Really? (Kai)

[Mike the Beginner]

Are Kai blades actually expensive?

I'm brand new to this hobby and definitely feel the attraction all you guys already know about. It's delightful to "solve" a lifelong shaving problem after 52 years (first shave 1971, with the then-new Trac II). Especially since I didn't even know it could be "solved." I've been a little obsessed, which seems a bit strange—although maybe you can relate.

So I've really only just gotten "the lay of the land." But I've tried enough razors to settle on one (although I will keep maybe five); settled quickly on oil rather than lather; and am pretty sure I'm close to being settled on Kai blades, which go together with a wartime Tech like cheese with crackers or peanut butter with jelly.

But here's a thing that kinda makes me smile: the people who say Kai blades are "too expensive" to be their regular blade...

...When they probably have 30 soaps, 10 aftershaves, multiple hundred packs along with dozens of partially used tucks in their drawer, and twenty razors!! ...And at least a few of those are small-run bespoke models CNC'd from high-spec metals!

Yet they can't afford 30¢ for a blade?

...That will last for ten shaves or maybe even more?

The blade that need not speak its name. (Shhh.)​

My time is valuable (well, to me), but I'm sorely tempted to go through the KAI Participation PIF thread back-to-front and log all the shaves people report getting out of one single Kai blade. One B&B'er, Demolition, got 63(!). The outlier on the low side gave up at about shave seven, I think, which is still pretty good. One guy, B_R_A_D, said he reached double digits on one blade for the first time ever. Another, Chaucer, got 20 shaves from one Kai before moving on. In another thread, one person said he routinely goes 10, and another 12, and a third 15. Another said only six.

A 30¢ blade that lasts for one week—seven shaves—amounts to 4.3¢ per shave. And thus gets very close to a Silver Star that provides two shaves @ 4¢ per shave (@ $7.99 per 100, cheapest blade I've found. I tried a Silver Star three times and really liked the first shave each time, but felt a drop-off in quality on the second shave all three times. Could be that that's just me. I suspect Silver Stars used "one-and-done" into perpetuity would be a sensible and defensible strategy, at 8¢ per shave). That person who said he routinely goes six shaves with his go-to Kais still is paying only 5¢ per shave. How does that stack up to a Nacet or a Feather used three times and binned?

Reach 10 shaves with each Kai and you've achieved 3¢ per shave. The way I survey the landscape, that's cheaper than any blade used one-and-done, which several B&B'ers I've encountered here and there say is their method.

I'm still torn. Silver Stars used one-and-done, or one new Kai every Sunday whether I need it or not? Research is ongoing!

But I think one might even say Kai blades are cheap, rather than dear. Seems to me it depends on how far you're willing to go with each one. If you hang in with them, they'll hang in with you. That's the conclusion the anecdotal evidence seems to point to.

Cordially,
MtB

(All opinions expressed or debated might be wrong, because...well, like my handle says.)

 

[silverlifter]

For context, there is one madman who is mere shaves away from 400 on a Feather. Now that is commitment!

I love Kai blades. Other than vintage Polsilver, they would be my favourites (along with Wizamets). And, yes, price per shave is not really a consideration for me: if I'm scraping steel across my face, I focus on quality not price.

 

[NorthernSoul]

I think people mean Kai blades are expensive compared to other blades that perform similarly. If you have found Kai blades work well for you, why not use them. I've got a stash of Perma-Sharp Supers that I got for under $10/100. Each lasts 5-6 shaves. BIC Chrome Platinum I got for $13/100. Each lasts around 6 shaves. So, to me Kai is higher priced, but not that special, except maybe for the Japanese style Zen marketing.

