Mild / Autopilot GEM razor?

[catchacoolbreeze]

I'm a bit hesitant about dipping my toe in the proverbial water of a new blade system but @Fedsbackhand made a comment in another thread that his GEM razors give the best ATG performance out of every razor. This sounded intriguing because it took me some time to find a DE razor that I could go ATG with and after 30+ razors, the Overlander is the only one that could do it and I love it.

I've had AC razors (Vector, Colonial The General, Paradigm SE) and found all of them to be wanting. The vector was way too aggressive for me and the other two were ok only if I shaved every 4 days or so. None were good ATG. I don't know if it was a razor issue or if AC blades are just too harsh for me.

That said, I do love the feel of stiff blade razors. What do you all like for mild/auto-pilot (like the Overlander) GEM razors? Do they exist? How are they ATG?

 

[spacemonkey42]

If you're looking for a different way to try a stiff-blade razor, you could consider an injector. If you want mild, get an L Type Schick, which are inexpensive on eBay or a modern adjustable Parker injector, which is also not expensive.

 

[Blackland Razors]

Which blades did you use in your AC razors? They vary in performance greatly so it's important to narrow it down for a comparison.

I don't think any particular blade type is objectively better or worse for ATG. AC blades are not known for being harsh and generally GEM blades are actually a bit harsh on the first few shaves before smoothing out nicely. GEMs are a great blade platform and I'd recommend trying it, but there's nothing about the GEM blade itself that I think guarantees a better ATG experience. Likely comes down to the razor itself.

That said, are you looking for a modern or vintage GEM razor?

 

[Fedsbackhand]

Looking into the WR3 and Atelier Durdan Vestige threads would be a good starting point. There are lots mostly older reviews for the Sabre but bear in mind the razor is being redesigned by Shane this year.

There are other more affordable options like the Shield razor but I haven't tried it so can't vouch for it.

While I get great shaves with vintage GEMs the modern versions are more comfortable ATG.

If you wanted to try the AC format again, Atelier Durdan makes the La Faulx razor which is very comfortable in the classic plate. Like you I found the Vector overly aggressive -- and far too light. Did you try all the available blade choices in the General, Vector and Paradigm? The only AC razor I use on a regular basis is the ATT X1 with Kai Mild blades.

 

[Anchovie666]

I was a dedicated DE shaver for years and swore I would never get into another blade system. Ended up trying an inexpensive YAQI Excalibur with some Feather PROs and BANG - I was hooked. Eventually snagged a nice GEM Pushbutton off E-Bay and ordered a chuck of GEM PTFE blades. It's been about nine months now and I've made the transition to all SE shaving.
The heavier and stiffer blades make the difference. Once you try the GEMs, EveryReady, Star and Treet razors you will move on to Valet Autos, and more.

My GEM Pushbutton was a nice beginner razor for this transition. Mild and easy to use and load. Locks down firmly.

 

[catchacoolbreeze]

Which blades did you use in your AC razors? They vary in performance greatly so it's important to narrow it down for a comparison.

I don't think any particular blade type is objectively better or worse for ATG. AC blades are not known for being harsh and generally GEM blades are actually a bit harsh on the first few shaves before smoothing out nicely. GEMs are a great blade platform and I'd recommend trying it, but there's nothing about the GEM blade itself that I think guarantees a better ATG experience. Likely comes down to the razor itself.

That said, are you looking for a modern or vintage GEM razor?

My working knowledge of AC blades has apparently left my memory, so I had to go into my stash of blades to figure this out – LOL. I have packs of Feather Professionals, Feather Pro Guard, Schick Proline P-30s, Kai Captain Titan Mild, Kai Captain Titan Mild Protouch MG.

I also have blade samples from Try-A-Blade that say Feather Pro Super (the worst blade of any blade I have ever tried DE or SE), Feather Pro-Light, Kai Captain Original, Feather Softguard, Kai Captain Titan Protouch MG. I would have to go through my shaving spreadsheet to see what I recorded with regards to what blades I used in what, but I was pretty methodical about giving each razor a good shot at least 3 or 4 of these.

