The Toggle is very fragile compared to the Slims,Fatboys and other razors that i took apart. They break easier but its worth fixing though.
Help with broken Toggle adjustment dial
- Thread starter Bravoure
- Start date
The Toggle is very fragile compared to the Slims,Fatboys and other razors that i took apart. They break easier but its worth fixing though.
- Thread starter
- #22
Well if that may be, maybe someone reading this thread has the part I need and can contact me!
Once again Alex, sorry but that picture is of a different razor than the one being discussed here.
Good night gentlemen....everyone please just soak your razors while I go soak my head...........
He is still taliking about a 5 setting Toggle, it is the same as a 9 setting Toggle, same insides.
- Thread starter
- #28
According to Tom here
It would seem that this 5 dial Toggle has a different internal mechanism than the 9 dial models. For now I will be soaking the razor in some gentle soap and hot water and moving the mechanism in hopes that any gunk will clear out and something will reconnect.
From what i know they are the same concept inside.....soak it anyway and let us know
With the bar that attaches to the doors being broken, It's pretty much done.
- Thread starter
- #31
I do not think that bar has broken as it still opens and closes perfectly. Instead it seems that whatever mechanism which moves the baseplate as the adjustment dial turns no longer functions.
Hope this helps........
Gillette made 3 types of adjustable razors (in many models though), the 1st being the '56 Toggle using the "4 bar system" which pushes 4 bars through the base plate of the razor to adjust the effectiveness of the shave by turning an adjustment knob below the base plate. In '58 they reintroduced the adjustable but this time with a plate that held the blade tight against the doors to bend the blade and the safety bars moved to get the same effect (The Red Dot and Toggle razors). This plate sat inside the base plate and not under it like the other system. But both systems operated by using the same mechanism. With the introduction of the 195 "Fatboy" they went back to the original system, they continued to use this until the adjustable's demise in the 1980's.
The only exception is my most coveted razor the "195 Bottom Dial" which went back to the fixed plate adjustment system (in 2 forms) and the adjustment knob was of course on the bottom of the handle
The pic below shows the 2 different types of adjustment.
From the left.....D1 Red Dot, D1 Toggle (fixed plate/Guard bar adjustment) G2 Fatboy, Q1 Black Beauty (bar adjustment)
The TTO mechanism remained pretty much the same from its inception in 1934 to its demise in the 80's.
A bar operated by a screw raises or lowers the door cradle allowing the 4 lugs on the doors to catch on the base plate and operate the doors. Gillette have used a few ways of doing this the first seems to be threading the TTO knob and the end of the bar (as with the Aristocrat in the pic) some are more difficult to make out such as the solid TTO knob razors. I can only assume that these were assembled fully and then crimped as I can find no way of stripping them down without pulling the TTO knob out of its crimp. The early British Aristocrats have a left hand screw holding them together so are easier to strip down if they need work on them. But with the event of the 195 series they changed this system and the TTO knob has a threaded insert in it with a rectangular slot in it which the bar fits into that moves in the knob and raises the bar, this is all held together by a threaded collar and spring. This carried over to the Slim as well. As anyone who has one of these will have noticed it goes up into the handle when you open the doors.
The obvious one that is different is the Toggle, no screw just the toggle doing that same job.
So onto the adjustable mechanics...........
Gillette designed this to be easy to make, easy to use and to last (you did not change your razor because they had a new plastic colour handle or another blade attached to it.....). The adjustment mechanics are very simple, they fitted an insert into the top of the handle tube (195 Bottom Dial I cannot comment on unless someone wants to give me one to look at....!!) with a threaded portion on the top onto this went the adjustment dial as you turn this it raises the the dial section and pushes against the tray raising the lugs or moves the guard bars. To ensure that you had control over the blade exposure/angle they cut grooves in the top of the adjustment dial which engage in a spring. The grooves correspond to the number on the dial. To stop you from going to far either way, if you look at the lower pic you will note that it has a section that is thicker that the rest.
I hope the pics show you what I mean.
So onto the OP's problem.
You say your razor will go from 1 to 5 but no clicks?
A few things for you to try.......
Grab the blade adjustment plate under the base plate and see if it will move, it should move easily and should not be sticky. Do this with the doors open.
Look at the 4 lugs and starting with the dial at 1 move it to 5 you should see the lugs in the tray move.
