The Comprehensive Sampler Kits Are In!

[DaveF]

For heaven's sake, you have completely lost perspective here.

1) It is illegal to ship alcohol across the border.
2) Most of the samples in the pack have alcohol in them

Period.

Do you really, honestly think that this has anything at all to do with you not being "American"? That Joel, Nick, et al are deliberately keeping "the goods" away from you because you "ain't from 'round these parts"?

They don't want to break the law, man, and that's it. It's well and good for you to suggest ways that they can break the law and not get caught so you can benefit, but to huff and puff and take offense because they aren't willing to do so, and then to accuse them of, what, discriminating against you for being Canadian? Signing yourself an enemy combatant, for god's sake??? Get a grip.

 

[Nick]

Nick,

I've sat and thought about this for a few days, off and on. ... Actually, you do have a choice, and you made it.

I'm responding reluctantly, and as carefully as I can, because this is a medium where it's easy to be misunderstood, especially when matters being discussed are an issue of degree ...

Some professional, or perhaps semi-professional (cottage industry?) vendors have found ways to legally, and hopefully even profitably, ship the contraband items outside the USA. If there is some way I can offer my time, and even perhaps some treasure to assist in this, I'd be delighted.

Might there be options to piggy-back on other vendors services, or perhaps follow the same route? Anyway you, perhaps understandably, decided to not go that way at this time.

Again, respected.

Sometimes, though, I think that you should consider yourselves carefully as the global resource you are becoming. As a "non-American" (living here in North America!) it doesn't take long for an enthusiastic newby to wonder why there are so many subtle knocks to non-Americans here.

It has definitely dulled my enjoyment of an otherwise delightful pursuit.

signed,

An Enemy Combatant?

I put an hour into coming up with a response because it's very important to me that all of our members feel welcomed and at home, regardless of geography, but rereading it, it just sounded like a bitchfest, and if I can't convey how important that notion is to me in a paragraph, making you read a page is a waste of time.

The bottom line is this: For us to package all of these kits, deal with the numerous international manufacturers, create the actual kit, add it as an item in the decant club, dealing with the shipping labels for each package (our decant club store's back end sucks), these sample kits are tremendously time consuming. So far, we have not found a way in speaking with our FedEx rep that we can legally ship these packages to Canada without both a significant investment in time and money, both initially to get this off the ground, and each time we'd have to put a package together and take care of all the necessary paperwork and associated fees.

Just think about it for a second, to take roughly 60 items from different boxes that you've been sitting on for over a month, that required you to front your own money, and have that money tied up in samples the whole time while you wait for everything to come in, to then create just 30 of the kits (that's 1800 items), package them properly, fill out the shipping information, and then run them yourself down to the FedEx store so you don't have to charge everyone an additional 3 bucks or so per package (for a driver pickup) for shipping burns a lot of time. Right now, we're sitting on a boxes of samples that came in after we released the first run that cost us several hundred dollars, and now that the second run is going to be bigger, there's no easy way for us to get rid of them.

This is something we're trying to do to help out people on the forum. This isn't a business, we aren't retailers, we're just two guys who both have real lives and responsibilities that only have so much time to devote to the forum.

For every member here, we try and offer one thing: a friendly place where you can get all the information you'd ever want regarding shaving, and men's grooming. If that's what you're receiving for free, then regardless of all the additional goodies, hopefully you can gain enjoyment from that and still have a positive experience here. Despite the size of our board, we've refused the numerous requests for advertizing space and continue to pay out of pocket, because as daily users ourselves, we certainly wouldn't appreciate having to log in to see ads flashing all over the place. Rather, we try and use B&B's size and clout to get products for giveaways, and great deals for the members as a way to further benefit the membership.

At the end of the day, it has nothing to do with bias of any sort, Joel's engaged to a Canadian, much of my family is from Canada. What it does have to do with, however, is it's just myself and Joel trying to do what we can to help this community, with the financial and time constraints that entails.

If a member has the time (like you suggested you might) to find a completely legal, still reasonably priced, and not overly labor intensive option, we would be ecstatic. So far all the options we've found that are legal have been incredibly pricey and would radically increase the cost of shipping. If this is something you're interested in shoot me a PM and we can discuss it.

-Nick

 

[joel]

One thing i'd like to add....

It's our understanding (from all the research we had done, and our account rep) that the fine PER violation from the Department of Transportation is well into the five figure sum. Nick and I would both be PERSONALLY responsible for this, so we have a lot on the line, and for us - there is absolutely no grey area - we are doing this in the right way - the LEGAL way. The LEGAL way, as per our understanding (again, as per our research and our account rep) is incredibly expensive - and is really setup for businesses, not small little "help out our forum buddies" operations like us. To get permits to ship this stuff, we'd have to front thousands of dollars (for the permit), and provide some sort of hasmat spec sheets for EVERY product.

