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Chinese razors: tariffs and branding -- Where has Baili gone?

Went looking for the model number for a Baili razor on Am****, and it wasn't there. Each time I checked, there were fewer Baili razors listed. Now there is only a Baili DE blade for sale, and it is really bad.

Is Baili getting out of the retail business?

Or are there new tariffs on the import of Chinese goods to the U.S. that has affected razor manufacturers like Baili? Someone mentioned there would be new tariffs on July 1, if I recall correctly, and this would be right on time.

I tried looking up tariffs, but there are so many old news stories on Chinese tariffs that it was impossible to sort things out. However, I did see mention of China providing rebates to exporters to offset U.S. tariffs. That might help explain the bizarrely low prices on some Chinese razors.

A lot of Chinese razors are junk, either bad knockoffs or goofy experiments. Yes, this means you, Yaqi. And some Chinese sellers on Am**** are dishonest.

But there are also excellent knockoffs, and some excellent original razors, like the Baili butterfly TTO. And many Chinese sellers on Am**** (and in China) are trustworthy. Plus, I suspect some/many of the name brand razor companies have their zamak heads cast and plated in China.

It's not like tariffs on Chinese goods will bring DE razor mass production back to the U.S. But it will encourage it in other countries, like India and Pakistan, and maybe Germany will actually make their own razors again.

And, let's be honest, the price of most zamak razors, particularly the knockoffs, is absurdly low.

I wonder what's going to happen to Baili, and to that strangely named outfit SNMIRN? How can they survive with such low prices?

But the bigger problem for Chinese razor manufacturers, as I see it, is they have terrible marketing skills. Your brand needs to have a name and names for each razor, names that can be pronounced, remembered, spelled and recommended to others. And your razors need a sense of prestige and pizzazz. Look at the old Gillette marketing! Those were razors that sizzled, with names, prices, and swank boxes that made them status symbols. And the gold plating made them into sex symbols.

If you want to see how to market knockoff razors, look at Roman Empire, sold by the reputable Razor Blades Club:


They come in a very nice box quite suitable for gift giving, with a good starter sampler of blades, they are genuinely good razors, and each has the name of a Roman emperor.

SNMIRN, Baili and MingShi should have been doing this. And with SNMIRN's beautiful, sleek magnetic adjustable razor, they should have started with an ultra-deluxe model, with shiny (real) gold plate and a durable plush box, like the old Gillettes. If you can get a vintage razor replated in gold at a reasonable price, surely they could have mass produced gold-plated razors at an affordable price, too. You could call it the "Fort Knox Special Edition," except no one in China has the faintest idea what "Fort Knox" is. Give your brand name some class! That's what Viking Razors is doing. (Did Vikings actually shave? At least Romans did.)

I'm not sure how much longer SNMIRN and Baili will be around, at least in the Western market. But I do see Baili razors still being sold under other brand names, including the prestige Vikings label. So you can still buy them, for now.

I have mixed feelings on the shave from the SNMIRN mag-adjustable razor. But it does deliver a good shave at some settings, and is remarkably pretty. The Baili butterfly TTO is a hidden gem, and delivers a great shave once you find the best (acute) angle.

OKOKOK, so it's a bit complicated. But the bottom line:

Does anyone know what is going on with tariffs on Chinese goods, in the U.S., EU and elsewhere?

Any thoughts on optimal razor marketing?

-=-
 
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luvmysuper

My elbows leak
Staff member
Amazon did a massive purge and banned countless Chinese sellers who were pumping up their listings with fake reviews.
I read an article about how one particular town was devastated as Amazon sales was the only income source there.
Not sure if this is the reason you can't find some items.
I'm not sure if it affected only second hand retailers or manufacturing and sales companies.

 
Companies like Baili are not primarily making razors for us in the United States. They are making razors more for developing countries. Low price is really important.