If all this is ok then it may just be a sticky spring, as you cannot get it past 1 & 5 the chances are that the spring is still intact.
If nothing moves then there is a good chance that the adjustment is gummed up with crap and tray stuck at position 5.
In any case soaking it is the best way of clearing up your problem. This can take time, the Red Dot in the pic took me 2 days of repeated soaking to get clear. If you don't mind loosing the numbers or are going for a re-plate an ultrasonic bath should help things along. but 90% of the time it will remove all the paint (and sometimes the laquer).
So that one is up to you, the adjustment mechanism is pretty had to screw up unless you start to involve pliers/grips etc.
Good luck with it and I hope it turns out ok..............BTW don't think a strip down is needed just yet.......
Gillette made 3 types of adjustable razors (in many models though), the 1st being the '56 Toggle using the "4 bar system" which pushes 4 bars through the base plate of the razor to adjust the effectiveness of the shave by turning an adjustment knob below the base plate. In '58 they reintroduced the adjustable but this time with a plate that held the blade tight against the doors to bend the blade and the safety bars moved to get the same effect (The Red Dot and Toggle razors). This plate sat inside the base plate and not under it like the other system. But both systems operated by using the same mechanism. With the introduction of the 195 "Fatboy" they went back to the original system, they continued to use this until the adjustable's demise in the 1980's.
The only exception is my most coveted razor the "195 Bottom Dial" which went back to the fixed plate adjustment system (in 2 forms) and the adjustment knob was of course on the bottom of the handle
The pic below shows the 2 different types of adjustment.
From the left.....D1 Red Dot, D1 Toggle (fixed plate/Guard bar adjustment) G2 Fatboy, Q1 Black Beauty (bar adjustment)
The TTO mechanism remained pretty much the same from its inception in 1934 to its demise in the 80's.
A bar operated by a screw raises or lowers the door cradle allowing the 4 lugs on the doors to catch on the base plate and operate the doors. Gillette have used a few ways of doing this the first seems to be threading the TTO knob and the end of the bar (as with the Aristocrat in the pic) some are more difficult to make out such as the solid TTO knob razors. I can only assume that these were assembled fully and then crimped as I can find no way of stripping them down without pulling the TTO knob out of its crimp. The early British Aristocrats have a left hand screw holding them together so are easier to strip down if they need work on them. But with the event of the 195 series they changed this system and the TTO knob has a threaded insert in it with a rectangular slot in it which the bar fits into that moves in the knob and raises the bar, this is all held together by a threaded collar and spring. This carried over to the Slim as well. As anyone who has one of these will have noticed it goes up into the handle when you open the doors.
The obvious one that is different is the Toggle, no screw just the toggle doing that same job.
So onto the adjustable mechanics...........
Gillette designed this to be easy to make, easy to use and to last (you did not change your razor because they had a new plastic colour handle or another blade attached to it.....). The adjustment mechanics are very simple, they fitted an insert into the top of the handle tube (195 Bottom Dial I cannot comment on unless someone wants to give me one to look at....!!) with a threaded portion on the top onto this went the adjustment dial as you turn this it raises the the dial section and pushes against the tray raising the lugs or moves the guard bars. To ensure that you had control over the blade exposure/angle they cut grooves in the top of the adjustment dial which engage in a spring. The grooves correspond to the number on the dial. To stop you from going to far either way, if you look at the lower pic you will note that it has a section that is thicker that the rest.
I hope the pics show you what I mean.
So onto the OP's problem.
You say your razor will go from 1 to 5 but no clicks?
A few things for you to try.......
Grab the blade adjustment plate under the base plate and see if it will move, it should move easily and should not be sticky. Do this with the doors open.
Look at the 4 lugs and starting with the dial at 1 move it to 5 you should see the lugs in the tray move.
If all this is ok then it may just be a sticky spring, as you cannot get it past 1 & 5 the chances are that the spring is still intact.
If nothing moves then there is a good chance that the adjustment is gummed up with crap and tray stuck at position 5.
In any case soaking it is the best way of clearing up your problem. This can take time, the Red Dot in the pic took me 2 days of repeated soaking to get clear. If you don't mind loosing the numbers or are going for a re-plate an ultrasonic bath should help things along. but 90% of the time it will remove all the paint (and sometimes the laquer).
So that one is up to you, the adjustment mechanism is pretty had to screw up unless you start to involve pliers/grips etc.
