Got my Coti! Now come the questions.

[Fletch]

Got home today and noticed the postman left me a gift. My Coti arrived from Jarrod. Not sure about the whole vein thing and names I can't pronounce but when I bought it it was a "Select 6x2 Kit with Slurry Stone and a Norton IM50 Case" I will say it's very convenient to have the stone sitting in a case to keep everything self contained.

Now here come the questions:

First and foremost. Do I need to do anything with it before using it? i.e. soak it for any period of time or anything along those lines?

Second and here is where the tricky part comes in I have basically 3 razors I can play with and one on the way back from Larry to serve as my baseline. 1 razor I use is basically shave ready, probably not as sharp as it can be but shaves just fine and I would say is at the HHT3 stage. Another is around the HHT1-2 stage and one is basically kaput. I bought it from a member here who said he over stropped it with paste (used it every time he stropped) and it doesn't shave well at all. In your opinion, what should I start with or does it not really matter as I'll likely ruing whatever I try anyway? I was thinking of taking the one that was at the HHT1-2 stage and just trying to get that sharper as I probably can do that with just water...Possibly? This way I don't have to worry (as much) about bevel setting with a slurry and then working my way up from there. So I essesntially just try to do some moderate touching up with the HHT1-2 razor. Assuming that goes well I can try a light touch up with my HHT3 razor and then. Again, assuming success, takle the one that needs to start form square one.

So what say ye gents?

Also obv worthless without pics so here she is. Top down shot of the case with the stone and slurry stone perched on top.

 

[Munxcub]

No need to soak it, just splash some water on and have at it.

I would suggest not touching the edge on your only shave ready one. I did this and it was frustrating as it was out of commission for a couple weeks.

You could take the kaput one, run it once over a glass, and start it from there.

Follow the dilucot and report back with problems and questions.

 

[kg4ghn]

Your coticule does not have to be soaked, just splash some water on top and you are ready to go.

The razor that has been overstropped with paste will require a full honing. The bevel will have to be reset.

If you want to start with the razor that passes HHT1, then I would try doing 30-60 light x-strokes on water, then strop and see what you get. If that doesn't get you where you want it, then make a very light slurry with just a couple of rubs of the slurry stone. Do 20-30 laps, dilute by adding 1 or 2 drops of water, and repeat about 5 times. Then wash the hone and do another 30-60 x-strokes on water, strop and test again.


If you haven't seen it, I would suggest going to Bart's site at www.coticule.be and clicking on the Sharpening Academy and reading about Unicot and Dilucot. There is also a forum there with lot's of great information to read up on. I would also suggest reading the "about ready to trade coti in for synthetics" thread on here.

 

[Fletch]

I would suggest not touching the edge on your only shave ready one. I did this and it was frustrating as it was out of commission for a couple weeks.

Well I also have one coming back from Larry which has already shipped and should be here in a few days tops. I was toying with the idea of using one of the bottom 2. Kaput or HHT1-2 as a starting point. I've gotten a bit better than halfway through Munx's Coti thread and still will have so spend a bit of time at Coticle.be and read and watch the vids. I'm like a kid in a candy store though, I just wanna hop right in (even though it's probably not wise). I've basically been rather good at sharpening things over the years. I got into it in high school when I used to sharpen the turning tools in wood shop and my teacher would shave hairs off his arm with them when I got done. From there it's been a TON of pocket knives and knives I've made. I realize a straight is different but it is a hobby I have always enjoyed.

 

[Munxcub]

Just jump right in with the kaput one, you can't make it worse! It's the only way you learn.

 

[danjared]

Work on the kaput one first. Do not touch the other ones until you have gotten a bit of a feel for the stone and the feedback it gives.

 

[Fletch]

PROGRESS!!!

Well I after spending some time on coticule.be and watching the Dilucot video (heck this looks easy ) I grabbed my rock and my kaput Dovo and off I went. First thing I wanted to know was just how bad the edge really was so I tried to get it to remove any hair on any appendage...Nothing.

Made my first slurry and after doing 40 passes (20 each side) I was left with some chalky powder on the stone . Added some water and off I went. After putting in about the same work as in the video (although I didn't do any x passes) I figured I'd give it a shot. Nothing seemed to change . Also forgot to mention as I was doing my passes I felt and hear a slight "clunk" on the stone. Closer inspection revealed the edge was rolled to one side a bit at the tip.

Whipped up another slurry and off I went again never moving past (forgive my terminology as I haven't nailed down all the correct vernacular) "rubbing passes". Checked the edge and while it felt a bit better on the TPT still not shaving a blessed thing.

On to slurry #3 and over an hour later. This one I basically took from a heavy (to me) slurry to near water and then finished up with x passes. TPT got that "sticky feeling and tried shaving some hair on the leg (I have hardly any arm hair) sure enough it was chopping hair off, not wiping it away but removing it nonetheless. Took it to the strop and did about 20 passes on the canvas side then 50 on the leather and went for the HHT. Wound up with pretty much HHT1 with some occasional HH2 spots. So I consider that a win in my book. After being at the stone for well over an hour I decided to pack it up for a while and go back at it another day.

So overall I actually made progress and luckily didn't make the edge any worse. Although aside from incorporating a hammer into the whole thing not sure how I could make it any worse.

