Short-Lofted (less than 50mm) Synthetics

[thombrogan]

After using semi-short lofts from AP ShaveCo and Omega, I’m convinced smol lofts are good for me.

Since I have poor skills, I use a wide knot to absolve my sins.

Unfortunately, I can’t find a synthetic with a less than 50mm loft unless it has a narrow width knot (less than 26mm chunky).

Do any exist or is it time to accept that only skinny synthetic knots are likely to be smol brushes?

Many thanks for your input

 

[APBinNCA]

After using semi-short lofts from AP ShaveCo and Omega, I’m convinced smol lofts are good for me.

Since I have poor skills, I use a wide knot to absolve my sins.

Unfortunately, I can’t find a synthetic with a less than 50mm loft unless it has a narrow width knot (less than 26mm chunky).

Do any exist or is it time to accept that only skinny synthetic knots are likely to be smol brushes?

Many thanks for your input

Did you check out Boti on Ali?

You could probably get the knot sent direct to a brush maker and have them set it at 50mm or less.

 

[Phoenixkh]

Thom, I don't quite understand your goal.. or what you are trying to achieve by using shorter loft but larger diameter synth knots..

I don't know if I can help, but I have been on a brush adventure for the past few months so perhaps I'd have something to offer.

 

[NorthernSoul]

The right loft is usually set using a ratio instead of an absolute number. So, the larger the knot, the taller the loft. Otherwise, you might get a shaving brush that is more like a scrub brush. I'd expect a 26mm synth to have a loft about 55mm up to 60mm or more.

 

[APBinNCA]

I had some time to check, Maggard has a 30mm that is 69(nice)mm! So with a standard drilling of 17mm, that would get you to 52mm. According to the formula that RV, and others, recommends 1.8 x diameter at exit of handle = 58mm. That would require a depth of 12mm which is recommended for these knots, you would need spacers normally. But 1.6x = 52mm and it's above 1.5x so it might work! The thing is with these G5A knots, the loft has little effect on the behaviour of the knot. Whether this is a good thing or not, is up to you!

I mention Maggard knowing you are in the UK because Boti should have anything that Maggard has and more.

 

[Rudy Vey]

This is an interesting thread. Keeping my eyes on it, maybe something we all can learn from.

 

[thombrogan]

@Phoenixkh , I want to enjoy the increased control a shorter loft seems to provide with the ease of lathering a wider loft provides.

@NorthernSoul , the ratio may suggest results, but I haven’t tried it.

@APBinNCA , checked and saw Boti was carrying knots from Oumo and Oumo had chonky knots in their Mother Lode and sinner/non-AP ShaveCo version of the G5 series that might also fail this mission unless glued to a well instead of a handle.

 

[Phoenixkh]

Thom,

OK...but with a bigger diameter knot.... so 26mm..... how far under 50mm would work, do you think?

I just checked and the lowest loft I have is 26mm with a 50mm loft in both the Simpson T3 Trafalgar and the Executive Shaving Company Ultimate G4. I really like the ESC Ultimate but it's pretty pricey for a synth.

You said poor technique is causing the problem..... do you have a beard and are having problems keeping the lather where it needs to be? If this a face lathering issue? Like I said.. I'm not sure what problem you are trying to solve. I know what you think the answer is..... but it doesn't seem like you're going to have many options if a big brush with very low loft is the way to resolve the issue.

 

[Rudy Vey]

This is a G5C knot, nominal size (width) of 28 mm, set into my loft template with a 30 mm hole, smallest hole this knot would fit for this short loft. The loft: height of the hair/fibers from exit of the hole (i.e. handle) to the top of the hair/fibers (there is no "wide loft"). This knot is shown here at 48 mm loft, so a ratio of 1:1.6
I think the max. loft for this knot is about 52 mm or so, these knots have a pretty low (short) loft.

 

[Phoenixkh]

This is a G5C knot, nominal size (width) of 28 mm, set into my loft template with a 30 mm hole, smallest hole this knot would fit for this short loft. The loft: height of the hair/fibers from exit of the hole (i.e. handle) to the top of the hair/fibers (there is no "wide loft"). This knot is shown here at 48 mm loft, so a ratio of 1:1.6
I think the max. loft for this knot is about 52 mm or so, these knots have a pretty low (short) loft.