 

[Big_T]

While I understand and agree with your financial analysis @Mike the Beginner, my only problem is although I've tried 'em many times, I just don't care for Kai DE blades. YMMV

 

[ButterfaceX]

Also, just a little suggestion. Never put all your eggs in one basket. Some blades my just not work well in one razor. So what do you do. Good to have a couple options available. Also if the "said" blade works great in one or all your razors, that is great. But it is nice to have a backup of one or two other choices for a variety of reasons, as a just in case.....
Say KAI's jump in price, disappear, whatever.....
Have a backup or 2....


BFX

 

[Quaznoid]

I shave 3 times with each Lord Plat. At $10 for 100 that’s 3 cents per shave. Lord Cools, at $6 per 100 works out to 2 cents per shave. That’s cheap enough even for a Cheapshaver.

 

[GrizzlyCA]

Some great ideas comments. I am a huge fan of Kai. I own a lot . They excel on certain razors like techs, gamechangers, etc.

To me, the difference of a few cents per shave does not raise an eyebrow.

What I like about Kai is they provide blade feel, get sharper after first use, and are smooth...

That said, I do own and use several other blades. Wizimits/Polsilver blades, personna, and gilette blacks are my top rotations

 

[Mike the Beginner]

Never put all your eggs in one basket. Some blades my just not work well in one razor. ...It is nice to have a backup of one or two other choices for a variety of reasons, as a just in case.....

Good thought. I used to advise that when teaching darkroom. Settle on one paper and one film, but have backups that you stock and work with regularly, in case either/or disappears.

Of course now darkroom is mostly dead, and both papers and both films I once standardized on are gone, but that's, um, progress.

MtB

 

[Mike the Beginner]

What I like about Kai is they provide blade feel, get sharper after first use, and are smooth...

I think what I like best is the way my face feels after a Kai shave. Right now my face still feels wonderfully smooth with just traces of stubble and it's midnight after my morning shave at 9 a.m. Remarkable, I think. I had to remind myself at a meeting tonight not to keep touching my own face! Haha.

Pretty sold on these blades already. I should stay patient and not commit in my mind.

MtB

 

[cvac]

I didn't find them to be anything special. Price isn't really that much different than some other more expensive blades. Big problem for me is that they weren't sharp enough nor comfortable enough. Sharpness is actually below average on these. Supposedly they are wider than some DE blades which may change the cutting geometry very slightly.

 

[Mike the Beginner]

We all suit ourselves I guess. I love 'em. They're the definition of special in my very limited experience.

I'm not a typical wet shaver, though, that I'll readily admit. Nor do I have typical goals. So....

MtB

 

[Grundi]

Another thing to consider, @Mike the Beginner, is that cost is not the only consideration. "The Shaving Experience" looms large when you factor in all the many facets that making shaving more than a daily task. We had a great time in that Participation PIF bantering back and forth and talking about those blades.

What did the blade bring to the table (experience) other than the economics?!?

 

[Mike the Beginner]

What did the blade bring to the table (experience) other than the economics?!?

Oh, it brings a lot more for me.

But like I said above, I'm not a typical wet shaver nor do I have typical goals. I have a long history of finding shaving painful (rotating between carts, electrics, and a beard, none of which were solutions I liked). So my No. 1 priority is to minimize discomfort and skin irritation. No. 2 is a safe experience; just like I find "medium" spicy at an Indian restaurant to be at the threshold of what I can bear, I have found "medium aggressive" razors to be too aggressive. I hate the feeling that a razor is always right about to bite me. No. 3 goal is a good feeling for the day, without tightness, dryness, redness, or that feeling that I just rubbed my face with coarse sandpaper (I can feel pain and irritation after an electric razor shave for a couple of hours).

I find the Kai in the Gillette Tech to be smooth and safe as I shave, but it's the way my face feels afterwards that I really like. For some strange reason, when I check my face with my hands while it's still wet, just after I shaved, it feels like I missed a lot. I can still feel stubble. After finishing I rinse gently twice with cold water and blot dry, leaving any residual oil on. (This morning I added a bit of after-shave balm too, because it's below freezing here and the air is getting dry.) As soon as my face dries, though, I can no longer feel any stubble at all. My face feels smooth as silk. And it's not dry, not tight, not hurting in the slightest...yet it's a very close shave. I love it.