One thing I did find that was quite comfortable and consistent (although probably bad form) was I was using a 2 handed method. I basically "pinched" the spine near the heel and tip with each hand and ran it across the stone like that. I find ti allows me to make sure the edge stays dead flat on the stone and I can apply equal pressure (both heavy and light) very easy. Is this bad?

 

[kg4ghn]

One thing: To make a bevel you need to make a fairly thick slurry and keep it thick until it shaves arm/leg hair. Once it does that down the entire edge you know the bevel is set. Only then should you start doing the dilutions. You may have to add some water here and there(you don't want the stone to dry out) but not for the point of diluting the slurry.

If you haven't already, you should also read the following threads from coticule.be:

http://www.coticule.be/the-cafeteria/topic/266.html

http://www.coticule.be/the-cafeteria/topic/235.html

 

[danjared]

For bevel setting, thick like milk, not cream, and never like yogurt.

 

[Fletch]

Gotcha, milk-like for bevel stetting, no dilutions.

Now that I'm getting basically HH1 throughout the length of the razor with spots of HHT2 do I focus more on developing the edge (with dilutions) or should I spend some more time with the milky slurry?

 

[kg4ghn]

As long as it is shaving hair down the entire edge then the bevel is set and there is no reason to do that any more.

Seeing as how you are getting HHT1/2 you could be fairly close. I would rub the hone with the slurry stone about 3 or 4 times(I use a little bit of pressure when doing this) to make a real thin slurry. Then do sets of around 20-30 halfstrokes on each side, dilute with a drop or two of water. Do about 4 or 5 dilutions, then a big splash of water, another set of half-strokes. Then wash the hone and razor and do 30-60 x strokes on water. Take it slow and concentrate on doing good strokes.


What we mean when we say setting a bevel is taking the very edge from being completely non-sharp and being U shaped to being sharp and V shaped. Both sides of the bevel come to a point. So when it shaves arm hair you know you have set the bevel and have gotten the basic sharpness there. Then what you are wanting to do is refine the edge, making it sharper and sharper until it gets to the level where comfortable shaves happen. Using synthetic hones this is done by using several hones of increasing grit. You would start with a 1000 grit to set the bevel then progress through a 4000, 8000, and then a finishing hone somewhere above that, usually in the 10000-12000 grit range(other progressions are used as well, but that is the general idea). Using a coticule you are doing the same thing but with one stone. However if you just went from thick slurry to just water it would take 1000s of laps to get the edge to where it needs to be. So you slowly dilute the slurry with water bringing it closer and closer to where you want it, and then finishing on water.

 

[Fletch]

Am I practicing horrible form by doing a 2 handed one?

 

[danjared]

Am I practicing horrible form by doing a 2 handed one?

Not horrible, but you'll have an easier time getting a light stroke if you do hand-honing (once you adjust to holding the razor in one hand and the stone in the other). You want a light stroke. You could simulate a lighter stroke by honing just on oil (or shaving soap--not cream--lather) instead of water if you are having trouble with it. But equally important is a consistent stroke.

 

[azmark]

PROGRESS!!!

Well I after spending some time on coticule.be and watching the Dilucot video (heck this looks easy )

Ah the words every new coticule user says before they want to chuck it out of the window

Just have patience with it but most importantly is to get to know your coticule and it's capabilities. You may have a coticule that needs a handful of sets to set the bevel or just one.

 

[danjared]

Ah the words every new coticule user says before they want to chuck it out of the window

Just have patience with it but most importantly is to get to know your coticule and it's capabilities. You may have a coticule that needs a handful of sets to set the bevel or just one.

*shrug* It sounds like he's doing fine. It helps to have knife experience, though.

As many have noted before, even Bart, once you've got violining with the HHT, the rest is just finishing.

 

[Munxcub]

You're doing just fine dude, just fine. Once you're stuck in violin land, time to lighten the touch, admit to any blown strokes (and start over when necessary). I really like doing my last rounds of x-strokes under lightly running water. This will be difficult if you aren't rocking the hone in the hand.

But keep at it! You're almost there.

 

[Fletch]

Talk about great timing. Today my razor and poor man strop kit arrived from Larry so when the time comes I have the CrOx and FeOx should I need to use something I KNOW is 1 micron to finish. Plus his strop it better than the selective I have. And now I also have a professionally honed razor to compare to. I love it when a plan comes together.........Now I just have to make sure I can make it work.

 

[Munxcub]

Excellent. The first couple I honed I couldn't quite get it there with just the Coti and that's where TI razor paste and CrOx was nice, because it got me shaving again. It didn't take long at all after that to get usable edges from the coti alone.

You're all set!

Do tests on the edge from Larry, TPT, HHT, etc... and "calibrate" the results of the hair you use for HHT and associate it with the quality of the shave from the edge. That way you know how close you are, or if you have an edge ready for the shave test. Just don't do the TNT on it, as that can degrade a finished edge. Ok at the bevel setting stage, but after that it's not recommended.

 

[danjared]

Since you have other shave-ready razors, I would not use any pastes on the razors you're learning to hone. The pastes will give you more immediate results on those razors, but I think they will also slow down the learning process.

 

[Munxcub]

True. I only used paste on my first one so I could have something shave ready, and then on the 2nd one because it was for a PIF and I needed to get it shave ready to ship it. But after that I haven't used them much at all. Maybe some CrOx just to see how/if it changed the edge much.