I don’t have 100% certainty as to why AC didn't worked out for me so far but I suspect it had something to do with blade angle and/or aggression. When I looked at the blade angle relative to the top cap/bottom cap, they all were considerably steeper than my current go-to razor which is the Overlander. Also, they all were more aggressive. Obviously, you can ride the top cap to shallow things out a bit more but that would also add to the aggression as the safety bar would no longer be on the face pushing the skin down. I ***think*** a winning combo for me involves having a shallower angle of attack of the blade (inherent in the razor design in how it positions the blade) as well as being able to run a neutral angle (top cap and safety bar) on face. My beard growth is almost flat against my face which complicates things as most people generally just have the phenomenon on their neck (if at all). Steep angle seems to tug more for me and Gem Razor “look” pretty shallow but I know nothing about them.

With regards to vintage or modern – I don’t necessarily have a preference for either. However, I would say it would be cool to get some thing relatively cheap just to test out to see my face could handle the blades. I imagine newer designs have refined things a bit but that is just speculation. I hope that answers your question without getting too much in the weeds.

 

[catchacoolbreeze]

Looking into the WR3 and Atelier Durdan Vestige threads would be a good starting point. There are lots mostly older reviews for the Sabre but bear in mind the razor is being redesigned by Shane this year.

There are other more affordable options like the Shield razor but I haven't tried it so can't vouch for it.

While I get great shaves with vintage GEMs the modern versions are more comfortable ATG.

If you wanted to try the AC format again, Atelier Durdan makes the La Faulx razor which is very comfortable in the classic plate. Like you I found the Vector overly aggressive -- and far too light. Did you try all the available blade choices in the General, Vector and Paradigm? The only AC razor I use on a regular basis is the ATT X1 with Kai Mild blades.

I appreciate the feedback. I will definitely check out those threads. With regards to AC, I have a ton of blades but the only SE I have left is the General. I could go back and play with it again but I took it out a month or two ago from in annual hibernation and I used it with a Feather Pro and my face was left pretty raw. I will have to summon up the courage to go back at it.

 

[catchacoolbreeze]

I was a dedicated DE shaver for years and swore I would never get into another blade system. Ended up trying an inexpensive YAQI Excalibur with some Feather PROs and BANG - I was hooked. Eventually snagged a nice GEM Pushbutton off E-Bay and ordered a chuck of GEM PTFE blades. It's been about nine months now and I've made the transition to all SE shaving.
The heavier and stiffer blades make the difference. Once you try the GEMs, EveryReady, Star and Treet razors you will move on to Valet Autos, and more.

My GEM Pushbutton was a nice beginner razor for this transition. Mild and easy to use and load. Locks down firmly.

Awesome, I will see if I can find one. It seems the consensus from prelim research is that its mild. My biggest problem with vintage and ebay is worrying if they are in proper condition. Thanks again.

 

[Blackland Razors]

My working knowledge of AC blades has apparently left my memory, so I had to go into my stash of blades to figure this out – LOL. I have packs of Feather Professionals, Feather Pro Guard, Schick Proline P-30s, Kai Captain Titan Mild, Kai Captain Titan Mild Protouch MG.

I also have blade samples from Try-A-Blade that say Feather Pro Super (the worst blade of any blade I have ever tried DE or SE), Feather Pro-Light, Kai Captain Original, Feather Softguard, Kai Captain Titan Protouch MG. I would have to go through my shaving spreadsheet to see what I recorded with regards to what blades I used in what, but I was pretty methodical about giving each razor a good shot at least 3 or 4 of these.

I don’t have 100% certainty as to why AC didn't worked out for me so far but I suspect it had something to do with blade angle and/or aggression. When I looked at the blade angle relative to the top cap/bottom cap, they all were considerably steeper than my current go-to razor which is the Overlander. Also, they all were more aggressive. Obviously, you can ride the top cap to shallow things out a bit more but that would also add to the aggression as the safety bar would no longer be on the face pushing the skin down. I ***think*** a winning combo for me involves having a shallower angle of attack of the blade (inherent in the razor design in how it positions the blade) as well as being able to run a neutral angle (top cap and safety bar) on face. My beard growth is almost flat against my face which complicates things as most people generally just have the phenomenon on their neck (if at all). Steep angle seems to tug more for me and Gem Razor “look” pretty shallow but I know nothing about them.

With regards to vintage or modern – I don’t necessarily have a preference for either. However, I would say it would be cool to get some thing relatively cheap just to test out to see my face could handle the blades. I imagine newer designs have refined things a bit but that is just speculation. I hope that answers your question without getting too much in the weeds.

