Share your Natural Hone Finish

[Maplelite]

Hi all,

I would like to check what kind of finish does your natural sharpening stone gives. Share yours and lets try to compare it with synthetic whetstone so all of us roughly know what grit our natural stone really is.

My Japanese natural whetstone give out a half hazy and half polish state on my straight razor(basically a hazy mirror finish).


Thanks
Daniel

 

[holli4pirating]

My Asagi and my vintage Thurry both give very sharp edges.

 

[mainaman]

I have Asagi, which leaves hazy finish.
What grit? I can't tell you , but its very very fine.
My highest grit synthetic used to be 16k Shapton, and it can't compare to the Asagi.

 

[Maplelite]

My Asagi and my vintage Thurry both give very sharp edges.

What do you see on the honed surface?

I have Asagi, which leaves hazy finish.
What grit? I can't tell you , but its very very fine.
My highest grit synthetic used to be 16k Shapton, and it can't compare to the Asagi.

Hm...are you able to see your own reflection? I used a 12k naniwa before and it gives off a slightly clearer mirror finish but some light scratches is seen.
I wonder how high a grit natural stone must be to give a perfect mirror surface(no scratch as well) without stropping.

 

[holli4pirating]

Um, I dunno what they look like; I don't have my razors with me at the moment. To tell you the truth, I don't pay attention to what the finish looks like because all I care about is how they shave. I don't use any sort of magnification, and I don't even visually inspect my edges with my naked eye.

Different hones give different polishes, and the difference are not only due to the grit size, but also the grit shape, the structure of the matrix holding the grit, and the way the grits cut.

 

[professorchaos]

When used with great patience and some skill (or is it luck?), my Maruichi Maruka Nakayama produces an edge that shaves like something finished on .5 and .25 diamond pastes. Finish is a bright hazy white.

My Nakayama Iromono is slightly softer than the Maruichi and cuts a little quicker. Edge isn't as fine as the Maruichi, but when used properly the edge it produces shaves pretty close to something finished on .5 diamond or CrOx. Finish is more of a grey haze.

Nakayama Kiita...still getting to know it.

 

[mainaman]

What do you see on the honed surface?

Hm...are you able to see your own reflection? I used a 12k naniwa before and it gives off a slightly clearer mirror finish but some light scratches is seen.
I wonder how high a grit natural stone must be to give a perfect mirror surface(no scratch as well) without stropping.

Most synthetic stones give mirror finish, especially the Naniwa stones.
Natural stone usually give haze, not mirror.
As Professorchaos said, with patience, and in my case with suitable mid range natural the final edge does not need to see CrO strop.

 

[richmondesi]

Um, I dunno what they look like; I don't have my razors with me at the moment. To tell you the truth, I don't pay attention to what the finish looks like because all I care about is how they shave. I don't use any sort of magnification, and I don't even visually inspect my edges with my naked eye.

Different hones give different polishes, and the difference are not only due to the grit size, but also the grit shape, the structure of the matrix holding the grit, and the way the grits cut.

This is pretty much my approach as well. I use a Coticule though

 

[Maplelite]

Hm....so we cannot judge the grit just by the looks of the finish area?
By the way, how do you tell how fine an edge(especially when you only have one straight razor) is since most of the honed edge is thinner than paper?

 

[holli4pirating]

Hm....so we cannot judge the grit just by the looks of the finish area?
By the way, how do you tell how fine an edge(especially when you only have one straight razor) is since most of the honed edge is thinner than paper?

1. Correct
2. Choose your test. Some can tell with their thumbpad, others by test shaving arm or leg hair, others by shaving. Honestly, I have trouble telling the difference between my three finishers while shaving.

 

[mainaman]

Hm....so we cannot judge the grit just by the looks of the finish area?
By the way, how do you tell how fine an edge(especially when you only have one straight razor) is since most of the honed edge is thinner than paper?

For my particular Asagi, I know that it is finer than 1micron which is what 16k shapton glass is rated at (0.92 micron to be exact). I also know that I can get an edge that does not improve, when I shave I can't tell the difference, whn using CrO. This to me means that my particular stone is in the 0.5 micron range. I do not think I can tell if a 0.25 micron edge will feel different than Asagi finish, so even if the stone is finer than 0.5 micron, I cant tell. The only way would be to work the slurry then do SEM imaging and measure the size of the particles.

 

[holli4pirating]

For my particular Asagi, I know that it is finer than 1micron which is what 16k shapton glass is rated at (0.92 micron to be exact). I also know that I can get an edge that does not improve, when I shave I can't tell the difference, whn using CrO. This to me means that my particular stone is in the 0.5 micron range. I do not think I can tell if a 0.25 micron edge will feel different than Asagi finish, so even if the stone is finer than 0.5 micron, I cant tell. The only way would be to work the slurry then do SEM imaging and measure the size of the particles.

With all due respect, I totally disagree with your method of assessing grit sizes. The same micron sized diamond and chrome ox will give different edges, not because of their size, but because of their shape and how aggressively they cut. You can compare the finishes of two different grits, but that will not correlate directly to their grit sizes.

 

[richmondesi]

with all due respect, i totally disagree with your method of assessing grit sizes. The same micron sized diamond and chrome ox will give different edges, not because of their size, but because of their shape and how aggressively they cut. You can compare the finishes of two different grits, but that will not correlate directly to their grit sizes.

+1

 

[mainaman]

With all due respect, I totally disagree with your method of assessing grit sizes. The same micron sized diamond and chrome ox will give different edges, not because of their size, but because of their shape and how aggressively they cut. You can compare the finishes of two different grits, but that will not correlate directly to their grit sizes.

Didnot think from that prospective.I am sure that SEM imaging can tell the truth though. How available/affordable is that to those that want to do it is another question.

 

[holli4pirating]

Sure, SEM's of a hone would tell you something, unless you are talking about hones where the grits break down or there is any other reason for non-standard grit size or where the grits are always at least partially embedded in whatever matrix holds them (you won't see the whole grit to measure a size) or etc.

IMO, this is precisely why no one will try to guess the actualy grit size of a natural hone, though they may say "It gives an edge similar to the edge off blah."

 

[chess1]

I have used Nakayama ,16k , coticule so on on on.
Nothing gives better edge then An Escher.
what i mean better?
smooth and sharp together.
Nakayama gives very smooth edge but not sharp enough.
hope this helps.

 

[professorchaos]

Don't give up on your Nakayama. The two I have blow away the Escher in terms of sharpness. Not as quick nor as easy to use.

 

[chess1]

I don't know which escher are you using but i haven't seen yet any hone would put better edge then my light green, yellow green lastly the best brown escher stone.
I have very fine nakayama and i mean very fine. i have tried at least 35( i know it is not a lot but they all have been sold as a fine razor hone) Japanese stone. None have been better then my nakayama.
Even my nakyama looses sharpness to light green escher and rest i mention early.
I would say Nakayama edge is smooth edge there is no argument about it but the perfect sharpness is missing.
Yellow green will get smoother and sharper edge. Brown escher edge is priceless.

 

[SliceOfLife]

I find that going from say Mueller to escher is better than from Mueller to Jnat, but Mueller to escher to Jnat is pretty tasty too.

 

[Maplelite]

Thank you all for sharing your experience.

You guys sure have lots of hone at home ._.