Disheartened with Cotis, wanna try DMT's & lapping film

[JGKC9AYC]

I just can't figure out these coti's. I've got a pretty good sized one...7 x 1 1/2...but for the life of me I can't put an edge on my straights without wearing down the spine. Watching the various videos is like watching a "how to play banjo" video...they show you how to do it, but a video can't hardly teach technique, etc.
So, i'll probably be selling my (3rd) coti & getting a DMT325 & DMT1200. For those of you that have one (& i've been pestering one that does far too much in pm), just how much pressure is "firm" pressure?
Does one use "firm" pressure on the 325 when working out nicks, etc? Does one use "firm" pressure on the 1200 when setting the bevel? How can a dumb ol' man like me relate to "firm" pressure?
As a side note, has anyone had any troubles with the Naniwa SS1000 developing "worm holes"? I have one & have had to lap it several times (used wet dry sandpaper on thick glass) & the last time I did, I noticed a "worm hole" type flaw. It's about 1/4" wide & 1 1/4" long & about a sixteenth deep or so...slight arc to it. It's like I sat a piece of plastic on a hot stovetop burner. Anyhow, i'm disgusted with it too & plan on sending it back with a note. It's past the return date, so I guess i'll have to give them ideas on what to do with it.
Any assistance with my honing questions will be appreciated.

 

[Proinsias]

If you're wearing down the spine using a coticule it sounds like you're overdoing the pressure. Pressure on a DMT 325 will quickly eat up a razor. I've heard 'pencil eraser' used as a description of bevel setting pressure on a coticule which I would say is fairly similar to what I use, on a digital scale I think I was registering about 150 grams.

 

[GreekGuy]

a DMT 325 is too course for honing razors. The DMT 1200 could be used for bevel setting and removing chips. But IMHO, trying to set a bevel on a coticule isn't exactly a fun and easy task. It works, but there are "better" stones for the job. I would suggest setting a bevel with another stone and then using the coticule for the rest of your honing. Once you get the hang of it, you can go back to the coticule for setting the bevel, but I wouldn't recommend learning on a coticule by setting bevels

 

[Seraphim]

DMT 600 is about as low as you want to go for using on a razor.

DMT1200 is very good for bevel setting.


And, by all means, please join The revolution!

 

[Obiwan]

LMAO

 

[noahpictures]

The last pic is hilarious!

 

[JGKC9AYC]

Well, to give an example, today I recived an older razor in the mail. Good condition...really good. Seemed sharp, so I plucked a hair & it popped it in a couple of spots. Cool, I thought. So I took it to my BBW/Coti combo, put some slurry on the BBW side, gave it a few (what I thought) were light passes, rinsed, a few more, flipped it over & did about 25 laps on the coti side & now it won't pop a hair.
I think I have the Midas touch with the exception of everything I touch turns to $hit.

 

[dpetrzelka]

If you want to touch up a razor that already popping hairs you may want to try just light X's under running water - no slurry - no BBW.

 

[noahpictures]

Well, to give an example, today I recived an older razor in the mail. Good condition...really good. Seemed sharp, so I plucked a hair & it popped it in a couple of spots. Cool, I thought. So I took it to my BBW/Coti combo, put some slurry on the BBW side, gave it a few (what I thought) were light passes, rinsed, a few more, flipped it over & did about 25 laps on the coti side & now it won't pop a hair.
I think I have the Midas touch with the exception of everything I touch turns to $hit.

I honed on film for a long time before buying my first coti. Here are my suggestions:

1. Don't sell your coti.
2. Don't use the BBW side until you become proficient.
3. Don't use pressure. Let the slurry do the work. Begin with heavy slurry and dilute after twenty strokes with a couple drops of water. Make sure the slurry doesn't dry up. YouTube Unicot method to get an idea if setting bevels on a coti.
4. Using rolling x-stroke beginning with the heel and ending with the toe. Or circles. I use circles at first then end with rolling X-strokes during each stage.
5. I finish on misty slurry (half water half slurry).
6. Lately I have been using roma tomatoes to check bevel keenness. It works better for me than other methods and its more practical than using hair.
7. Strop immediately after you finish honing.
8. Shave.
9. Be patient. It takes time to learn

Also I always use tape.

 

[Sergio Campos]

Well, to give an example, today I recived an older razor in the mail. Good condition...really good. Seemed sharp, so I plucked a hair & it popped it in a couple of spots. Cool, I thought. So I took it to my BBW/Coti combo, put some slurry on the BBW side, gave it a few (what I thought) were light passes, rinsed, a few more, flipped it over & did about 25 laps on the coti side & now it won't pop a hair.
I think I have the Midas touch with the exception of everything I touch turns to $hit.