Really helpful answer. Most GEM razors do use a shallower angle so that’s good. For low-cost vintage, I think you’ll want to avoid the Micromatic line because it’s going to be on the blade-forward and efficient side. I like the Featherweight for a milder shave, but there are other GEM models that could work here.

For low-cost modern, there isn’t much currently available. The PAA Starling is the most recent I can think of, but I don’t believe it’s currently available. You might be able to find one secondhand. There are higher cost ones (including our own Sabre), but for a budget option to try out a GEM, I’d personally pick up a GEM Featherweight.

Make sure you get some of the good stainless steel PTFE-coated blades. I don’t recommend the carbon blades (like Star).

 

[catchacoolbreeze]

Really helpful answer. Most GEM razors do use a shallower angle so that’s good. For low-cost vintage, I think you’ll want to avoid the Micromatic line because it’s going to be on the blade-forward and efficient side. I like the Featherweight for a milder shave, but there are other GEM models that could work here.

For low-cost modern, there isn’t much currently available. The PAA Starling is the most recent I can think of, but I don’t believe it’s currently available. You might be able to find one secondhand. There are higher cost ones (including our own Sabre), but for a budget option to try out a GEM, I’d personally pick up a GEM Featherweight.

Make sure you get some of the good stainless steel PTFE-coated blades. I don’t recommend the carbon blades (like Star).

Excellent thank you. That seems to fall in line with a cool graphic that @Ron R put together. He ranks the g-bar, push button, and featherweight all on the milder side of things so that might seem like a good place to start. Not sure the difference between them yet though.

 

[catchacoolbreeze]

Regarding the g-bar, push button, and featherweight - for anyone that has experience with them - do any of them have better blade clamping than the others or are they all pretty similar? Blade chatter is my nemesis ATG and its hard to tell by pictures how well the mechanisms keep the blade in place.

 

[Fedsbackhand]

I appreciate the feedback. I will definitely check out those threads. With regards to AC, I have a ton of blades but the only SE I have left is the General. I could go back and play with it again but I took it out a month or two ago from in annual hibernation and I used it with a Feather Pro and my face was left pretty raw. I will have to summon up the courage to go back at it.

I’ve never liked the Feather Pro in any AC razor. Kai blades have always been more comfortable.

Featherweight, G-bar or Natural Angle and Push Button all essentially have the same spring loaded design in terms of holding the blade. The G-bar or the similar Natural Angle will add some heft. The standard Featherweight is incredibly light, so go easy with pressure. There were a couple of Featherweight head designs - I have both versions, well actually one is an Ever Ready Featherweight and the other a GEM model. Plus a few Natural Angles: the Ever Ready version of the G-bar. These are all clamped with the flip top spring mechanism, i.e. not supported at the side notches or have a centre peg like the Micromatics. So technically the Micromatics hold the blade better but in practice there is isn't a great deal of difference. Of course the Featherweight is milder than the original Micromatic.

 

[catchacoolbreeze]

I’ve never liked the Feather Pro in any AC razor. Kai blades have always been more comfortable.

Featherweight, G-bar or Natural Angle and Push Button all essentially have the same spring loaded design in terms of holding the blade. The G-bar or the similar Natural Angle will add some heft. The standard Featherweight is incredibly light, so go easy with pressure. There were a couple of Featherweight head designs - I have both versions, well actually one is an Ever Ready Featherweight and the other a GEM model. Plus a few Natural Angles: the Ever Ready version of the G-bar. These are all clamped with the flip top spring mechanism, i.e. not supported at the side notches or have a centre peg like the Micromatics. So technically the Micromatics hold the blade better but in practice there is isn't a great deal of difference. Of course the Featherweight is milder than the original Micromatic.

Awesome! Thanks for the feedback. I just picked up G-bar from e-bay $18 with shipping. Of the 3 models, this seemed to be the easiest to find in really nice condition and that's how that decision was made

GEM PTFE blades from Connaught are also en route for for $27. From the looks of things, I imagine 1 of 3 things could happen.

1. I just go back to my DE world and decide on if/when I get a new gap in a WR2.
2. I just discovered one of the cheapest deals in wet shaving and live in contentment and/or buy a couple more cheap razors.
3. This sparks RAD like you read about and go after after one of new modern designs to make GEM even better.

I'm totally screwed if its all 3.