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People selling these razors in the developed world are independent resellers for the most part. Vikings Blade has rebranded Chinese razors with a high mark-up. Is a razor that sells for $4 really worth $30 because of a few cosmetic changes and a bunch of sales talk B.S.?
 
Companies like Baili are not primarily making razors for us in the United States. They are making razors more for developing countries. Low price is really important.

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People selling these razors in the developed world are independent resellers for the most part. Vikings Blade has rebranded Chinese razors with a high mark-up. Is a razor that sells for $4 really worth $30 because of a few cosmetic changes and a bunch of sales talk B.S.?

Well, yeah. But I doubt they sell a lot to the folks in the photo you posted, which is of India. China and India haven't been on good terms for quite a while now. And Pearl is making razors for India. When I was in India, I sure would have liked to have been able to buy a decent Chinese razor.

Americans would be astonished to see what Chinese stuff sells for on Taobao. But they can't see it because it is blocked to anyone not registered and inside China these days, from what I can tell -- their computers can spot a VPN. And when foreigners could open Taobao pages, often sellers had fake prices for people with foreign IP addresses, sometimes 5x or 10x or more than the Chinese prices. Then the agents, who purchase and ship stuff for foreigners, could soak Western customers. That I resent.

I do not resent Viking doing their marketing thing. Baili and other Chinese manufacturers really should have done something like that first. The only two Baili razors I like are the butterfly TTO and the Tech-type compact three-piece razor. The rest are worthless, in my experience, so I don't see how Viking can sell them. But good marketing can do wonders, and they do.

Make a deluxe version, tighten the quality control, put it in a classy box, give it a cool name, and you are entitled to sell it for more. That's what Gillette did.

But you know if the razor sells for $4 in China, retail, delivered, then it must cost the seller about $2. And if it costs the seller $2 wholesale, then it must cost the factory no more than $1 to make, package and ship.

Those Weishis and their rebranded twins that you can find in stores in the U.S. selling for $20 probably cost the factory 25 cents to make, if that.
 
Well, yeah. But I doubt they sell a lot to the folks in the photo you posted, which is of India. China and India haven't been on good terms for quite a while now. And Pearl is making razors for India. When I was in India, I sure would have liked to have been able to buy a decent Chinese razor.

Americans would be astonished to see what Chinese stuff sells for on Taobao. But they can't see it because it is blocked to anyone not registered and inside China these days, from what I can tell -- their computers can spot a VPN. And when foreigners could open Taobao pages, often sellers had fake prices for people with foreign IP addresses, sometimes 5x or 10x or more than the Chinese prices. Then the agents, who purchase and ship stuff for foreigners, could soak Western customers. That I resent.

I do not resent Viking doing their marketing thing. Baili and other Chinese manufacturers really should have done something like that first. The only two Baili razors I like are the butterfly TTO and the Tech-type compact three-piece razor. The rest are worthless, in my experience, so I don't see how Viking can sell them. But good marketing can do wonders, and they do.

Make a deluxe version, tighten the quality control, put it in a classy box, give it a cool name, and you are entitled to sell it for more. That's what Gillette did.

But you know if the razor sells for $4 in China, retail, delivered, then it must cost the seller about $2. And if it costs the seller $2 wholesale, then it must cost the factory no more than $1 to make, package and ship.

Those Weishis and their rebranded twins that you can find in stores in the U.S. selling for $20 probably cost the factory 25 cents to make, if that.

It's Bangladesh and you might be surprised...

In January 2021 China exported $1.76B and imported $90.6M from Bangladesh...

I was just pointing out that we in the developed world are not the primary market for these razors.

I have a Baili Tech Clone and it's pretty good, though the handle was not my style, so I changed it.
 
Is Baili getting out of the retail business?
They may have shifted focus to the Aliexpress site which is part of the Alibaba group. They have an official store on that site.
They also manufacture cartridge razors so are very much in the razor retail business.
 
