How did shave #23 compare to shave #1 on a new blade?
My current attempt at sharpening a modern DE blade
- Thread starter esee
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Oh, the new blade is better. I'm a shaver that likes the PTFE coatings. They make a difference on my face with how I perceive the smoothness to be.
Another great reason why it can make sense to just use a new blade. While I will get the full life out of my blades it just doesn't make sense to take extraordinary measures to extend blade life given the cost and our large inventories beyond fun experimentation. Recall my 1,200+ blade inventory is a fraction of yours.
P.S. Your were right in your separate post on Dorco blades. Prices have gone up on Amazon. Also noticed that the cardboard tuck STP300 Prime blades are no longer listed there, just the plastic tuck STP301s. Strange as there is some indication that the plastic tucks are no longer in production per the latest Dorco catalog. Exception is the Titan blades that have dropped below $10 to $7.98 per 100.
Yeah, I am just having fun. I think I am way past the idea of saving money with this hobby.
I don't understand the popularity of the Titan myself. The ST300 performs better in my opinion and is cheaper to boot.
Just hit shave #25 on the FlyDear. I used some glycerin soap as a pre-shave effort and finished off with Arko/Ivory. Really a nice shave on a lazy Sunday.
YMMV on the Titan, it's the "Good" Dorco DE blade with the Stainless (ST300/301) as "Better" and Primes as "Best" in the Dorco DE blade assortment. I only have an use the Stainless and Primes.
It is the dullest of the three with perhaps the least coating. I don't think it is terrible, but the Titan's siblings are better for me.
That would be consistent with the updated Dorco catalog copy that no longer states that Titans are coated blades. Link to my post on this below:
Dorco Prime vs Dorco ST-300 vs Dorco ST-301 vs Dorco Titan
Hi Luc, Just notices your post here. We've a long thread with most of the latest information on Dorco blades. Link below. In a nutshell: All production was moved to Vietnam a few years ago in a new plant with modern equipment resulting in great quality blades vs. the older made in Korea...
www.badgerandblade.com
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- #48
With pricing like that, they definitely want you to buy 500! Huge per-blade discount going from 200 to 500 but not that much better if you bump up to 1000.
The ST300s are also on Black Friday and are generally a few dollars less. I think the only difference between a ST300 and a ST301 is whether you want cardboard tucks or plastic tucks.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00TVES968 1000 ST300s for $43.94.
The photos for the case of 1,000 in the review section show that these are made in Vietnam so these are a good deal if you need some.
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- #52
I know that the official stance is st300 and st301 are the same. Yet most reviews pitch the st300 and st301 as completely different products. The company’s catalog doesn’t even acknowledge the st301. @helicopter has the two models as completely different products. Yet there are some people who see the two products as the same.
I’m just thinking that it’s possible that there are different batches from different times. Also, if someone was to forge one, they would probably forge the paper pack st300, as the paper pack is so much easier to make. If it’s a case of forgery, then the current seller “Kareway” appears to be illegitimate. Finally, if I bought 500, they may be in storage for 20+ years and the plastic tuck will definitely keep these blades good for longer. I own 100 of the st301, and the quality looks amazing. Their packaging is fantastic, plus they cut through paper like butter. I plan to shave with one tomorrow before deciding if I’m loading up.
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- #53
Thanks to @Lane101 links, I found the “Stanford MFG. CORP - 5 second sharpener”. I have a lot of them coming in, as I can’t justify buying one when it’s only a little more to buy a bunch. Anyway, I’ll let anybody reading this thread know how the Stanford MFG. CORP - 5 second sharpeners work. I have high hopes for the Stanford msg sharpeners, as the Stanford's might be the best of the vintage sharpeners. People have had outstanding success sharpening vintage carbons with the Stanford MFG, and someone kept a feather blade going for over 6 months before their last report. Yet the person tying the Stanford sharpener on a modern Gillette blade failed. I try to avoid Gillette products, but that’s just me yet I still have two super speeds and some of Gillette's other vintage razors.
I did see those tests conducted by helicopter. They are thought provoking for sure, but it doesn't match my personal experience. Subjectively, I have used both ST300 and ST301 (both from Vietnam) and I think they are similar enough such that I think what people detect as variation is more by batch than any real differences with materials or process. I do respect other opinions though and I can't argue with helicopter's hard work.
@cranewarrior is correct. The reason Dorco no longer lists the ST301 and STP301 plastic tuck DE blades in the latest catalog is that they have likely been discontinued. When I first researched Dorco blades a few years ago they were in transition between the plastic and paper tucks and clearly showed that both were same Stainless (ST300/301) and Prime (STP300/301) blades. You can see this in the 2020 catalog page image in our Dorco Information Thread linked below. Not following to forgery conclusion given that the only SKUs in the current Dorco catalog are the ST/STP 300 cardboard tuck blades.
