Testing grit rating of a JNAT?

[johnmrson]

I'm just after a sanity check to make sure that the conclusion from my testing is right.
When razor starts to tug a little and stropping doesn't make too much difference, I normally give it about 60-70 laps on the Shapton 12k and it is good to go again for another few months.
Now, my 7/8 Harner started to tug a little last week so instead of giving it the usual laps on the Shapton 12k, I gave it 70 laps on my JNAT (Nakayama Asagi). I did a couple of strokes with it during my shave today and whilst it was a little better, it wasn't much better and certainly not shave ready.
Now my conclusion is that the the Nakayama Asagi is therefore a higher grit than the 12k. Does that sound about right?

 

[danjared]

Your asagi is not a synthetic stone. I would not expect it to give the same results if used in the same way as your Shapton 12k regardless of how fine it is.

 

[mainaman]

The Jnats do not have grits, in Japan they are divided in 3 categories, rough, medium, and fine.
If he razor off the stone feels finer than your Shapton 12k, then that is all there is to it, it feels finer. You can't judge grit by the feeling for natural stones, because the grit particles are not spherical as the synthetic stones ones are.

 

[johnmrson]

Perhaps grit rating isn't the right term for what I'm looking for. I guess I'm looking at where it would fit in to my honing progression to get the best use of it. Is it better after a synthetic 6k, 12k or even 16k?

 

[Woodash]

Perhaps grit rating isn't the right term for what I'm looking for. I guess I'm looking at where it would fit in to my honing progression to get the best use of it. Is it better after a synthetic 6k, 12k or even 16k?

If you only use it with water, your asagi is more or less a ~fixed grit (however you define it) and you're the only one who can determine where it fits with respect to your other hones. If you use it with slurry and/or nagura, then it can 'fit' in many places, depending on how you choose to 'paint your picture'.

 

[mainaman]

Perhaps grit rating isn't the right term for what I'm looking for. I guess I'm looking at where it would fit in to my honing progression to get the best use of it. Is it better after a synthetic 6k, 12k or even 16k?

well this question only can be answered with experimentation.
try your stone after 12k and after 16k and see how you like it best. If the stone is quality it will be much better finisher than your 12 and 16k stones.

 

[Disburden]

The OOzuku Asagi I bought from Maxim is finishing a lot finer than a Shapton Sweet 16. Where did you get the Nakayama Asagi from?

 

[johnmrson]

The OOzuku Asagi I bought from Maxim is finishing a lot finer than a Shapton Sweet 16. Where did you get the Nakayama Asagi from?

I got it from 330mate on eBay.

 

[azmark]

I got it from 330mate on eBay.

I was going to pick one up from him and I'm glad I emailed him first because he said that it was more suited for kitchen knives. I'd email him for any of his stones or if you want one ask for specific ones for razors.

 

[Fbones24]

I was going to pick one up from him and I'm glad I emailed him first because he said that it was more suited for kitchen knives. I'd email him for any of his stones or if you want one ask for specific ones for razors.

I know Maksim shaves with a straight, so I trust his opinion, but does 330 mate? I will say that I wanted to purchase a Nakayama from Maksim and he told me it was not suitable for finishing straights. He instead sold me a Takashima Kiita which he said was a very hard/fine stone for finishing.

About a month later, I purchased the same Nakayama that I originally wanted to purchase from Maksim from a member of this forum. After using both, the Nakayama puts a much finer edge on my razors than the Takashima. In fact, I have not used the Takashima since I purchased the Nakayama.

What does this proove? I don't know? I also am a novice honer, so for all I know the Takashima is in fact the harder, finer stone? I just know that the edge of my Nakayama suits my face better when I shave. I think ultimately, that is all that matters.

 

[johnmrson]

I was going to pick one up from him and I'm glad I emailed him first because he said that it was more suited for kitchen knives. I'd email him for any of his stones or if you want one ask for specific ones for razors.

I did e-mail him before I bought it. It was listed as for razors but I just wanted to make sure. Although his English wasn't very good, he said it was a very fine finishing stone for razors.

 

[azmark]

I know Maksim shaves with a straight, so I trust his opinion, but does 330 mate? I will say that I wanted to purchase a Nakayama from Maksim and he told me it was not suitable for finishing straights. He instead sold me a Takashima Kiita which he said was a very hard/fine stone for finishing.