It's Bangladesh and you might be surprised...



I was just pointing out that we in the developed world are not the primary market for these razors.

I have a Baili Tech Clone and it's pretty good, though the handle was not my style, so I changed it.

Sadly, I am not surprised. That Chinese Belt and Road initiative smelled like a scam from the beginning - 21st Century colonialism. If China really wanted to help countries develop, they would import more from them and invest more in them. But, who knows, maybe I am wrong about that, too; I often am.

I should have suspected the photo was of Bangladesh; the street is too crowded even for India. Not to mention the rickshaws. And the electrical wiring is far too orderly to be India.

Yes, I agree that the primary market for inexpensive Chinese razors is Asia and other less developed regions. However, there tends to be a stigma associated with DE shaving. In China, that's how the sunburned peasants working the fields shave. So, most people use cheap electric razors or cartridges. China makes dirt cheap rechargeable electric razors, which have the advantage that you don't need to do all that prep.

I knew a young store owner in India who would only shave with a five-blade Gillette razor. To stretch that expensive cartridge to a month, he didn't shave every day. But he wouldn't be caught dead shaving with a plebian DE razor.

So I still say, the way to improve the sales of DE razors is to make models that give them prestige: Deluxe, expensive models that make people lust for them, the way the Gillette of old did. Then, those working stiffs say, well, I can't afford the fancy model, but I can buy the basic model.

Savvy marketing can still work in the third world -- it is a way of not insulting the customers by stressing how cheap the stuff is. Remember: Sell the sizzle, not the steak.

I'm not an expert on Pearl razors, but it looks like they understand.


They may have shifted focus to the Aliexpress site which is part of the Alibaba group. They have an official store on that site.
They also manufacture cartridge razors so are very much in the razor retail business.

Perhaps you are right.

But I don't think AliExpress reaches nearly as many people in North America as Amazon does. Their prices often aren't so inexpensive as you would assume. And some people elsewhere, like Sweden, are reporting that the import duties can really hurt.

My guess is that Baili did get blacklisted from Amazon for fake reviews, though I don't think they were the worst offender. This also seems to have hit the duck press industry hard.

When I see photos, sometimes professional grade, of products still in the box, or just barely removed and unsullied, I get suspicious that they are either going to be returned or resold, especially when the review sounds like boilerplate. How can you write a review if you don't ACTUALLY use them?

QShave, whoever they are, is probably better at marketing than Baili, and if they are smart will make an arrangement to ramp up selling Baili razors in the West. Of course, if you push up the price of Baili razors too much, you end up competing with some superior razors; but most consumers aren't aware of the many DE options. Please, do stop selling Baili blades; they are all pretty pathetic, except for the Platinum+, which is slightly above mediocre.

All this still leaves the primary question unanswered: Wither new tariffs on the import of Chinese goods?
 
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A few days late but I just noticed this myself. Baili has a second brand (or parent?) Weidi, that also had a few razors listed. Weidi has completely vanished, and every Baili item is now unavailable. As mention by @luvmysuper above, this is probably part of the second round of purges. A hugely popular brand RavPower that sold phone accessories like chargers was also wiped out this round.

As someone who enjoys mild razors I do have the Tech II from Italian Barber which is just a Baili without a logo. I'm all for getting rid of the fake reviews, but wiping out otherwise decent brands doesn't mean I will stop looking for them. I'll just be buying from Ali instead of Amazon.
 
Went looking for the model number for a Baili razor on Am****, and it wasn't there. Each time I checked, there were fewer Baili razors listed. Now there is only a Baili DE blade for sale, and it is really bad.

Is Baili getting out of the retail business?

Or are there new tariffs on the import of Chinese goods to the U.S. that has affected razor manufacturers like Baili? Someone mentioned there would be new tariffs on July 1, if I recall correctly, and this would be right on time.