Good luck with it and I hope it turns out ok..............BTW don't think a strip down is needed just yet.......
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The adjustment plate is probably just gunked up and stuck at a high setting, so lowering the dial does nothing. Just soak and work that plate up and down.
- Thread starter
- #34
Missingskin thank you, this is very valuable information, I hope others get a chance to read this as well. the razor is currently , so hopefully that will do the trick.
Great info post, I told the guys that the mechanism is the same on all toggles. I took mine apart but many others had problems doing this, so i recomemded that he saok it for a good while too.Hope this helps........
Gillette made 3 types of adjustable razors (in many models though), the 1st being the '56 Toggle using the "4 bar system" which pushes 4 bars through the base plate of the razor to adjust the effectiveness of the shave by turning an adjustment knob below the base plate. In '58 they reintroduced the adjustable but this time with a plate that moved the whole blade to get the same effect (The Red Dot and Toggle razors). This plate sat inside the base plate and not under it like the other system. But both operated by using the same mechanism. With the introduction of the 195 "Fatboy" they went back to the original system, they continued to use this until the adjustable's demise in the 1980's.
The only exception is my most coveted razor the "195 Bottom Dial" which went back to the plate adjustment system (in 2 forms) and the adjustment knob was of course on the bottom of the handle
The pic below shows the 2 different types of adjustment.
From the left.....D1 Red Dot, D1 Toggle (plate adjustment) G2 Fatboy, Q1 Black Beauty (bar adjustment)
View attachment 266062
The TTO mechanism remained pretty much the same from its inception in 1934 to its demise in the 80's.
View attachment 266063
A bar operated by a screw raises or lowers the door cradle allowing the 4 lugs on the doors to catch on the base plate and operate the doors. Gillette have used a few ways of doing this the first seems to be threading the TTO knob and the end of the bar (as with the Aristocrat in the pic) some are more difficult to make out such as the solid TTO knob razors. I can only assume that these were assembled fully and then crimped as I can find no way of stripping them down without pulling the TTO knob out of its crimp. The early British Aristocrats have a left hand screw holding them together so are easier to strip down if they need work on them. But with the event of the 195 series they changed this system and the TTO knob has a threaded insert in it with a rectangular slot in it which the bar fits into that moves in the knob and raises the bar, this is all held together by a threaded collar and spring. This carried over to the Slim as well. As anyone who has one of these will have noticed it goes up into the handle when you open the doors.
The obvious one that is different is the Toggle, no screw just the toggle doing that same job.
So onto the adjustable mechanics...........
View attachment 266057
View attachment 266058
Gillette designed this to be easy to make, easy to use and to last (you did not change your razor because they had a new plastic colour handle or another blade attached to it.....). The adjustment mechanics are very simple, they fitted an insert into the top of the handle tube (195 Bottom Dial I cannot comment on unless someone wants to give me one to look at....!!) with a threaded portion on the top onto this went the adjustment dial as you turn this it raises the the dial section and pushes against the tray raising the lugs or tray inside the head. To ensure that you had control over the blade exposure/angle they cut grooves in the top of the adjustment dial which engage in a spring. The grooves correspond to the number on the dial. To stop you from going to far either way, if you look at the lower pic you will note that it has a section that is thicker that the rest.
I hope the pics show you what I mean.
So onto the OP's problem.
You say your razor will go from 1 to 5 but no clicks?
A few things for you to try.......
Grab the blade adjustment plate under the base plate and see if it will move, it should move easily and should not be sticky. Do this with the doors open.
Look at the 4 lugs and starting with the dial at 1 move it to 5 you should see the lugs in the tray move.
If all this is ok then it may just be a sticky spring, as you cannot get it past 1 & 5 the chances are that the spring is still intact.
If nothing moves then there is a good chance that the adjustment is gummed up with crap and tray stuck at position 5.
In any case soaking it is the best way of clearing up your problem. This can take time, the Red Dot in the pic took me 2 days of repeated soaking to get clear. If you don't mind loosing the numbers or are going for a re-plate an ultrasonic bath should help things along. but 90% of the time it will remove all the paint (and sometimes the laquer).
So that one is up to you, the adjustment mechanism is pretty had to screw up unless you start to involve pliers/grips etc.
Good luck with it and I hope it turns out ok..............BTW don't think a strip down is needed just yet.......
