What's coming out of YOUR roaster?

[Wid]

Considering the speed of the air popper, I am guessing that the first and second blended into each other. I was leaving a hint... this is definitely second crack. The oil and colour are a dead give away. And that's fine, his earlier roast was fully French so this is less as he said. I don't want to sound critical because I don't have a ton of experience, just help where something is obvious. This is where timing from first pop to dump can become helpful.

When roasting this batch I went to the point that i heard the beans starting to crack and waited till the beans were making the sound of popping corn. There are no oils present on the beans as there was in the first batch. Maybe I'm getting the wrong meaning of "first crack". Do I pull the beans to cool when I hear the very first sound or do I wait till the beans are at a fully mid to end of the the cracking sound? Being so new I'm not sure my terminology is correct

The one on the left is what I thought was first crack, the one on the right was second crack.

 

[TexLaw]

Do I pull the beans to cool when I hear the very first sound or do I wait till the beans are at a fully mid to end of the the cracking sound?

The popping sound is first crack, and you certainly want to get through first crack. Second crack is the more faint sound that is more like ticking, snapping, or crackling than popping. Theoretically, second crack comes after a pause once first crack finishes, but second crack is not quite as predictable or uniform as first crack.

First crack and second crack are two different things altogether. First crack is the bean exploding when the vapor/steam built up finally forces it's way out (like popcorn). Second crack is the cellulose matrix of the bean breaking apart. Each bean will only "pop" once for first crack, but each bean potentially could "snap" more than once for second crack. So, the idea that "first crack" is an interval instead of an instant only makes sense when you have more than one bean in the roaster, while "second crack" likely would be an interval even if you only had one bean in the roaster.

I'm relying on others' expertise here because I have no experience roasting with poppers, but it sounds like the heat of a popper is such that a bean that pops early for first crack could very well get to second crack while other beans are just starting to pop for first crack. That may have happened here because I see some signs of second crack in the photos you posted.

The color also is rather dark for beans that did not get to second crack, but that also could be attributed to the very high heat of a popper darkening the outside of the bean more quickly than a drum roaster. Your typical popper has a fairly constant, high environmental temperature as opposed to the curve of a drum roaster.

 

[APBinNCA]

That’s a much better answer and is why I was trying not to say too much. There can be multiple things to figure out with any roaster, but the speed of the popper complicates things. Please do continue roasting and watch some videos specifically on poppers.

Edit: I see my mistake, the plastic bag made it look oily. The first one doesn’t, but it isn’t uncommon for beans to start releasing oils after cooling so that’s what my brain assumed happened after bagging.

 

[Wid]

That’s a much better answer and is why I was trying not to say too much. There can be multiple things to figure out with any roaster, but the speed of the popper complicates things. Please do continue roasting and watch some videos specifically on poppers.

I really like the input, whether positive or not. It’s the only way to learn besides doing it.

 

[Dnallehekaj]

@Wid Do you time your roasts? If I remember correctly, my weaker air poppers would roast almost to or into second crack in 9 minutes. A year or two ago, I found, tested, and gave away a much higher wattage air popper to a friend that got it through first crack in a little over 7 minutes.

A lot of things I read at the time were encouraging a minute and a half development time (time after first crack starts), but I could not get close to that without second crack starting. Maybe 30 seconds.

I used an old kidney bean can as a chimney on my air poppers. Open both ends, clean it, dry it, and bend an end a little so it can fit into the top of the popping chamber. This kept beans from flying out, and made my roasts a little more reliable when it got windy outside.

I really miss how well air poppers separate chaff from the beans, but I do not miss the batch sizes.

Edit: Saw your other thread, you time your roasts, and they're QUICK!!!

 

[Wid]

@Wid Do you time your roasts? If I remember correctly, my weaker air poppers would roast almost to or into second crack in 9 minutes. A year or two ago, I found, tested, and gave away a much higher wattage air popper to a friend that got it through first crack in a little over 7 minutes.

A lot of things I read at the time were encouraging a minute and a half development time (time after first crack starts), but I could not get close to that without second crack starting. Maybe 30 seconds.

I used an old kidney bean can as a chimney on my air poppers. Open both ends, clean it, dry it, and bend an end a little so it can fit into the top of the popping chamber. This kept beans from flying out, and made my roasts a little more reliable when it got windy outside.

I really miss how well air poppers separate chaff from the beans, but I do not miss the batch sizes.

Edit: Saw your other thread, you time your roasts, and they're QUICK!!!

