Rockwell 6S vs Paradigm 17-4

[Nicholas]

I have the first one and love it.

If someone has used both, I'd like to know what you think, how these razors compare.

Is Paradigm buttery smooth, gives effortless and irritation-free shaves like Rockwell does?

Any opinion is welcome. Paradigm seems to be the new trend in the wetshaving world and I'd like to know where it actually stands.

 

[Shavemd]

For me the Paradigm is very smooth and as efficient as the 6s #6 plate It is polished and finished much better than the 6s but there are no ther heads to adjust if you would need to. I sold my 6s it was a very good razor but I just never reached for it. Is the Paradigm worth the $100 plus more ? Yes for me but YMMV

 

[TJKoko]

For me the Paradigm is very smooth and as efficient as the 6s #6 plate It is polished and finished much better than the 6s but there are no ther heads to adjust if you would need to. I sold my 6s it was a very good razor but I just never reached for it. Is the Paradigm worth the $100 plus more ? Yes for me but YMMV

"...the 6S #6 plate..." So the Paradigm would be aggressive. Hmmmm. Way more aggressive than the Merkur 34C HD?

 

[Shavemd]

"...the 6S #6 plate..." So the Paradigm would be aggressive. Hmmmm. Way more aggressive than the Merkur 34C HD?

I would not call the Paradigm Aggressive It is very smooth but its efficiency is tremendous

 

[vtmax]

I have the first one and love it.

If someone has used both, I'd like to know what you think, how these razors compare.

Is Paradigm buttery smooth, gives effortless and irritation-free shaves like Rockwell does?

Any opinion is welcome. Paradigm seems to be the new trend in the wetshaving world and I'd like to know where it actually stands.

The 17-4 is the better shaver imo. The 6S is wonderful but as @Shavemd states above it’s as efficient as the 6 plate and easily as smooth or smoother (for me.)

The Paradigm is the better razor and clearly worth the extra $130. I’d pay it again in a second.

 

[TJKoko]

What is meant by the term "efficient".

 

[Shavemd]

What is meant by the term "efficient".

To me aggressive and smooth are descriptive of how the razor feels on my face as I shave. Efficiency is how well it removes my whiskers.

 

[Bricksville]

What is meant by the term "efficient".

I think of "efficiency" in anything as a relation between two things, usually expressed as "a lot of X for the amount of Y."

A car is "fuel efficient" if it gives a lot of distance for the amount of fuel it burns.

An athlete is efficient in his movements if he gets a lot done for the amount of apparent effort.

In that sense, a razor (or blade) is efficient if it cuts whiskers well for the amount of scraping it does.

That's the way I think of it anyway.

 

[kyproset]

Mine is arriving tomorrow, but if it's just as efficient as the 6S@6 then I'm going to be disappointed because the 6 plate is not efficient enough for me, This is the reason I don't reach for the Rockwell any more although I love its smoothness.

 

[NJDJ]

I can chime in here as I have owned a Paradigm for about a week. My Razor prior was the Rockwell 6s. I am still evaluating the Paradigm. The Rockwell was a very good razor for me and I love it. The first time I shaved with the Paradigm, I butchered myself. A big reason is that the razor literally has very little blade feel. I was applying too much pressure and I paid for it. On the Rockwell, I primarily use plate 3. I find plate 5 and 6 too aggressive for me. Usually plate 3 is aggressive enough and gets the job done well enough for me in two passes. I am pretty happy with the result. Back to the paradigm. The Paradigm is far more efficient, another words, it shaves closer. It also has less blade feel. I guess that makes it more comfortable. It is a different razor and you have to get used to some aspects of it and I am still learning those aspects. I do also find that the construction and the look of the razor is nicer on the Paradigm. One aspect that I really like is the fact that the blade is completely enclosed. There are no blade edges sticking out like on the Rockwell. I would sometimes clip my nose with those and cut myself. Also, the Paradigm is not as bulky. That makes maneuvering under the nose that much easier. One more difference that I've noted is the knurling on the handle. The Rockwell is much more grippy. The Paradigm is beautiful but it is, for me, slippery. If I keep the Paradigm, I will be replacing the handle with something else. So, I am still evaluating and the jury is still out but I lean towards keeping the Paradigm.