View attachment 1479904

Rudy,

I've heard people complain about the lower lofts on G5C... so maybe it would be just perfect for Thom. You could turn a handle for him that would allow you to set the knot lower, right?

 

[APBinNCA]

Rudy,

I've heard people complain about the lower lofts on G5C... so maybe it would be just perfect for Thom. You could turn a handle for him that would allow you to set the knot lower, right?

This was my thought from the beginning when I said "brush maker" above, but I didn't want to push something that I wasn't sure RV would do(he works with Muhle STF). I selected the G5A and left it to him to connect the dots. He is also in the UK so shipping is an issue. I don't think, now that I think about it, he wants a G5. But they are the only one made short. He already has a 28mm Synth that he loves, but wanted it even bigger when he settled on it. I think he has found the knots that meet his criteria from Boti, so hopefully the 'brush maker' can be found.

 

[Rudy Vey]

Rudy,

I've heard people complain about the lower lofts on G5C... so maybe it would be just perfect for Thom. You could turn a handle for him that would allow you to set the knot lower, right?

The two I have used so far have very short lofts. The max. one can set this knot at would be about 53/54 mm.

 

[Phoenixkh]

Those Maseto brushes can be pretty big with lower lofts. An example: I have a 28mm that is set at 53... pretty low for the diameter of knot. It's a little to scrubby for me. It isn't horrible but I have a couple synths I prefer over it.

 

[Ron R]

After using semi-short lofts from AP ShaveCo and Omega, I’m convinced smol lofts are good for me.

Since I have poor skills, I use a wide knot to absolve my sins.

Unfortunately, I can’t find a synthetic with a less than 50mm loft unless it has a narrow width knot (less than 26mm chunky).

Do any exist or is it time to accept that only skinny synthetic knots are likely to be smol brushes?

Many thanks for your input

Dscosmetic has a adjustable loft brush handle and if you contact them you could get a synthetic brush knot put in and they will sent it to you I'm thinking.
I like the looks of this badger knot they installed. If they do not want to do this you could buy the brush and remove it and install the knot you want. The quality looks great to my eyes.
This way you can find the sweet spot you want and no second guessing because you are in control of the knot feel all the time!

Have some great shaves!

 

[thombrogan]

No beard or mustache for me, @Phoenixkh — I’ve just assumed wider brushes make lather more easily and I struggled with building lather for a long time. Mebbe an overall smol or meejum sized brush will work better for me than when I struggled with a small, shed-happy pure badger brush two years ago.

@Ron R and @Rudy Vey , your photos and demonstrations have shown me that what I sought a few posts ago may be too complicated and expensive to achieve and I thank you for the time and photography you shared with me.

@APBinNCA , I was born in the USA and have only left the country to visit Canada and the great nation of Texas.

Thanks to everyone for your help. I’ll give up on the wide and short idea for now and paralyze myself with the more widely available array of small and medium width brushes with shorter than 50mm lofts.

 

[APBinNCA]

Confused head scratching ensues... I was 100% certain you were in the UK, I am very detail oriented. Apologies.

 

[thombrogan]

If New England’s sensational Merrimack Valley counts as the UK, then okay…

Mûhle and Simpson browsing commencing

 

[TDKBeloushi]

Zenith Brushes are famous for short lofts!

Check them out

 

[APBinNCA]

Zenith Brushes are famous for short lofts!

Check them out

Excellent thought! Many have been out of stock, but this just might do...

The Synthetic Big One Brush By Zenith. 31x51mm. Made in Italy N6

For a couple of years, I've been talking to Zenith about producing a larger knot. Finally, we've made it happen. This brush has a 31mm black synthetic knot in it. The black synthetic is softer than the TS or S brushes.The loft is set at 52mm with an effective loft of 44-47mm. The handle is 58mm...

www.thegentleshave.com

 

[ShavingPanda]

Can you buy a handle with a deep socket and buy a knot you like and set it to the desired loft? I've seen a few folks mention using an adhesive that allows for the knot to be reset if needed.

I recall seeing on AP Shave Co sote you can pick a loft. Perhaps he'll do a custom loft for you. @apshaveco ?