 

[Fedsbackhand]

It's a shame we are in completely different timezones or I'd happily lend you some razors.

Enjoy the G-bar when it and the blades arrive.

 

[catchacoolbreeze]

It's a shame we are in completely different timezones or I'd happily lend you some razors.

Enjoy the G-bar when it and the blades arrive.

That would have been awesome. I appreciate the sentiment. After reading all of the demos and pass arounds you got going on over there, it def sounds like you all know what's going on. Looking forward to trying out Gem - not sure why I've waited so long.

 

[Sethology]

That would have been awesome. I appreciate the sentiment. After reading all of the demos and pass arounds you got going on over there, it def sounds like you all know what's going on. Looking forward to trying out Gem - not sure why I've waited so long.

Any luck with the gems? What razor did you try

 

[Jmiguel2k]

I'm a bit hesitant about dipping my toe in the proverbial water of a new blade system but @Fedsbackhand made a comment in another thread that his GEM razors give the best ATG performance out of every razor. This sounded intriguing because it took me some time to find a DE razor that I could go ATG with and after 30+ razors, the Overlander is the only one that could do it and I love it.

I've had AC razors (Vector, Colonial The General, Paradigm SE) and found all of them to be wanting. The vector was way too aggressive for me and the other two were ok only if I shaved every 4 days or so. None were good ATG. I don't know if it was a razor issue or if AC blades are just too harsh for me.

That said, I do love the feel of stiff blade razors. What do you all like for mild/auto-pilot (like the Overlander) GEM razors? Do they exist? How are they ATG?

Among the modern ones, I would recommend the Blackland Sabre with plate 1. It is one of the smoothest Gem blade razors I have ever tried. And they also have the Shield Gem in aluminum, SS and titanium.

 

[Ron R]

Awesome! Thanks for the feedback. I just picked up G-bar from e-bay $18 with shipping. Of the 3 models, this seemed to be the easiest to find in really nice condition and that's how that decision was made

GEM PTFE blades from Connaught are also en route for for $27. From the looks of things, I imagine 1 of 3 things could happen.

1. I just go back to my DE world and decide on if/when I get a new gap in a WR2.
2. I just discovered one of the cheapest deals in wet shaving and live in contentment and/or buy a couple more cheap razors.
3. This sparks RAD like you read about and go after after one of new modern designs to make GEM even better.

I'm totally screwed if its all 3.

You should enjoy the Gem G bar IMO, they are not overly aggressive and will give you a nice shave. It might take a few shaves to dial in the razor to your liking. The Gem G bar was my first razor to start shaving with and it produced some nice shaves for myself. When using a fresh Gem PTFE blade, I like to use milder ASR razors at the start and work my way along to the more aggressive razors seems to work great.
If you want a milder Micromatic the Micromatic Flying wing is the mildest of the 3 main Micromatic models and has a ingenious way of clamping the blade with a rack and pinion top cap clamping the blade firmly if that is your concern. It clamps and pushes the blade forward to the blade stops + firmly clamps. The Gem Personna SS PTFE blade is 9/1000 inches thick and solid compared to DE blades and has excellent longevity, better than the AC blades for longevity also IMO.
This archived picture chart might help you, this is what I experienced when using Gem razors when first shaving with them + results when I first used them years ago. I get some of the best shaves with ASR Gem razors with the Gem PTFE blade, I still use them weekly in my large razor rotation because they are awesome.

Have some great shaves!

 

[catchacoolbreeze]

Any luck with the gems? What razor did you try

Did not have any luck with GEM yet. I got a g-bar and it was too aggressive for me. While appreciate going shallow towards the cap, the safety bar was no where near my face offering me any protection and it was harsh. I then tried riding the bar (a big no no but I thought, "why not - live a little) and it was actually better but didn't have that really great stiff blade pop of the hair that stiff razors have for face feel that I like in either very rigid DE razors or AC razors. That being said, I found the blades considerably sharper than AC blades which was very interesting to me.

 

[catchacoolbreeze]

Among the modern ones, I would recommend the Blackland Sabre with plate 1. It is one of the smoothest Gem blade razors I have ever tried. And they also have the Shield Gem in aluminum, SS and titanium.

Thanks for the recommendation. My understanding is that they are out of production due to a redesign (at least there are no level 1 plates left). I'm curious is it more mild than a gbar?