I tried looking up tariffs, but there are so many old news stories on Chinese tariffs that it was impossible to sort things out. However, I did see mention of China providing rebates to exporters to offset U.S. tariffs. That might help explain the bizarrely low prices on some Chinese razors.

A lot of Chinese razors are junk, either bad knockoffs or goofy experiments. Yes, this means you, Yaqi. And some Chinese sellers on Am**** are dishonest.

But there are also excellent knockoffs, and some excellent original razors, like the Baili butterfly TTO. And many Chinese sellers on Am**** (and in China) are trustworthy. Plus, I suspect some/many of the name brand razor companies have their zamak heads cast and plated in China.

It's not like tariffs on Chinese goods will bring DE razor mass production back to the U.S. But it will encourage it in other countries, like India and Pakistan, and maybe Germany will actually make their own razors again.

And, let's be honest, the price of most zamak razors, particularly the knockoffs, is absurdly low.

I wonder what's going to happen to Baili, and to that strangely named outfit SNMIRN? How can they survive with such low prices?

But the bigger problem for Chinese razor manufacturers, as I see it, is they have terrible marketing skills. Your brand needs to have a name and names for each razor, names that can be pronounced, remembered, spelled and recommended to others. And your razors need a sense of prestige and pizzazz. Look at the old Gillette marketing! Those were razors that sizzled, with names, prices, and swank boxes that made them status symbols. And the gold plating made them into sex symbols.

If you want to see how to market knockoff razors, look at Roman Empire, sold by the reputable Razor Blades Club:


They come in a very nice box quite suitable for gift giving, with a good starter sampler of blades, they are genuinely good razors, and each has the name of a Roman emperor.

SNMIRN, Baili and MingShi should have been doing this. And with SNMIRN's beautiful, sleek magnetic adjustable razor, they should have started with an ultra-deluxe model, with shiny (real) gold plate and a durable plush box, like the old Gillettes. If you can get a vintage razor replated in gold at a reasonable price, surely they could have mass produced gold-plated razors at an affordable price, too. You could call it the "Fort Knox Special Edition," except no one in China has the faintest idea what "Fort Knox" is. Give your brand name some class! That's what Viking Razors is doing. (Did Vikings actually shave? At least Romans did.)

I'm not sure how much longer SNMIRN and Baili will be around, at least in the Western market. But I do see Baili razors still being sold under other brand names, including the prestige Vikings label. So you can still buy them, for now.

I have mixed feelings on the shave from the SNMIRN mag-adjustable razor. But it does deliver a good shave at some settings, and is remarkably pretty. The Baili butterfly TTO is a hidden gem, and delivers a great shave once you find the best (acute) angle.

OKOKOK, so it's a bit complicated. But the bottom line:

Does anyone know what is going on with tariffs on Chinese goods, in the U.S., EU and elsewhere?

Any thoughts on optimal razor marketing?

-=-
I bought a Baili BD 176 (tech clone) on Amazon last year and gave it to my son to start wet shaving (he loves it BTW) so I needed a replacement. It's not on Amazon anymore but it was easy enough to buy on AliExpress. You can buy a couple of Yaqi brushes while you're there.
 
Chinese razors in short supply are a symptom of the global supply chain problem. Today, there are 54 container ships outside the Port of Los Angeles waiting to dock and unload. It used to take 4 to 6 weeks to get my orders from Aliexpress (Yaqi, Baili, etc.), and now I suspect it may take several months. It is possible that products which are totally sold out, were removed from retailer sites, until they can replenish their stock. According to most economists, this situation will last at least through 2022 and possibly through 2023. Covid has removed too many people from the world's labor force. I am glad I have nearly 50 razors and thousands of blades to choose from in my collection. There are still many razors out there to purchase, new and vintage.
 
They still have more than 600 of the Baili TTO razors in stock, and on sale at approximately the $6 price. With the supply chain problems, Maggards may have the largest inventory outside of China! Great deal at those sale prices.
 
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