Thank you for the reply, the total times are pretty quick. I've backed off on the times a bit as I was still getting a fairly dark roast, not that I mind, I like a dark roast. I have some beans that is recommended light to medium.

I'm going to try the chimney mod and see how that goes. On my last batch I kept the popper lid off in an attempt to lower the temp.

 

[Dnallehekaj]

I forgot about popper lids, that's probably doing the same thing. The first one I ever had started melting during a roast, so I threw out any other lids and went with the can. The popping chamber was the same (or close enough) on every subsequent popper, so I only ever had to use one.

 

[APBinNCA]

Still analysing my roast profile...

 

[Herrenberg]

Still analysing my roast profile...

Better you than me. I've only roasted decaf a few times, and it was tricky. Had to back way off on the heat.

 

[Wid]

Still analysing my roast profile...

What roaster do you use ?

 

[APBinNCA]

What roaster do you use ?

Hottop, @Sweet Maria's
(that's the face when you look up the price)

 

[APBinNCA]

Better you than me. I've only roasted decaf a few times, and it was tricky. Had to back way off on the heat.

After looking at the data, it was 2 minutes faster to dry end and that's where I start bringing the heat down aggressively. Fan @2 until first crack. I loaded it @200C which is about 450F. The fast time to DE makes all the numbers look wrong, but I am pretty happy with the profile I achieved. It's 2:15 from FC to dump, heat 20%/fan 3. I would be interested where things went wrong for you because I was fully expecting problems that didn't materialise. Will be tasting tomorrow.

 

[Wid]

Hottop, @Sweet Maria's
(that's the face when you look up the price)

A little more than a popcorn popper lol.

 

[Herrenberg]

After looking at the data, it was 2 minutes faster to dry end and that's where I start bringing the heat down aggressively. Fan @2 until first crack. I loaded it @200C which is about 450F. The fast time to DE makes all the numbers look wrong, but I am pretty happy with the profile I achieved. It's 2:15 from FC to dump, heat 20%/fan 3. I would be interested where things went wrong for you because I was fully expecting problems that didn't materialise. Will be tasting tomorrow.

It has been a long time, so I don't remember, but "2 minutes faster to dry end" is definitely something I'd have called "a problem." I think I wound up adjusting the initial heat to 5 1/2 on the propane gauge. I don't remember what I did with the charge temperature. I could look it up, if it woul dhelp. All roasters are different, so for reference, my initial heat, on coffees I have not sorted out yet, is 9 for a Kenyan (such magnificently robust beans), 7 1/2 to 8 for an Ethiopian/Tanzanian/Rwanda, 6 for a Yemen (those tiny beans), and 5 for a Sumatran (stretching out the drying phase).

 

[APBinNCA]

It has been a long time, so I don't remember, but "2 minutes faster to dry end" is definitely something I'd have called "a problem." I think I wound up adjusting the initial heat to 5 1/2 on the propane gauge. I don't remember what I did with the charge temperature. I could look it up, if it woul dhelp. All roasters are different, so for reference, my initial heat, on coffees I have not sorted out yet, is 9 for a Kenyan (such magnificently robust beans), 7 1/2 to 8 for an Ethiopian/Tanzanian/Rwanda, 6 for a Yemen (those tiny beans), and 5 for a Sumatran (stretching out the drying phase).

Ah, that's actually helpful enough. I am just about to roast 3 batches of Yemen and don't want to screw that up! I may have to consider lowering my charge temperature, I think I was planning 390F. Maybe on the next decaf, I will keep the heat down until dry end. I didn't see anything concerning, I was about consult the Rao bible... what could go wrong with a quick dry when the rest of the roast is textbook? Thanks

 

[Herrenberg]

what could go wrong with a quick dry when the rest of the roast is textbook? Thanks

Maybe nothing. But those decaf beans have been seriously abused before they get into your roaster, and have to be treated gently. If the indications are good, and the coffee tastes good (for decaf), you're fine.

 

[APBinNCA]

Second try, let's not talk about the first batch(still going to try it). This was slow, lower heat throughout and I am happy how it looks. Will I be happy with the taste?

 

[Wid]

Second try, let's not talk about the first batch(still going to try it). This was slow, lower heat throughout and I am happy how it looks. Will I be happy with the taste?

Looks good to me. When I did a batch of Yemen Haraaz, medium roast, it was loaded with chaff too. I rubbed them in my hands to get rid of most if not all of it. It's in my cup right now

 

[APBinNCA]

Still analysing my roast profile...

Well, this turned out undrinkable. Remember kids, with an actual roaster, if your roast profile looks defective...
it is!

 

[Mick]

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