is. But he got beaten up / punched out by the naturally stronger more skilled fighter on his feet. The fight never got to the ground. I see the same thing happening with Brock. "Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth" Mike Tyson. I see this with Lesnar.

Kind regards,

 

[Mejnoon]

I just gotta laugh reading this. First off, Kimbo's next fight is at Heavyweight against Matt Mitrione. Not 205.

You actually think neither one of these men will use their wrestling in this fight? Like seriously? That's ridiculous. The ONLY way that won't happen is if there is an a very swift knockout and neither one gets the chance to do so.

It's also funny how you're viewing Carwin as this technically skilled fighter. I like Carwin, a lot, so I'm not being disparaging, but the man's a wrestler, a dirty boxer and a brawler. That's all he's ever shown in his fights, period.
In terms of a "technical fighter" Mir is one of the best in the Heavies. He has great jiu jitsu, not to mention very good boxing. Remember his decimation of Cheick Kongo?

That part I don't think I agree with. Brock has taken all of his opponents down, and Carwin is the most dangerous guy he's faced on his feet by far.

I think Brock will try to take Carwin down, and I think he may be successful once or twice, but I don't think he can hold him down. I think he'll just get up, like he did against Gonzaga.

And lets face it...Brock gets hit a lot. Neither Randy nor Mir had much trouble putting hands on him, and they both had him hurt at one point. Carwin will put him away, I have very little doubt of that.

 

[Mejnoon]

Interesting point about Lesnar not taking opponents down, and rather more just "bullying" them down. I tend to agree though I hadn't thought of it until now...but isn't the "bullying" just a kind of Greco-Roman wrestling takedown? Randy Couture does this type of thing a lot. I guess whatever works, bullying or smooth technical takedown. As long as Brock is on top, I think very few people stand a chance due to his strength.

Also, as good as Maia's jiu jitsu is, don't forget Anderson Silva's a BJJ black belt under the Nogeiura brothers. I dont' think Silva's BJJ compares to Maia's BJJ, but nontheless, the Spider knows how to handle himself on the ground. I still am convinced the Spider KO's maia in round 1 or 2. Anderson is just on an entirely different level than anyone else in MMA as a striker imho. Dude is just sick...the spider is the perfect nickname for him. Strikes coming from every angle and pinpoint accuracy.

Silva makes everyone he faces look horrible. That is the mark of a true champion.

I hear what you're saying about greco takedowns (Randy's are beautiful, and highly technical), but thats not really what Brock does...he double legs guys but without changing levels, he just bends at the waist, wraps guys up and drives through them...like a football tackle almost. It definitely works...the man won a d1 championship doing what he does, and he's put all of his opponents on their backs. I just think it leaves him open to punches, and Carwin is tailor made to exploit that.