Additionally other B&B members have reached out to Dorco on this topic and received confirmation that the 300/301 blades are identical with the exception of packaging. This is also noted in the linked thread.
Unclear if there is any difference in how well the different tuck containers will preserve these blades as the cardboard tucks are better sealed. Also the blades in the ST/STP 300 cardboard tucks are double wrapped with a inner wax paper wrap and outer sealed paper wrap. The plastic tuck blades only have the inner wax paper wrap.
Have a detailed read of our Dorco Information thread and you will be up to speed on the latest information regarding these blades.
Link to Dorco Information Thread, See first few posts:
Dorco Double Edge Blade SKU Changes & Clarifications
Hi everyone. Just received a new shipment of 100 STP300 Dorco Prime double edge blades and discovered a stock keeping unit (SKU) change confirmed via a review of their latest product catalog. The ST301 stainless Dorco blade package is no longer listed in the catalog, only the ST300, Primes and...
www.badgerandblade.com
Edit, P.S. @helicopter 's testing program is excellent and, from what I've seen, reasonably consistent with much of what we know about the different razor blades with Feather blades as the sharpest for example. In his testing methodology he is not commenting on whether or not blades with different packaging or SKU numbers are the same or different beyond the test results. He's just documenting, consistent with sound research practices, the source of each blade such as Derby Extra Orange and Green that are also the same blade. Given that he's testing one of each blade we need to take the results in a broad context versus as precision sharpness rankings. Helicopter repeatedly acknowledges the potential impact of manufacturing variation as the possible reason for some of the results.
Overall the breadth of his research effort is amazing and a nice addition to our B&B fact base.
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You hit the nail on the head regarding these blades. I also have both and have found them to be identical in overall performance. Note in some cases, when we probed, those who thought they were very different blades were comparing older made in Korea blades of one SKU with newer made in Vietnam production of the other SKU.
I also think you are right about batch issues impacting testing. Most of the Dorco blades were in the same ballpark on sharpness (excluding a Prime blade that may have been older Korean production). The ST300 tested had a manufacturing defect noted by @helicopter in that one side was sharpened very differently than the other. He noted that if both sides had been sharpened to a suitable level it would have been it would be a good blade that could provide extended use. Even with the defect it was roughly in the middle range of the overall set of blade ratings across all brands.
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- Thread starter
- #57
I read your thread, and it is really interesting. Towards the end of the thread, someone pointed out that even after the manufacturing moved to Vietnam, the St300 blades came with two different logos. The early Vietnam blades still keeping “D” printed on the blade, yet the lather ST300 Vietnam blades dropped the “D”. So I thought, maybe the negative reviews that the ST300 blades receive are from the early ST300 blades.
It turns out most of the negative reviews on the ST300 comes from the ST300 blades, which still had a D printed on them. Yet the ST300 blade that @helicopter reviewed appears to be from the newer variety, and @helicopeter photographed the ST300 and the ST301 and stated that the two blades are different blades with different grinds in the bevel.
Although the ST300 gets some superb reviews where people cannot distinguish the difference between the two blades. To me, there appears to be another factor that we have not considered yet. The other factor may just be shipping damage, yet shipping damage won’t explain why @helicopter photograph the two blades as completely two separate blades.
Either way, I decide to play it safe and go with the packaging I like and bought the ST301 blade. I am happy with my purchase even if the ST300 is the same blade with a different packaging.
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- #58
I received my Stanford MFG. CORP - 5 second sharpeners. here they are right after I pulled them out of the package. Do you think I have enough of them?
After a few minutes, soak in vinegar and a little wipe down with a cloth. Although one has to be careful while removing oxidation or rust vinegar as if they don’t dry metal right away, the metal will rust even more.
here’s a close-up with a razor blade on top just to show the size of this sharpener.
And here is how the inside of the sharpener looks.
finally, the bottom of the sharpener.
After a few minutes, soak in vinegar and a little wipe down with a cloth. Although one has to be careful while removing oxidation or rust vinegar as if they don’t dry metal right away, the metal will rust even more.
here’s a close-up with a razor blade on top just to show the size of this sharpener.
And here is how the inside of the sharpener looks.
finally, the bottom of the sharpener.
