One of year of wet shaving under the belt and I still have horrible irritation...

[SullyInATX]

[TL;DR long post inc] Hey all, fairly new wet shaver here. I've been wet shaving for around a year now. My typical pre-shave products are Urth Face Scrub for my exfoliator (during a 25min hot shower) and T&H pre-shave oil. I let my badger hair brush soak in hot water while I'm showering, although it's cold by the time I get out so I let it soak in hot water again while I'm cleaning ears, drying off, etc. I re-splash my face with a little hot water and then use 4-5 drops of pre-shave oil. The only shave cream I've used over the past year has been T&H West Indian Limes. I just can't get over the scent. I have a package of TobS Sandalwood shaving soap that I haven't tried yet. My lathering is hit and miss. I've tried all different techniques. Kinda just go with the flow and add more soap or water as necessary. I lather my face for a good minute or 2 for the first pass. My issue is this. With the grain I rarely have severe irritation, although I ALWAYS have irritation, even if I only do 1 pass with the grain. I've tried the Merkur Platinum, Derby, Persona Blue, Feather and Astra blades. I've used the Merkur 34C, EJ DE89BL and Merkur Futur razors (on setting 2). I've tried all sorts of angles with all different pressures. No pressure (literally almost can't hold onto it), slight pressure and medium pressure. Always short passes. I'm to the point where I want to go back to the super expensive Gillete Cartridges just because I get irritation free shaves. I've only experienced slight irritation over the past year around 10 times doing WG and XG. My skin can't handle against the grain (with a DE anyway). One problem I have is the grain in which my neck hair grows. To me it seems odd. The hair in the middle of my neck grows downward. At the very very bottom about 3/4" of an inch of it grows upward. The bottom halves of the sides of the neck grow diagonally from the middle of the neck towards the ears. Above that it grows downward. It's the lower half of the neck, to the left and right of the middle that give me the most issues. I can't seem to get a close shave only shaving with the grain. I tried out my Fusion a few days ago and was able to go against the grain with no pain or irritation at all. My post-shave consists of cold water rinse, alum block, lavender witch hazel and Grooming Lounge Shavior/Best for Last Aftershave products. Anyone have some advice for me? I've spent hundreds of dollars on products and barely see any better results besides the fact that I enjoy the wet shaving process so much. Here are some pictures of my hair growth after 3 days. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks for those that read this short book

 

[RayClem]

It seems you have tried different razors and different blades. You have altered your technique with different angles and different pressures. Yet, you still get irritation.

It seems that one of the few things you have held constant throughout all of this is your shave cream. For many people, lime oil is a skin irritant. If I use a lime cream, my face immediately starts to burn. Although you love the lime aroma (I do as well), the shaving cream may be a source of irritation. Thus, I would suggest that you try the TOBS. It may not be the best shave cream available, but a lot of folks use it. It creates a nice, rich, protective lather if you get the cream/water mixture right.

You might even want to try a shave cream designed for sensitive skin, with little or no scent. TOBS Jermyn is one possibility.

Also, I am not familiar with your exfoliator. It could be another possible source of irritation. If switching to TOBS does not help, I would try eliminating the exfoliator for a few shaves to see if things get better or worse.

Remember that if you keep doing what your have always been doing, you will keep getting the same results. You have to try something new, Just do not change too many things at once.

 

[matwho]

I agree with @RayClem , you might also try a day without the alum. I was getting constant irritation and it turned out to be the alum.

 

[SullyInATX]

Thanks for the reply @RayClem. As far as doing what I've always been doing, that's why I try different blades/razors/angles almost every shave. The only constant(s) as you pointed out are the T&H shave cream, exfoliator, pre-shave oil and post-shave products. I'll clean this 3-4 day growth up with my electric, shower with no exfoliator and try the TobS soap tomorrow morning. I'll still only do with the grain and we'll see how much burn I get out of the alum block. It'd be a shame if it was the T&H cream. I just bought a new tub of it because I'm about to run out of my other.

 

[ackvil]

First, welcome to B&B.

You have the same issue with the grain on your beard as I do. The grain of my beard on my neck changes in so many directions and then in spots swirls so that a WTG pass is meaningless. What I have done is to determine which direction is the predominant WTG direction realizing that in some spots it may be XTG and ATG. I then use a very light touch in going in that direction. For me, the ONLY way I can get a decent shave on my neck is to do a 4 pass shave. On my neck, I must use a very light touch. In the spots that have swirls I use J hooking.

For you, on your neck, the predominant direction of your beard is South to North. Accordingly, you can try that as your first pass.

