Gem Re-Sharpening

[Old Hippie]

So I got to wondering...

Since I'm in a part of Canada where I can find NO SE blades except for box cutters, whether there was some option that appealed both to my "Scottish cheapness" and to my quirk for getting interactive with my tools.

I found this thread after searching several ways, which got me thinking yet further. I should say that A) yes, I know various online vendors sell the Personna Gem PTFE blades, and B) often the question of "Why?" is better stated as "Why not?", and C) I know that honing stainless is a whole different cat than carbon. So with the disclaimers outta the way...

I'm actually wanting to find some kind of honing jig that will accurately do a three-facet hone on a Gem blade. Just because I want one doesn't mean there IS one, but what the heck -- DOES anyone know of one? Go ahead, laugh, I'd spend a couple hundred to get a jig to hone a 25 cent blade because then I would KNOW.

I have a totally groovy jig for honing plane irons and spokeshave blades. It allows for accurate and repeatable micro-bevels. Something like that, either from a recognized maker, or DIY instructions for it, would be ideal.

My intermediate goal would be to find a way to re-hone a two-facet box cutter blade into a decent three-facet blade. (...and if it goes better than "decent" that's gravy.) Ultimate goal is simply to understand the process a little, and as my wife would point out, buy some new tools.

One more question: What are the three angles (and most importantly the final micro-bevel) on a three-facet blade?

OH

 

[Clay S]

So I got to wondering...

Since I'm in a part of Canada where I can find NO SE blades except for box cutters, whether there was some option that appealed both to my "Scottish cheapness" and to my quirk for getting interactive with my tools.

I found this thread after searching several ways, which got me thinking yet further. I should say that A) yes, I know various online vendors sell the Personna Gem PTFE blades, and B) often the question of "Why?" is better stated as "Why not?", and C) I know that honing stainless is a whole different cat than carbon. So with the disclaimers outta the way...

I'm actually wanting to find some kind of honing jig that will accurately do a three-facet hone on a Gem blade. Just because I want one doesn't mean there IS one, but what the heck -- DOES anyone know of one? Go ahead, laugh, I'd spend a couple hundred to get a jig to hone a 25 cent blade because then I would KNOW.

I have a totally groovy jig for honing plane irons and spokeshave blades. It allows for accurate and repeatable micro-bevels. Something like that, either from a recognized maker, or DIY instructions for it, would be ideal.

My intermediate goal would be to find a way to re-hone a two-facet box cutter blade into a decent three-facet blade. (...and if it goes better than "decent" that's gravy.) Ultimate goal is simply to understand the process a little, and as my wife would point out, buy some new tools.

One more question: What are the three angles (and most importantly the final micro-bevel) on a three-facet blade?

OH

I would:
1) Mail order some PAL carbon GEM format blades.
2) Make a jig to what angle you think it should be.
3) Hone blades on a stone using jig, giving the "Major" bevel.
4) Strop on .3 micron pasted balsam strop using jig, providing an ever so slightly secondary bevel because of the give.
5) Followed by a .1 micron balsam strop.

I'd probably use Straight razor blade angles as a reference on what angle to try.

 

[emwolf]

I have a glass strop for de blades. I wonder if something like that would work

 

[Esox]

I have no idea, but I did try sharpening a GEM carbon blade on my Arkansas whetstone.

Before.

After.

It didnt help much...

Second shave with the same blade after about 20 minutes on my whetstone.

First WTG pass, first stroke I thought to myself "ah yes, this is better". Still slightly tuggy below my jawline but finished the first pass with the only issue being the vacuum lock of the cap to my skin lol. This cap needs flutes so that doesnt happen.

Second pass XTG, tuggy again but I shaved through it. I did stop after that pass to flip the blade. Wipe and check and had considerable stubble still left. Lather up for directly ATG and very tuggy. I did finish that pass but wasnt where I had hoped to be and I didnt want to do another 3-4 passes with that blade so I switched to the SC with a Derby that had one shave on it.

Even shaving WTG the SC found uncut stubble which surprised me because I couldnt feel it with my hand. Another ATG pass and a single touch up and that was that.

For those of you that can shave with these blades, all the power to you but I sure cant. I really hope the PTFE are sharper.

I'm wondering if maybe this razor is just too mild? If I used a steeper angle it became even more tuggy and unusable to me. Not sure what I'm doing wrong, if anything. I really think these particular blades just cant do it for me.

Since I'm in a part of Canada where I can find NO SE blades except for box cutters, whether there was some option that appealed both to my "Scottish cheapness" and to my quirk for getting interactive with my tools.

Buy PTFE blades from Connaught Shaving. They have an inexpensive shipping option for us.

Shipping on the order below was under $9CAD and no tax.

Maggard in Michigan also has an inexpensive international shipping rate. I've had several orders from both shops with no issues at all.

 

[Dave Deluxe]

Sharpening GEM SE blades is a waste of time with poor results.

 

[gvw755]

Back in the old days there were devices to sharpen/strop SE blades. One is a Kriss Kross which there are many on eBay, but this is what one looks like:

Kriss Kross Blade Sharpener | eBay

The other is a Scott's, which looks like this (and I think another brand is similar, but can't remember the name):

Antique Scotts Ball Bearing Sharpener Tool 1918 Razor Blade Strop Set in Box | eBay

I have a Scott's and use it to freshen up my wedge blades. Both will work, but for the cost of one, you could just buy via mail order a whole bunch of Gem blades.