- Thread starter
- #59
I did some preliminary tests on this sharpener. first I tried to sharpen a blade which I have already destroyed through other sharpening attempts. After running the blade with the destroyed edge through this sharpener, I got the blade sharp enough to cut paper but not nearly sharp enough to shave. I realized that because the scrapes were higher up the sides, I would have to create a completely new edge, something this sharpener can’t do. For a brand-new edge, one would need a coarser grinding medium.
Next I tried sharpening my potentially fake Personna blades. These sharpeners are called a five second sharpener because the manufacturer states one should only go back and forth five times. They say if one goes back and forth over five times, one can ruin the edge. Yet, from my readings of other forms, I saw people say you have to move a Stanford sharpener back and forth about 15 times when you’re sharpening modern stainless blades. I tried sharpening the Personna and I may have succeeded a bit in sharpening, but the edge where nowhere near keen enough. When I tried shaving, I got a half decent shave, but I had to go over spots many times, I also had to slow down my shaves, use more Gillette slides, and even after all of this I finished up with the super keen Dorco blade.
Afterwards, I tried sharpening some vintage carbon blades. Although I have not shaved with any of these vintage blades yet, after running the vintage blades through this sharpener, the blades felt super sharp. There is a possibility that the hardened steel used in the sharpener is softer than the modern stainless blades. If this is the case, then the sharpener will probably act more like a strop on the modern blades, while still honing a softer blade.
The good news is that the sharpener only appears to have done good and no harm. I ran the already super sharp Dorco blade through the sharpener, and afterwards the blade was still super sharp, maybe even a little sharper.
It is way too early to jump to any conclusions yet, but as things stand right now based on preliminary results, I think that if this sharpener has success with modern blades, it would have to be used after each shave, rather than waiting for a blade to go bad. Putting a brand-new edge on the modern stainless blade with this sharpener seems highly unlikely, yet keeping an edge sharp may still be possible even with the modern stainless blades.
This sharpener most likely works best on the blades for which the manufacturer designed the sharpener for. yet it is too early to draw any conclusions. I am going to try this sharpener on many blades and see if I can keep some modern blades staying super sharp for months on end. As where I stand right now, I need a really sharp blade matched with a really mild razor to get a super comfortable close shave.
Next I tried sharpening my potentially fake Personna blades. These sharpeners are called a five second sharpener because the manufacturer states one should only go back and forth five times. They say if one goes back and forth over five times, one can ruin the edge. Yet, from my readings of other forms, I saw people say you have to move a Stanford sharpener back and forth about 15 times when you’re sharpening modern stainless blades. I tried sharpening the Personna and I may have succeeded a bit in sharpening, but the edge where nowhere near keen enough. When I tried shaving, I got a half decent shave, but I had to go over spots many times, I also had to slow down my shaves, use more Gillette slides, and even after all of this I finished up with the super keen Dorco blade.
Afterwards, I tried sharpening some vintage carbon blades. Although I have not shaved with any of these vintage blades yet, after running the vintage blades through this sharpener, the blades felt super sharp. There is a possibility that the hardened steel used in the sharpener is softer than the modern stainless blades. If this is the case, then the sharpener will probably act more like a strop on the modern blades, while still honing a softer blade.
The good news is that the sharpener only appears to have done good and no harm. I ran the already super sharp Dorco blade through the sharpener, and afterwards the blade was still super sharp, maybe even a little sharper.
It is way too early to jump to any conclusions yet, but as things stand right now based on preliminary results, I think that if this sharpener has success with modern blades, it would have to be used after each shave, rather than waiting for a blade to go bad. Putting a brand-new edge on the modern stainless blade with this sharpener seems highly unlikely, yet keeping an edge sharp may still be possible even with the modern stainless blades.
This sharpener most likely works best on the blades for which the manufacturer designed the sharpener for. yet it is too early to draw any conclusions. I am going to try this sharpener on many blades and see if I can keep some modern blades staying super sharp for months on end. As where I stand right now, I need a really sharp blade matched with a really mild razor to get a super comfortable close shave.
Ron R
I survived a lathey foreman
I think most older DE blade sharpeners where designed just to straighten small blade edge curvatures to improve sharpness similar to stropping a straight razor before using.
To sharpen a blade you would need a abrasive like diamond paste to impregnate or load the surface of the machine to help in straightening and keening a edge.
You will lose some of the edge coatings using a sharpening attempt using abrasives.
(old archived photo of a DE blade edge with a coating)
Have some great shaves!
To sharpen a blade you would need a abrasive like diamond paste to impregnate or load the surface of the machine to help in straightening and keening a edge.
You will lose some of the edge coatings using a sharpening attempt using abrasives.
(old archived photo of a DE blade edge with a coating)
Have some great shaves!
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