 

[pbrmhl]

Mine is arriving tomorrow, but if it's just as efficient as the 6S@6 then I'm going to be disappointed because the 6 plate is not efficient enough for me, This is the reason I don't reach for the Rockwell any more although I love its smoothness.

I used the Rockwell 6S with the #6 plate for five shaves in a row, a couple of months ago. I enjoyed the smoothness, but could not get a truly close shave. I haven't used it since.

I have used the 17-4 for five shaves (i.e., one blade), last week. All five of them were perfectly smooth (or mild), yet as close and long-lasting as any other razor I own (of about 60), including the R41 2011, ATT H2, Ikon Tech or any of my other aggressive monsters. I worry that my other razors will get neglected as the 17-4 takes center stage...

 

[kyproset]

Thank you NJDJ and pbrmhl for your experience both with the 6S and the 17-4. It seems there is still hope for me. I'll hopefully be shaving with the 17-4 tomorrow, provided the post office does its job, considering they are already a day late.

 

[zed117]

Anyone else want to chim in? Would love to hear more thoughts.

 

[Bricksville]

I have both the Rockwell 6S and the Paradigm 17-4. Both great razors.

I use the 6S with the #6 plate. It and the 17-4 both give me perfect shaves -- completely close and completely comfortable. The Paradigm is just a much more polished bit of kit. First of all, it's 17-4 steel, which is notoriously difficult to machine but which accepts a mirror polish without risk of scratching. And it's beautifully finished. The Rockwell shaves as well, but it's not as nice a piece of equipment in terms of material or fit/finish.

The big advantages of the Rockwell 6S right now are availability and price. Paradigm are unlikely ever to produce the 17-4 again, and if they do, it will be a LOT more expensive, according to Andy the proprietor. It's just too expensive to machine.

If someone told me I couldn't have a Paradigm 17-4 but I could shave the rest of my days with a Rockwell 6S, I'd be OK with that.

 

[kyproset]

I have both the Rockwell 6S and the Paradigm 17-4. Both great razors.

I use the 6S with the #6 plate. It and the 17-4 both give me perfect shaves -- completely close and completely comfortable. The Paradigm is just a much more polished bit of kit. First of all, it's 17-4 steel, which is notoriously difficult to machine but which accepts a mirror polish without risk of scratching. And it's beautifully finished. The Rockwell shaves as well, but it's not as nice a piece of equipment in terms of material or fit/finish.

The big advantages of the Rockwell 6S right now are availability and price. Paradigm are unlikely ever to produce the 17-4 again, and if they do, it will be a LOT more expensive, according to Andy the proprietor. It's just too expensive to machine.

If someone told me I couldn't have a Paradigm 17-4 but I could shave the rest of my days with a Rockwell 6S, I'd be OK with that.

This is a bit funny for me, because the 6S@6 on a feather is quite inefficient, while the 17-4 is so much smoother and effective. Having said that, I do respect YMMV.

 

[mozartman]

What I find interesting about this thread is the number of posters who use the Rockwell with plate 6, or find even that plate not aggressive or efficient enough. I'm trying to decide whether to stay with plates 3 or 4, and I think I'm more likely to stay with plate 3. I wonder if I'm a statistical outlier in this group. Also, if 17-4 steel is so hard or expensive to work with, what possible justification is there for using it, nice though the 17-4 razor may be? I've had great success with plain ol' 304 or 18/8 steel kitchen implements, which in many cases have lasted for decades of hard and constant use with only slight surface scratches and minimal if any discoloration.