I don't know how RETAILERS are shipping these products to Canada, or how legal they are in doing so, but as Nick stated - this has nothing to do with a bias, and we have not "made the choice to discriminate" - and frankly, I'm a little insulted in the manner in which you approached us on this.

You know what they say... no good deed goes unpunished!

 

[DaveF]

On a happier note, while I am very appreciative of all of the vendors who participated in this, I wanted to give special kudos to Mama Bear, Saint Charles Shave, Floris, and Truefitt & Hill for really going above and beyond with the number of samples they provided. I assume that Joel and Nick had to pay for some or all of those samples so maybe it wasn't entirely altruistic on the suppliers' part, but I am so impressed with their level of participation in this, and when I have run through enough of the sample kit to make some informed buying decisions, that will certainly be a factor in which products I end up buying.

BTW, is there any way we can let the vendors know that we are buying as a result of their participation in this, er, event? I definitely want to send the message that participating in these kinds of things on B&B is a good way to gain exposure and increase sales for them.

 

[michael m]

Just got mine ......looks great can't wait to try out everything .

 

[cr8n]

Gentlemen,

My post above offended some of those who read it.

I would like to apologize to anyone who was offended in general, and to the mods in particular, especially Nick.

I did have some serious points, and an offer of help (if at all possible) to make, and do understand the legal implications of shipping some products in question, the volunteer status of those involved in the BBDC, and have some small idea of the great amount of time and effort they put in.

Obviously, I now see that I didn't raise those points in a clear and constructive manner.

Again, I am sorry.

Sincerely,
Paul

 

[joel]

Gentlemen,

My post above offended some of those who read it.

I would like to apologize to anyone who was offended in general, and to the mods in particular, especially Nick.

I did have some serious points, and an offer of help (if at all possible) to make, and do understand the legal implications of shipping some products in question, the volunteer status of those involved in the BBDC, and have some small idea of the great amount of time and effort they put in.

Obviously, I now see that I didn't raise those points in a clear and constructive manner.

Again, I am sorry.

Sincerely,
Paul

Thank you for your heartfelt response Paul, we appreciate it, now let's have some fun!

BTW, remember - we'll be able to ship the B&B Essentials worldwide!

 

[bjrn]

BTW, is there any way we can let the vendors know that we are buying as a result of their participation in this, er, event? I definitely want to send the message that participating in these kinds of things on B&B is a good way to gain exposure and increase sales for them.

I think this is something worth highlighting. If you've ordered the B&B Sampler kit, and then decide to order from one of the vendors, let them know you're doing it (at least in part) because of B&B. Sometimes order forms have an extra field for "other instructions" or similar, you can fill it out there, or just shoot them an email saying you've ordered and that it's thanks to the B&B sampler kits.

I'm sure that'll be good for B&B in any eventual future dealings with those companies.

 

[Belegnole]

I know I may be being a bit dimm...BUT why not in the future IF there are enough Canadian or other nationality interest. Have the appropriate number of items shiped to a Canadian instead of to Nick/Joel in the states. If the Manufacturer ships it it is much easier for us. It might for the smaller manufactures cost the end user a bit more but if you want it, it may be a way to pull it off. I know there are Mods in Ol Canada so it could be kept in house as it were......just a thought

 

[joel]

I know I may be being a bit dimm...BUT why not in the future IF there are enough Canadian or other nationality interest. Have the appropriate number of items shiped to a Canadian instead of to Nick/Joel in the states. If the Manufacturer ships it it is much easier for us. It might for the smaller manufactures cost the end user a bit more but if you want it, it may be a way to pull it off. I know there are Mods in Ol Canada so it could be kept in house as it were......just a thought

Well, firstly, I cannot imagine any Canadian member willing to spend 10+ hours filling up boxes/distributing contents into sample kits, packaging them up, and shipping them out - and of course, not making a penny.

Secondly, most of the samples we have to purchase, and pay shipping... in fact, most of the price is in shipping, so having separate boxes shipped to Canada would radically boost the price of the Canadian kits, and again - a good portion (if not most) of the manufacturers cannot and will not ship to Canada regardless.

Again.... you can't please everyone, and the old saying rings true - "No good deed goes unpunished."

We're trying to help fellas out, the best we can with the financial and logistical/time restrictions we have. Making this even more complicated, time consuming, and costly simply isn't going to happen. We're trying to help the best we can, with the small amount of free time we have - and frankly we're catching a lot of flack for it, and it's really de-motivating. Why do we want to deal with the headaches, when it seems to irritate Canadian members?

I hate to be a jerk about it... but we did the research, and we cannot ship items with alcohol to Canada. Period. Just to buy some of these samples from companies can take months, and further complicating the process/procedure (keep in mind we're dealing with A LOT of companies) is beyond our scope of available time/energy. It's really a miserable undertaking and we're already out hundreds of dollars from the last batch of samples - from a late participant.

