Butterscotch/Ivory handle - HELP !!!!!

[fidjit]

Some may have noted that I ordered a brush from Canada which was butterscotch and from the photos MIGHT have been ivory.

Note I don't want this thread to turn into an ivory trade discussion. I bought this brush and it wasn't till after I pulled the pin I had thoughts about it's possible material.

Now I recieved it today. It's a beautiful brush ( regardless of material ), and it looks much better in real life than it did in the pictures. But what's it made out off ?

In my hand it's heavier and "warmer" than a bakelite/catalin brush. It has a number of small brown "imperfections".

It has parallel lines running up the brush and the base ( which I assume would be a cross-section ) shows the criss cross pattern indicative of mammoth tusk ( after extensive googling ).

It appears to be a two part brush after cleaning out around the middle. The bristles were so bad they practically fell out in my hand. There's cork under the knot so I've got some room to play with the loft. It's about a 20mm knot hole, top to the cork base is 10mm and I think I've got about 14mm of cork to play around with ( put a pin into the cork, mark where it stopped )

Regardless of the material I really love this handle, just need to get the right knot, and I think this one needs something a bit "special " BUT , can anybody assist with what it's made out of...PLEASE !!!!!

( The pictures really don't do the colour justice ) ( Then again I'm actually wondering if I should cut it back and remove the pantina to make it "ivory white" again )

 

[DSB]

My best guess is unicorn horn.

 

[Jim]

Even the most casual observer would agree, it's a Narwhal tusk.



Ivory

 

[bob.e]

That is a really beautiful handle it could be ivory for all we know being from up north even walrus tusk, if it is Ivory it appears to be an old brush and probably made long before the Ivory ban so I'd harbor no guilt owning it

 

[Isaac]

Lovely brush handle...wanna sell it?

 

[fidjit]

My best guess is unicorn horn.

Woo, that makes it pretty rare then

Even the most casual observer would agree, it's a Narwhal tusk.

Serious ?!? (oops, just saw your postscript )

That is a really beautiful handle it could be ivory for all we know being from up north even walrus tusk, if it is Ivory it appears to be an old brush and probably made long before the Ivory ban so I'd harbor no guilt owning it

I don't feel guilty but searching through the archives brought up some interesting "conversations" around ivory, pre/post ban, CITE etc., USA and Canadian laws etc. It obviously can be a touchy subject

Lovely brush handle...wanna sell it?

Do you know something about it I don't know ( besides the fact that it really is a lovely handle ) ...tell....tell

 

[Schwert]

I am pretty sure that is not walrus ivory. Walrus generally has more of a "cracked ice" pattern in it.

If that is ivory I would guess elephant.

It should make a super brush.

 

[xillion]

Could it be Rhino horn?

 

[fidjit]

I am pretty sure that is not walrus ivory. Walrus generally has more of a "cracked ice" pattern in it.
If that is ivory I would guess elephant.

From the US Fish and Wildlife Service ID page, I THINK it's mammoth ivory due to the < 90 degree Schreger Lines and the " intrusive brownish or blue-green colored blemishes caused by an iron phosphate called vivianite."

But I'm no expert and I'd love someone with a bit more experience to confirm for me !!!!

It should make a super brush.

Have decided a 20mm knot for density ( was tossing up an 18 mm ) but debating Grade A, A UK, Super, Super UK...I'm thinking this handle might warrant the extra for a Super UK @ around 45mm loft ( or maybe even lower ) even though Tony reckons they'd be hard to tell apart from a blind test.

Butterscotch brushes.....meh !!!!

 

[dpm802]

( The pictures really don't do the colour justice )

In order to get colors to reproduce properly, study your digital camera's manual about how to calibrate "White Balance." Also, look at getting some full spectrum light bulbs to illuminate the object, or take a picture of it outdoors on a bright, sunny day.

Sorry, I can't help you out with identifying the material. It is a beautiful looking handle, though. Good luck with the restoration project.

 

[Greybeard]

Here are a couple of links to articles for identifying various materials used in scrimshaw. They might help.

http://www.scrimshawstudio.com/faq.html

http://www.asianartmall.com/refivory.htm



- Peter

 

[dpm802]

I'm confused by the picture of the bottom of the handle, where the grain pattern appears to be at right angles to itself.

I can't imagine any way that this would occur in a natural material.

 

[Jim]

The link Peter provided above is very illustrative.

http://www.asianartmall.com/schreger-lines.htm

​

 

[DaveMartell]

To test ivory/bone you can heat up a pin and poke it. If it burns in it's faux (or man-made) and if not then it's a natural. Obviously do this test inside the handle where it won't show.

 

[Schwert]

I used a 23mm UK Super in my first brush. It really is a fine knot. I set mine at 46mm and it is near perfect at that loft.

However.....I am not sure that I can honestly tell that it is in any way a better knot than any of my Chinese finests or Grade A. It is a bit difficult to compare because it is 23mm against 18 and 20mm knots...but as to the feel on my face or efficiency to load with soap I really do not think I could tell you which knot was which if I did not know.

Also the UK knots seem to be quite a bit taller so weigh that into you decision too...as you may need to drill out the handle more than you want to set it low enough.

No matter what material this handle may be...it should make for an amazing restore.

 

[fidjit]

I used a 23mm UK Super in my first brush. It really is a fine knot. I set mine at 46mm and it is near perfect at that loft.

However.....I am not sure that I can honestly tell that it is in any way a better knot than any of my Chinese finests or Grade A. It is a bit difficult to compare because it is 23mm against 18 and 20mm knots...but as to the feel on my face or efficiency to load with soap I really do not think I could tell you which knot was which if I did not know.

Also the UK knots seem to be quite a bit taller so weigh that into you decision too...as you may need to drill out the handle more than you want to set it low enough.

No matter what material this handle may be...it should make for an amazing restore.

According to Tony, he reckons in a blind test that you probably couldn't tell the different between any of his knots from Silvertip Grade A up, but I figured for this brush which I think's pretty special ( even specialier than a good butterscotch ) I'd go the whole hog ummm badger !

I also want to test the 20mm Finest against the "highest quality" knot myself for my own reference.

I've actually ordered a Super 20mm ( bulb ) and a UK Super 20mm ( fan ) (64mm and 62mm). The brush has a cork shelf that gives me up to 24mm to play with in terms of loft. I'll see what the density of the knots are and go from there. Who knows I might even end up with a 38mm loft !

Will post pics when complete. Can we cancel Easter please, I want my knots !!!!

 

[Schwert]

I am sure one of those knots will put decades of fine use back in this one.

Cork shelf makes this nice too...42-45mm would turn this into a brush of wonder.

There is just nothing in the new market that will ever have the class of this one.

 

[Blue-EyedSon]

I don't know what material it is made of, but it looks great! Be sure to post photos whenever everything is finished!

 

[Yonjuro]

really nice Ian!!!

The fossil ivory I have is very white with little grain showing and all of the samples I say in Russia were similar. The yellow tones are more in keeping with aged pre ban Elephant Ivory.

Did you say that you did the hot pin test?

Great score.

PS I Just received the 23mm UK super from TGN and it feels very very nice, I need to open the handle up a git more for mounting. Unmounted it feels like it has good backbone and very soft tips.

 

[SRock]

Even the most casual observer would agree, it's a Narwhal tusk.



Ivory

Yes, Narwhal




Ivory