About a month later, I purchased the same Nakayama that I originally wanted to purchase from Maksim from a member of this forum. After using both, the Nakayama puts a much finer edge on my razors than the Takashima. In fact, I have not used the Takashima since I purchased the Nakayama.

What does this proove? I don't know?

Ouch, my head hurts

I did e-mail him before I bought it. It was listed as for razors but I just wanted to make sure. Although his English wasn't very good, he said it was a very fine finishing stone for razors.

If he said that it was listed then I wouldn't doubt it. He's told me to not buy stones for the thought I wasn't going to be happy with it. Why I brought it up, I don't know either

 

[heirkb]

I know Maksim shaves with a straight, so I trust his opinion, but does 330 mate? I will say that I wanted to purchase a Nakayama from Maksim and he told me it was not suitable for finishing straights. He instead sold me a Takashima Kiita which he said was a very hard/fine stone for finishing.

About a month later, I purchased the same Nakayama that I originally wanted to purchase from Maksim from a member of this forum. After using both, the Nakayama puts a much finer edge on my razors than the Takashima. In fact, I have not used the Takashima since I purchased the Nakayama.

What does this proove? I don't know? I also am a novice honer, so for all I know the Takashima is in fact the harder, finer stone? I just know that the edge of my Nakayama suits my face better when I shave. I think ultimately, that is all that matters.

I wonder what this is about. I know Stefan has found Maxim's recommendations on the Ozukus to be reliable. Maxim rates how hard it will be to use a given stone on his site, so that may have something to do with it. He told me harder stones are harder to use.

 

[mainaman]

I got it from 330mate on eBay.

I general 330 mate is not know for carrying quality razor hones. May be yours is a good one.

 

[johnmrson]

I general 330 mate is not know for carrying quality razor hones. May be yours is a good one.

I don't know yet whether it is or not. That's one of the things I'm trying to figure out. I did ask the question a while ago about sourcing a JNAT and a few people said they'd got stones off him that were pretty good.

 

[azmark]

I general 330 mate is not know for carrying quality razor hones. May be yours is a good one.

I got luck with my two from him but I asked him questions on about 4 stones one time and he said neither one was razor quality. So pretty much I agree, he'll be honest about it though.

 

[danjared]

I general 330 mate is not know for carrying quality razor hones. May be yours is a good one.

He's known for people saying that about him. I certainly didn't have that problem, nor have many others.

If you politely ask for a stone that is for razors, I imagine that he'd provide due diligence in meeting that need. If you ask for a really good stone at a ridiculously low price, I don't think he'll care much to oblige.

 

[mainaman]

He's known for people saying that about him. I certainly didn't have that problem, nor have many others.

I wonder how many members, that are experienced honers, can confirm their 330 mate stone is indeed great finisher for razors.

 

[danjared]

I wonder how many members, that are experienced honers, can confirm their 330 mate stone is indeed great finisher for razors.

I had good results with the one I had. I would have to fact-check, but I believe Telly has as well. (I believe the stones that were from his group buy were from the same source.)

Edit: As a side note, it's true that communicating with this vendor can be a bit painful, but that is not the issue at hand.

 

[SliceOfLife]

I wonder how many members, that are experienced honers, can confirm their 330 mate stone is indeed great finisher for razors.

My 330mate Ohiro Suita works fine as a finisher. It isn't as fine as my Karasu from MMJP, but it's finer than my Karasu rubbing stone from Maxim and my Konyama Razor Hone from Dicks, and almost as fine as my Asagi Tomo Nagura from Chef Knives To Go (I think that's where I got it). That's just grit though. The shape is odd (about 5x5 or so... The part I USE is like 4x3"), and it needed lapping when I got it, but it is almost as easy to use as my Konyama Razor Hone (which is damned easy to use).

Of course this isn't a Random stone. It was sold individually, rated at 5++++ grit, and noted as an excellent stone for final finish on Razors. It was also quite affordable thanks to it being such a weird size and shape.

I still prefer my MMJP Stone, because it is finer (pretty ridiculously fine in actuality), but the 330mate suita is still a nice finisher.


Now my RANDOM stone ($25 "Razor Size" 330mate eBay listing), isn't a great finisher. It's a bit too coarse. It's a very very fast mid-range hone. If you're spending $25 and expecting a great Razor finishing Jnat shipped from Japan (meaning the seller is probably getting ~$10 for the stone), then I want to live in such a world. It gets used occasionally, but I actually prefer coticules for that range of honing, so it's mostly retired.