Seriously, just stop for a second, and think about what a pain in the rear it is to deal with so many companies, order up all this stuff, distribute 50+ samples into a bunch of boxes, fill out EACH shipping label, package up all the items, etc. This is really a huge undertaking, please - appreciate the blood, sweat and tears Nick and I have into these things and see it as a benefit to a good portion of the community, instead of "Oh rats, I can't get one "

 

[Suzuki]

As a Canadian I share people's pain about the BS restrictions regarding shipping products between Candada and the US.

In fact, I have a bottle of Floris Sandalwood EDT and Alt Innsbruck AS sitting at a friend's house in the US because I couldn't arrange shipping to Canada and had them shipped to him to hold until I'm in the US.

I also agree with Joel that, unless there is a Canadian who would be willing to receive shipments of samples in bulk and then break them into sampler kits, package and ship for nothing (FWIW, I find packaging up a couple of things to be a PIA, let alone multiple kits with the number of items that the B&B kits include), there's not going to be a Canadian sampler with alcohol products in it. Perhaps there's a possibility of having a sampler that doesn't contain any alcohol-based products, but that would likely deminish the value of the kits for many guys.

There are a couple of strategies - if you live close to the border, there are often places where you can rent a mail box inexpensively or who will take delivery on your behalf (check first with the vendor, as some couriers won't send this way, but USPS generally will). Another option is to order stuff to a hotel when you or someone else you know is travelling in the states - most hotels will accept shipments on a guest's behalf (check first) and most vendors will ship to a hotel (at your risk) if you give them enough lead time. This is one of my favourite ways to get stuff that I can't get across the border - as well as save duties/taxes at the same time. This is how I got my B&B cologne a couple of years back - Rick agreed to ship it to a friend's hotel - no hassle, no problems, just had to use a slightly more expensive shipping method.

So, to sum up, there are ways of getting this stuff to Canada, you just need to be creative (and I realize its not a possibility for everyone), but don't blame Joel or Nick for the idiotic shipping restrictions they operate under.

 

[Bruz]

Seriously, just stop for a second, and think about what a pain in the rear it is to deal with so many companies, order up all this stuff, distribute 50+ samples into a bunch of boxes, fill out EACH shipping label, package up all the items, etc. This is really a huge undertaking, please - appreciate the blood, sweat and tears Nick and I have into these things and see it as a benefit to a good portion of the community, instead of "Oh rats, I can't get one "

Having an on-line business I know the pains you are going thru, thank you so much for your efforts! As far as having to take all the money out of your own pocket for the advance purchase, have you considered pre-selling the kits? I would be more than happy to pay for your next offering today, assume others would as well? Looking forward to your next sampler either way.

 

[Hoos]

Wow! This looks terrific. I only wish I'd been paying attention back in November.

If another sampler pack becomes available, I'd most definitely be interested.

What a great idea and a great job of putting together something to help folks navigate the world of shaving.

I would love to have something like this instead of risking buying a full bottle/package of something at $50+ sometimes.

Good stuff!

Edit: I'm in the San Francisco area, so if it's close enough, I'd be happy to volunteer time to help too.

 

[joel]

Wow! This looks terrific. I only wish I'd been paying attention back in November.

If another sampler pack becomes available, I'd most definitely be interested.

What a great idea and a great job of putting together something to help folks navigate the world of shaving.

I would love to have something like this instead of risking buying a full bottle/package of something at $50+ sometimes.

Good stuff!

Edit: I'm in the San Francisco area, so if it's close enough, I'd be happy to volunteer time to help too.

Brent,
This next batch should be pretty amazing.... it'll likely be ready at the end of the month. There will be pretty much everything that was in the last kit - PLUS a whole lot more from quite a few other companies that weren't in the last batch!

Should be VERY cool!

 

[Aevum]

yea, but as i live in spain, theres little chance i will actually be able to order one,

since most of the products there are of british/european origin, wouldnt it be possible to have a european member assemble them for shipping to EU countries ?

 

[Naes12]

yea, but as i live in spain, theres little chance i will actually be able to order one,

since most of the products there are of british/european origin, wouldnt it be possible to have a european member assemble them for shipping to EU countries ?

The answer is probably going to be the same as the one given to the Canadian member.

 

[jellywerker]

For the Canadian fellow, where in Canada? I'll be heading up there this spring (and possibly earlier) and if you'd like, you could pm me and we'll arrange something. It all depends on where you live though. I know that it is perfectly legal to take things like shaving items through the border for a friend. If you live too far, I could possibly arrange to mail them from a canadian post office.

 

[riooso]

So as of today, is there going to be a round 2 in the near future? Just curious.


Thanks,
Richard

 

[stripec30]

So as of today, is there going to be a round 2 in the near future? Just curious.


Thanks,
Richard

+1

 

[Nick]

Absolutely.

We've amassed quite a healthy array of samples (and some full-sized products), there are a ton of new samples, and we are just waiting on a handful of vendors.

-Nick