 

[Twelvefret]

The reason I do not think it will work is because you do not have a spline as with a SR to set the correct angle. Essentially you are free handing, which works for knives, but not for shaving.

 

[Clay S]

The reason I do not think it will work is because you do not have a spline as with a SR to set the correct angle. Essentially you are free handing, which works for knives, but not for shaving.

Which is why you need a jig. It maintains the correct angle

 

[Clay S]

Sharpening GEM SE blades is a waste of time with poor results.

So is posting on forums

Different people enjoy wasting their time different ways. I like posting. Apparently the OP likes experimenting or honing, or perhaps prepping.

 

[Twelvefret]

Which is why you need a jig. It maintains the correct angle

For a .30 cent blade?

 

[Clay S]

For a .30 cent blade?

See my response to Dave Deluxe 1 message ago.

 

[Twelvefret]

See my response to Dave Deluxe 1 message ago.

 

[Ron R]

I bought some blades at Connaught shaving like @Esox suggested and recieved them just over 3 weeks even during the mail strike in Canada. Great blades on top of that GEM Personna SS PTFE blades. You will not save much trying to resharpen a blade and will not be happy at all.
Welcome To Connaught Shaving
ttps://www.badgerandblade.com/forum/threads/shaving-oddities.547888/

 

[Clay S]

I bought some blades at Connaught shaving like @Esox suggested and recieved them just over 3 weeks even during the mail strike in Canada. Great blades on top of that GEM Personna SS PTFE blades. You will not save much trying to resharpen a blade and will not be happy at all.
Welcome To Connaught Shaving
ttps://www.badgerandblade.com/forum/threads/shaving-oddities.547888/

Good DE thread.

 

[Lord Fatboy]

PM me and I'll send you a couple of the original thick spine carbon steel blades.

 

[Old Hippie]

Y'all're right, and I DO have several packs of Personna PTFE blades coming.

@Clay S: you're the man. Straight on, Brother. It's how I like to waste my time. Actually, I learned a long time ago with other edges (knives, axes, scythes, Coteau Croche, spokeshaves, planes and now razors) that on a tool where the edge is everything, being able to achieve that edge is a useful skill to have. Even when the edge is supported as a consumable. Sharpening is not a waste of time, if you look at it that way.

I was looking at "medical" blades yesterday online. I was interested to see that the basic 3-facet Gem blade comes in basically five different formats: carbon with and without a spine, stainless with and without a spine, and stainess with a STEEL spine. I didn't specifically mark the relevant thread on old SE razors, but somebody noted that the older blades (some with steel spines) were thicker at the spine than modern Gems. Some of that was thicker material, but most of it appeared from the pictures to be due to how much the spine was "creased" as it was folded over the blade. Looser crease; thicker spine. Modern blades get stomped down right flat.

@Lord Fatboy: PM on the way!

OH

 

[Salty O'Rourke]

I was looking at "medical" blades yesterday online. I was interested to see that the basic 3-facet Gem blade comes in basically five different formats: carbon with and without a spine, stainless with and without a spine, and stainess with a STEEL spine. I didn't specifically mark the relevant thread on old SE razors, but somebody noted that the older blades (some with steel spines) were thicker at the spine than modern Gems. Some of that was thicker material, but most of it appeared from the pictures to be due to how much the spine was "creased" as it was folded over the blade. Looser crease; thicker spine. Modern blades get stomped down right flat.

I did a comparison of vintage, early modern, and modern GEM blades in a thread on shimming, with pics. I wonder if the "mashed down" spine is a requirement of the medical lab equipment (tighter tolerances? who knows...) that our blades are produced for.

 

[Lord Fatboy]

I did a comparison of vintage, early modern, and modern GEM blades in a thread on shimming, with pics. I wonder if the "mashed down" spine is a requirement of the medical lab equipment (tighter tolerances? who knows...) that our blades are produced for.

That or ice scrapers...

 

[DBBockius]

I just made an account to make this post lol

Ive been thinking of ways to sharpen a gem blade as well, and was wondering if you could take a thin wooden dowel and carve a slot in the middle to hold the end of the blade

It might even be able to be set up where you could rotate the dowel to flip the blade over and avoid rolling the edge on the blade

Anyone ever attempt this?

 

[Salty O'Rourke]

I just made an account to make this post lol

Ive been thinking of ways to sharpen a gem blade as well, and was wondering if you could take a thin wooden dowel and carve a slot in the middle to hold the end of the blade

It might even be able to be set up where you could rotate the dowel to flip the blade over and avoid rolling the edge on the blade

Anyone ever attempt this?

Many of the old wedge razor sets and even some Gem-style SE sets came with a stropping attachment designed like you one you describe; you often find them in boxes of old razor parts and odds-and-ends lots on ebay. Ever Ready made a stropping tool that you threaded the strop through and used in the same way as an Auto Strop or a Wilkinson Empire razor.

Personally, I think taking the effort to sharpen a $.10 carbon blade (cheaper in bulk, and plentiful) is a poor return on your time investment.