Steve, this is one of the best photo attached help guides i have seen..very good work.Hope this helps........
Gillette made 3 types of adjustable razors (in many models though), the 1st being the '56 Toggle using the "4 bar system" which pushes 4 bars through the base plate of the razor to adjust the effectiveness of the shave by turning an adjustment knob below the base plate. In '58 they reintroduced the adjustable but this time with a plate that moved the whole blade to get the same effect (The Red Dot and Toggle razors). This plate sat inside the base plate and not under it like the other system. But both operated by using the same mechanism. With the introduction of the 195 "Fatboy" they went back to the original system, they continued to use this until the adjustable's demise in the 1980's.
The only exception is my most coveted razor the "195 Bottom Dial" which went back to the plate adjustment system (in 2 forms) and the adjustment knob was of course on the bottom of the handle
The pic below shows the 2 different types of adjustment.
From the left.....D1 Red Dot, D1 Toggle (plate adjustment) G2 Fatboy, Q1 Black Beauty (bar adjustment)
View attachment 266062
The TTO mechanism remained pretty much the same from its inception in 1934 to its demise in the 80's.
View attachment 266063
A bar operated by a screw raises or lowers the door cradle allowing the 4 lugs on the doors to catch on the base plate and operate the doors. Gillette have used a few ways of doing this the first seems to be threading the TTO knob and the end of the bar (as with the Aristocrat in the pic) some are more difficult to make out such as the solid TTO knob razors. I can only assume that these were assembled fully and then crimped as I can find no way of stripping them down without pulling the TTO knob out of its crimp. The early British Aristocrats have a left hand screw holding them together so are easier to strip down if they need work on them. But with the event of the 195 series they changed this system and the TTO knob has a threaded insert in it with a rectangular slot in it which the bar fits into that moves in the knob and raises the bar, this is all held together by a threaded collar and spring. This carried over to the Slim as well. As anyone who has one of these will have noticed it goes up into the handle when you open the doors.
The obvious one that is different is the Toggle, no screw just the toggle doing that same job.
So onto the adjustable mechanics...........
View attachment 266057
View attachment 266058
Gillette designed this to be easy to make, easy to use and to last (you did not change your razor because they had a new plastic colour handle or another blade attached to it.....). The adjustment mechanics are very simple, they fitted an insert into the top of the handle tube (195 Bottom Dial I cannot comment on unless someone wants to give me one to look at....!!) with a threaded portion on the top onto this went the adjustment dial as you turn this it raises the the dial section and pushes against the tray raising the lugs or tray inside the head. To ensure that you had control over the blade exposure/angle they cut grooves in the top of the adjustment dial which engage in a spring. The grooves correspond to the number on the dial. To stop you from going to far either way, if you look at the lower pic you will note that it has a section that is thicker that the rest.
I hope the pics show you what I mean.
So onto the OP's problem.
You say your razor will go from 1 to 5 but no clicks?
A few things for you to try.......
Grab the blade adjustment plate under the base plate and see if it will move, it should move easily and should not be sticky. Do this with the doors open.
Look at the 4 lugs and starting with the dial at 1 move it to 5 you should see the lugs in the tray move.
If all this is ok then it may just be a sticky spring, as you cannot get it past 1 & 5 the chances are that the spring is still intact.
If nothing moves then there is a good chance that the adjustment is gummed up with crap and tray stuck at position 5.
In any case soaking it is the best way of clearing up your problem. This can take time, the Red Dot in the pic took me 2 days of repeated soaking to get clear. If you don't mind loosing the numbers or are going for a re-plate an ultrasonic bath should help things along. but 90% of the time it will remove all the paint (and sometimes the laquer).
So that one is up to you, the adjustment mechanism is pretty had to screw up unless you start to involve pliers/grips etc.
Good luck with it and I hope it turns out ok..............BTW don't think a strip down is needed just yet.......
That is some fantastic information. Do we have it in the Wiki? We should.
I bookmarked it and sent Steve a thank email
I enjoyed reading your post about adjustables, lot of good stuff in there, but think you may wish to look a bit closer at the D-1/F-4 (Red Dot and Toggle razors) if this is to be added to the wiki, then please note that the blade is not adjusted up and down. The doors bend, shape and clamp the blade to a plate that has a fixed height. It is the safety bars that are adjusted up and down.
Very good observation...i never noticed that, i only took Fatboys, Slims and Toggle apart
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