Here are some other things to try.

Many folks, including me, have found that cold water shaving reduces irritation. I happen to shave before I shower. I wash my face and head (I also shave my head) with cool or cold water and I then wet my face with cold water before lathering up.

Some additional suggestions.

1. Be sure your lather has sufficient water in it. This makes your shave smoother.

2. Be sure your face is sufficiently hydrated whether you use warm or cold water. If your face is wet before you apply lather for each pass, IMHO, your shaves will be better.

3. Take a washcloth and dip it in cold water and then place it on your face after your last pass.

4. Use WH on your face after you do step 3 above. Use an aftershave balm that is a good moisturizer.

5. At night, before retiring apply a good quality moisturizer to your face. I use CeraVe but there are other good ones out there, too. Look for a product that has ceramides and hyaluronic acid.

 

[SullyInATX]

@matwho - See, here I thought the alum was a good thing. It has astringent properties, but also others whereas the witch hazel is a pure astringent, no? You are right though. I can't tell you the last time I didn't use the alum block but I can tell you back in the day when I didn't use one I didn't get much, if any burn. I feel like the alum can be a good thing though. Not sure, it's hard to tell if the burn from the alum is because of the alum or because of the shave. I do know that if I do both WTG and XTG I get more burn from the alum, which makes me think it's more irritation due to the shave. I'll remove that from tomorrow morning's shave and report back.

 

[nevermind89]

And I thought I have bad growth pattern on neck. In the end point is to get a perfect shave, if that means cartridge, then cartridge it is.

Sent from my LG-D405 using Tapatalk

 

[SullyInATX]

@ackvil, thanks for the advice. I, too, have to be very careful on my neck, even trying to go WTG. Even when it feels like I've done everything right, no burn, I use that alum block and man does my neck burn and get red. Maybe I should stop using it... I use Urth's moisturizer at night. $42 for 4oz. I like the stuff but unfortunately I can't find ceramides and hyaluronic acid in the ingredients list

 

[maybe smith]

I feel for you, I have no suggestions for you as I shave with Williams shave soap, a razor and then aftershave. I guess I am lucky as I have not had facial problems from shaving. I also have never had heartburn or gout......

 

[SullyInATX]

@nevermind89, yeah, it's unfortunate. I shave my head as well and for nice shaves I only get 3 shaves per blade, usually every 3 days.

 

[ackvil]

Hyaluronic acid creates a moisture barrier on the skin, helping to make it smoother and softer. This ingredient is able to hold up to 1000x its own weight in water, thus producing amazing benefits for dehydrated skin. Itregulates cell renewal, lubricates connective tissue and maintains skin’s moisture and elasticity. Ceramides are used to replenish the natural lipids that are lost from exposure to harsh environmental factors, use of drying products, and during in the aging process.

Some time ago, I was using a rather expensive men's moisturizer. I was visiting my dermatologist for skin cancer screening and asked her about this product. She looked it over and said although it had all "natural and organic" products it would not do me much good to keep my skin looking good after shaving and the Florida sun. She recommended a few products including CeraVe. I was pleasantly surprised to find CeraVe was 1/6 the cost of the product I was using. Now, it's not going to instantly cure irritation caused by improper shaving - but it sure hastens the healing process.

 

[SullyInATX]

@maybe smith, I hate watching the YouTube videos of guys wet shaving that can go WTG, XTG twice and AGT, and then touch ups, and then finish up and not have any irritation whatsoever. Makes me so angry lol.

 

[SullyInATX]

@ackvil, I work 12-16 hours a day 6 days a week from home running two IT businesses. I rarely see the sun I do get SUPER dry skin though. No moisturizer has ever helped. A day after shaving I can rub my chin across a black or blue shirt and it's just all white with dead skin. I have medium-oily skin anyway across my T-zone and nose so I hate using moisturizers unless right after I've shaved. It just makes my skin feel more oily, and I've tried all sorts of lotions and moisturizers. I'll report back after I've made those changes in my shaving regime tomorrow morning and see how things go.

 

[Lightcs1776]

Great suggestions above. Welcome to the B&B forums.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[dfoulk]

Yeah, the alum block it a good tool to see what you're doing wrong and what you're doing right but that's about it for me. I wouldn't want to use it every day. I have one in my shave den now as it can help in the case of a nick or cut but I don't like it all that much as a daily part of my routine. I also reach for an after shave balm and skip the splashes as I feel they do a lot more for my skin.