And that's with one to two passes, not even two full passes...again, the goal being to go easy on my face.

And then—bonus!—my face still looks good that night. Rubbing atg I can feel growth, but wtg it still feels very smooth. It's kinda like a magic trick. I don't know how the blade does that.

The shaving experience itself is a bit nicer—and safer still—with the Tatara Masamune and a Russian blade, and the shave feels just as close with the Rex Envoy and Astra SP, and first shaves with a Wizimet or Voskhod definitely feel smoother during the shave. Both of those are wonderful. But it's the results with the oil/Tech/Kai combo that are so great for me—the way it looks, feels, and lasts afterwards. Further bonus, this morning was shave No. 6 with the Kai and it was just as good as shave No. 2. (Shave No. 1 was in the Rockwell a while back and I recall finding it a bit rough and harsh--it caused me to set the Kai aside thinking "that's not the one for me.")

I tend to be a quick study with things I get interested in, and I wouldn't be surprised if my journey is done already. But I'm also definitely a beginner, and don't know a tenth (or, in some cases, a hundredth) of what some guys here know, so I also wouldn't be surprised if my tastes and preferences continue to evolve. Given that my beard is light and silky and my skin sensitive, I also won't be surprised in the least if my experiences or conclusions are not shared by others. To everyone their own face, to everyone their own shave!

MtB

 

[GrizzlyCA]

Wanted to give Props to you, @Mike the Beginner Part of my journey is finding the things that work. Kai blades work for you and many of us. Once you have solved part of that equation, it really allow have a baseline and a place where you know how to get a great shave. That allows you to perfect other things about your overall shave. To me that is huge.
My new carbon is a perfect match with Kai blades as they “sing” in more aggressive plates. I can confirm that . Kai is a constant as it was my go to with a gamechanger when I got proficient… it still is my top dog.

 

[anoop]

They were my regular blade for many years. However I now use Bic Chrome and I now feel that Kai blades are overrated. The Bics are smoother and cheaper. The Kai is sharper but also harsher on the skin. It’s sort of like a toned-down Feather which even sharper and harsher on the skin.

 

[Mike the Beginner]

Shave number 6 with the Kai is as good as the second.

Thinking at this point that a new blade every week might well do it for me.

Thanks for all the good input! This has been an informative thread.

MtB

 

[AshleyC]

Your name is "Mike the Beginner".

Your first shave was in 1971.

Which means you are probably capable of discussing Haldeman and Ehrlichman. Something I can't do without Google. [But I do know the names...]

I'm just going to go out on a limb and assume you have a point about blade prices. If I had any sense, I'd buy Med Preps or Lab Blues and stop spending money otherwise.

 

[Mike the Beginner]

It's no big deal, but I actually use the name "Mike the Beginner" everywhere. Shunryu Suzuki makes the point in the Prologue of Zen Mind, Beginner's Mind that you should approach everything as if you were still a beginner, because the moment you declare yourself an "expert," it closes your mind and you tend to approach other opinions as if you have to argue or defend. The famous quote is, "In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities; in the expert's mind there are few."

MtB

 

[anoop]

It's no big deal, but I actually use the name "Mike the Beginner" everywhere. Shunryu Suzuki makes the point in the Prologue of Zen Mind, Beginner's Mind that you should approach everything as if you were still a beginner, because the moment you declare yourself an "expert," it closes your mind and you tend to approach other opinions as if you have to argue or defend. The famous quote is, "In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities; in the expert's mind there are few."

MtB

I’m an expert at being a beginner.

 

[TxAggie2018]

Kais are just tanks. I get double the shaves out of them vs other brands, and I am not one to push a blade's life.

They are 2x as expensive as most "premium" razors, but last 2x as long, so money wise they're fine. I just don't like how they feel shaving against the grain.