 

[Bricksville]

What I find interesting about this thread is the number of posters who use the Rockwell with plate 6, or find even that plate not aggressive or efficient enough. I'm trying to decide whether to stay with plates 3 or 4, and I think I'm more likely to stay with plate 3. I wonder if I'm a statistical outlier in this group. Also, if 17-4 steel is so hard or expensive to work with, what possible justification is there for using it, nice though the 17-4 razor may be? I've had great success with plain ol' 304 or 18/8 steel kitchen implements, which in many cases have lasted for decades of hard and constant use with only slight surface scratches and minimal if any discoloration.

Some interesting observations there. And I think you are quite rightly calling the question on these issues.

On the plate question, my own take is that the 17-4 shaves as closely as a Rockwell 6S on plate 6, but feels as comfortable and smooth as a Rockwell 6S on plate 3. That said, I find the Rockwell 6S quite comfortable on plate 6; I just have to respect it more. I hope that makes sense. If you want me to live with Rockwell 6S on Plate 3 for my entire life, I'm fine with that, and I guarantee my face will be smooth.

Regarding the choice of steel in the 17-4, you'll have to ask Andy, the proprietor of Paradigm. But my understanding reading what he's written is that: (a) He was going for a super-hard steel that would take a mirror polish but resist scratching. His view was that 316 wouldn't do that; and (b) He made a mistake trying to work with 17-4 steel for a razor. It was an experiment that won't be repeated because of the cost of working with it. There are readily-available materials that work just fine, as you point out. I think he was trying something new, which is to be applauded (even if not commercially validated).

 

[zed117]

What I find interesting about this thread is the number of posters who use the Rockwell with plate 6, or find even that plate not aggressive or efficient enough. I'm trying to decide whether to stay with plates 3 or 4, and I think I'm more likely to stay with plate 3. I wonder if I'm a statistical outlier in this group.

It seems to me that in general B&B has a large number of men with tough beards that need aggressive razors. As one of those with sensitive skin that finds even the NEW fairly aggressive, and looking at an old type gives me rash, could never go above plate #4. Hence YMMV and why no one can agree on a razor or blade. Prep, skin type and hair type also play a huge part in this.

 

[Highspeedlane]

What I find interesting about this thread is the number of posters who use the Rockwell with plate 6, or find even that plate not aggressive or efficient enough. I'm trying to decide whether to stay with plates 3 or 4, and I think I'm more likely to stay with plate 3. I wonder if I'm a statistical outlier in this group. Also, if 17-4 steel is so hard or expensive to work with, what possible justification is there for using it, nice though the 17-4 razor may be? I've had great success with plain ol' 304 or 18/8 steel kitchen implements, which in many cases have lasted for decades of hard and constant use with only slight surface scratches and minimal if any discoloration.

I'm in the same category as yourself. I used plate 4 the past two days and have come to the conclusion that for daily, 24 hour shaving, plate 3 really performs best overall in balancing comfort and efficiency. If the stars were to align and I could actually go 3+ days without shaving I would probably try jumping up to 5 or 6, but I just can't even skip a single day shaving, much less multiple days

 

[mozartman]

I'm in the same category as yourself. I used plate 4 the past two days and have come to the conclusion that for daily, 24 hour shaving, plate 3 really performs best overall in balancing comfort and efficiency. If the stars were to align and I could actually go 3+ days without shaving I would probably try jumping up to 5 or 6, but I just can't even skip a single day shaving, much less multiple days

Glad to here from you, @zed117 and @Bricksville on this topic. My beard is average or even lighter than average, and I shave daily. I like the Old Type but I've had to concede it's too aggressive for long term daily use. The Merkur 34C, which I also like and which is milder than the Old Type but still isn't the mildest razor in the world, is if anything slightly milder than plate 3 on the Rockwell imo, maybe 2.75. Plates 3 and 4 are already approaching moderate aggressive territory imo. So any razor that leaves plate 6 in the dust, well, you guys can try it first.