I did that too once! I think I worsened the edge by being too aggressive, in this case too aggressive means slurry. I imagined that the edge did not need all of the slurry power, and it made the edge worse. So I cleaned the coticule, honed a bit with water only, and then honed under running water for a while. It took a while under the running water, but the edge improved after a while. I was happy that I did not in the end destroy the edge.

 

[Doc226]

DMT 600 is about as low as you want to go for using on a razor.

DMT1200 is very good for bevel setting.


And, by all means, please join The revolution!

 

[Lomez]

When bevel setting on DMT1200, how much pressure are you using?

I ordered some el cheapo razors to practice honing on, I used heavy pressure for a while, but couldnt get it to shave arm hair until I used almost no pressure.

 

[Doc226]

6. Lately I have been using roma tomatoes to check bevel keenness. It works better for me than other methods and its more practical than using hair.

Seen that used before

 

[Seraphim]

Oh great, here comes the peanut gallery.....


Yes, please explain to the OP about the ease and simplicity of JNats. After that we'll get around to discussing how affordable they are....

You can start with a thesaurus of arcane terminology you JNat Illuminati throw around, designed to obfuscate and befuddle simple minded folk like yours truly.


JGKC, don't let these other guys steer you wrong...

Ditch the coti, don't start down the Don Quixote JNat trail, get yerself some film and a DMT and hone, hone, hone....

Trust me!

 

[Doc226]

Oh great, here comes the peanut gallery.....


Yes, please explain to the OP about the ease and simplicity of JNats. After that we'll get around to discussing how affordable they are....

You can start with a thesaurus of arcane terminology you JNat Illuminati throw around, designed to obfuscate and befuddle simple minded folk like yours truly.


JGKC, don't let these other guys steer you wrong...

Ditch the coti, don't start down the Don Quixote JNat trail, get yerself some film and a DMT and hone, hone, hone....

Trust me!

Give me a JNAT, a DMT and I will get you a shave ready razor. Terminology not needed, steel-rock-rub together. So easy even caveman can do it (and did)

 

[Seraphim]

6. Lately I have been using roma tomatoes to check bevel keenness. It works better for me than other methods and its more practical than using hair.

Seen that used before

How about shaving the fuzz off a peach instead?

Isn't that how nectarines are made?

And then BBs:

 

[Seraphim]

Give me a JNAT, a DMT and I will get you a shave ready razor. Terminology not needed, steel-rock-rub together. So easy even caveman can do it (and did)

Which JNat should one buy?

 

[Fuzzy Chops]

Well, to give an example, today I recived an older razor in the mail. Good condition...really good. Seemed sharp, so I plucked a hair & it popped it in a couple of spots. Cool, I thought. So I took it to my BBW/Coti combo, put some slurry on the BBW side, gave it a few (what I thought) were light passes, rinsed, a few more, flipped it over & did about 25 laps on the coti side & now it won't pop a hair.
I think I have the Midas touch with the exception of everything I touch turns to $hit.

What this suggests to me is that the razor did not have a bevel set on a flat stone.
As an example, I recently purchased a TI historical Le Grelot from Rasurpur. Outstanding edge, sharp sharp but not harsh.
Martin told me it was the factory edge and that he only touched it up on diamond paste. It gave me 5 or 6 good shaves before it started to deteriorate.
I tried a light touch up on a Coticule and took it from HHT3 to HHT1.
Last night I put marker on the bevel and started with the DMT 1200 - after about 10 minutes there was still marker on an inch long section of the edge...

 

[global_dev]

Which JNat should one buy?

isn't it obvious, you always buy the good ones!

 

[global_dev]

What this suggests to me is that the razor did not have a bevel set on a flat stone.
As an example, I recently purchased a TI historical Le Grelot from Rasurpur. Outstanding edge, sharp sharp but not harsh.
Martin told me it was the factory edge and that he only touched it up on diamond paste. It gave me 5 or 6 good shaves before it started to deteriorate.
I tried a light touch up on a Coticule and took it from HHT3 to HHT1.
Last night I put marker on the bevel and started with the DMT 1200 - after about 10 minutes there was still marker on an inch long section of the edge...

perhaps double beveled? granted you say factory and then coti, but unless a double bevel was involved, i don't see how the marker is still there if the strokes are appropriate..