As others have mentioned above lime and other citrus scented items can be an irritant. The other thing I've found is that for me creams don't offer nearly the protective qualities of the better soaps. I've tried the very best creams out there, as well as the high dollar ones and I'm honestly not impressed. The better soaps are so much better. They're slicker, have better moisturizing qualities and are much more protective. I'd get away from the creams and buy some Sudsy Soapery and L&L grooming soaps. The Sudsy Soapery soaps will change your skin if you use them for several days in a row, kinda like applying an expensive moisturizer to your face every night before you go to bed. The L&L is the slickest soap I've encountered by a good margin which greatly reduces potential irritation.

I tend to skip all of the preshave oils and items such as that because using a quality soap eliminates the need for these additional steps.

Other than that you could have a brush that is causing your face irritation or it could be your technique. You're only going to know by switching one thing at a time and slowly making changes.

 

[Accionmutante]

I'm sorry to hear DE is not working for you, your beard grows normally, if you look at beard growth on google you'll see that that's how beards work.

Two questions if you don't mind. a)How does the razor feel when you shave? Does it feel smooth, or like it's kinda between cutting and pulling the hair, does it ever feel like it's scratching against your face? and b) Amidst your irritation ridden shaves, do you get that perfectly smooth and easy shave ever? Even just once per month or so?
If the answer to the first question is yes, then you mess your angle, especially near the neck area where the odd angle of the elbow ruins the angle of the wrist. If the answer to the second one is yes then you can get that same result if you practice.

Try to find the angle and pressure (sometimes it's no pressure, sometimes it's just minimal, depending on the weight and balance of your tool) where the razor feels like smooth rounded metal against your skin and notice the slope your neck makes and maintain proper angle with proper pressure.

Lastly what helped me get rid off some occasional irritation, also in my neck, was strong alcohol based after shave, Pinaud Clubman in my case, I converted to alcohol splashes since then and never looked back at balms. I don't know if your aftershave has alcohol, but if it doesn't give it a go.

Best of luck and I hope loads of enjoyable relaxing shaves are waiting for ya.

 

[SullyInATX]

@Accionmutante The razor glides smoothly when I'm going WTG (except for small areas on my neck where the grain grows weird). When I'm going XTG, where the jawbone meets the neck and going towards the chin, I feel like it's between cutting and pulling a little. I get decent shaves when I only go WTG, but never super clean because I can't go ATG or my face/neck would get wrecked. I've played with all sorts of angles. I usually start out with the very top of the razor on my face, then angle down just until I can feel the blade hit the skin. Sometimes I go further. Like I said in the original post, I've been doing this every 3 days for about a year. I've tried all sorts of things as far as shaving technique, razors, blades, etc. It could be some of the things other members of posted such as the cream itself or the alum block. No matter how gently I try do do an ATG pass though, I ALWAYS get severe burn with the DE. Maybe my face is just not suited for it. I shave my head as well, and that's one of the main reasons I haven't tried to shave with a DE yet. Can't get a good head shave without going ATG. I always use my Fusion for that.

 

[Hoka Hey]

My suggestion would be to eliminate everything but the razor. No exfoliating in the shower, no pre shave oil, no 3 step post shave alum, after shave, and whatever else.

Get a gentle face soap, Cetaphil or the like, and a sensitive skin shave cream in a can. Aveno, Neutragena, something like that.

Try that with your de razor for a few days. If your getting irritation, it may be technical. If it's good, then try shaving with your T+H.

The point being to re-introduce one element at a time to find out what is causing the damage. Otherwise it's all a guess. I'm suspicious of ye olde exfoliating soap, but the only way to find out is eliminate as many variables as possible, then re-introduce elements one at a time.

I admire your dedication. I'm pretty sure I would have given up.

 

[Jer78]

I have a pattern like yours on my neck and go up from the bottom and down from the top first pass, then cross grain on bottom and ATG on upper neck. I am prone to irritation on my lower neck. Also not stretching skin.

I cannot exfoliate before a shave, I would cut that part first. And moisturize every night for sure.

 

[SullyInATX]

@Jer78 If I go up from the bottom in the middle of my neck it's ATG. On the sides of my neck I can go from the bottom to the top until I hit the jawbone. That's when it turns into ATG. To go WTG on the lower sides of my neck I have to go diagonally towards my ears. Usually with my WTG pass I'll start at the side burns area and go down to just below the jawbone when it hits the new growth direction. I mainly exfoliate because I get super dry skin with hair growth. Like I said above, even a day after shaving I can rub my chin across a dark piece of clothing and there's just skin all over it. I'd love to be able to shave every day to help with that but my skin is just too sensitive. I have to have at least 3-4 days growth.