Aargh, can't get the lather right with L'Occitane.

[xgunterx]

I face lather and I've Palmolive stick, Tabac, P.160, Prorasso in rotation at the moment and this Cade soap.
I just can't get decent lather with it. This morning, I dropped a bit of hot water on the puck, swirled 30 times on the puck with a damp brush and the water/ratio seems to be ok, but the lather I get is very mediocore. It doesn't provide cushion and it isn't very slick either. It is somewhat powdery in a sense and does seem to dry out after a while.

I'll try it again tomorrow with some more water and a smoother blade (Astra).
I really would like to love this soap because the scent is sooo good.
Is the formulation the same no matter where you buy the puck?
I threw away the packaging so I can't check.

Anybody else who has some bad experience with L'Occitane or am I the lonely exception to the rule?

 

[jhclare]

It could be your water?

I live in London, UK and our water is pretty hard. However, I've had no trouble with Cade and it lathers as easily as Tabac, for me. I have real trouble with MWF though, am going to try it with a boar brush as suggested by someone on the forum.

I love the scent of Cade, but I sometimes find it gets up my nose a bit and I feel like I need to sneeze.

I also find it lacking in the moisturising department, in spite of the Shea Butter. I want to try the other French soaps (Institut Karite, Provence Sante, etc) to see if they're more moisturising.

 

[xgunterx]

It could be your water?

I doubt it. I have very hard water here (+40 French degrees) but I've a watersoftener installed. The water is now just hard enough not to be agressive to metals (7 French degrees).

8<
I also find it lacking in the moisturising department, in spite of the Shea Butter. I want to try the other French soaps (Institut Karite, Provence Sante, etc) to see if they're more moisturising.

I'm looking forward to try them as well.

 

[Cookie_Junkie]

Hello Gunter!!

That Cade sure can be a tricky soap sometimes… But what a soap! I just love it and mostly enjoy it as a Sunday morning soap. Spoilt!??

I too first thought it could be the hard water, but not with your softener.
The brush, well… I don’t think so, although it is true you get the most out of Cade with a rather harder brush, I sometimes indulge in my Sunday Luxury Experience with a Kent BK4 which is far from being stiff, right?

I actually think it has much more to do with the “triple-milled” trick. You seem to do quite well, but maybe not for long enough. This one sure ain’t your soft P160, huh!?!!

I let some hot water sit on top of the soap for at least 10 minutes while I shower and then tilt it upside down but not completely dry. I hit it with a rather dry-ish brush, that is well shaken and pressed a little.
Go for a few swirls till I get a proto lather on top of the cake (YES, it looks dry and creamy, with dwarven spikes) and the brush looks FULLY loaded.
Then I finish with a face lather, for at least 2 minutes. Another trick here is to keep your face wet. I mean WET, drippin’ over the sink. I actually put down the brush once it’s loaded and re-soak my face with hot water just before I lather. This water you’ll need to get absorbed by your brush and proto lather. But maybe it’s just me…

Anyway, it’s true that Cade is rather on the dry side for the face (but healing at the same time) and can sometimes evaporate and vanish into “flying flakes” as you take too much time to enjoy it.
This happens when you missed the trick, namely, not enough soap with the wrong water ratio, or not enough work building up. Yet, you seem to have mastered that water/soap ratio. The next steps I would try and change in your technique would be:

-Let sit water on top of soap for a bit longer
-Hit with a drier brush
-Fully, FULLY load the brush, yes MORE soap (this is often a lather KSF)
-Face lather on a drippin’face.

Now I wish you good luck and enjoy that warm woodsy juniper scent.

C_J

 

[xgunterx]

That Cade sure can be a tricky soap sometimes…
8<

Reaaally?

8<
The brush, well… I don’t think so, although it is true you get the most out of Cade with a rather harder brush, I sometimes indulge in my Sunday Luxury Experience with a Kent BK4 which is far from being stiff, right?

Well, my brush is a cheap Wilkinson brush I inherited from my dad and is really getting too thin.
I have a Omega boar but gave it to my wife because it stings too much with face lathering.

I actually think it has much more to do with the “triple-milled” trick. You seem to do quite well, but maybe not for long enough. This one sure ain’t your soft P160, huh!?!!

Héhé, but I have no problem with my Tabac puck (nor the stick), nor my grated Palmolive stick.

I let some hot water sit on top of the soap for at least 10 minutes while I shower and then tilt it upside down but not completely dry. I hit it with a rather dry-ish brush, that is well shaken and pressed a little.
Go for a few swirls till I get a proto lather on top of the cake (YES, it looks dry and creamy, with dwarven spikes) and the brush looks FULLY loaded.

I do all that. And did I swirl this morning. At least 25 times on the puck with pressure.

Then I finish with a face lather, for at least 2 minutes. Another trick here is to keep your face wet. I mean WET, drippin’ over the sink.
8<

Again, I do this as well.

8<
The next steps I would try and change in your technique would be:

-Let sit water on top of soap for a bit longer
-Hit with a drier brush
-Fully, FULLY load the brush, yes MORE soap (this is often a lather KSF)
-Face lather on a drippin’face.

I won't give up on this soap, so I'll try again with other ratio's, but my procedure is almost exact the same as yours.

Now I wish you good luck and enjoy that warm woodsy juniper scent.

C_J

Well, if it wasn't for the heavenly scent then I would have tortured the puck already out of frustration before discarding it.
Maybe people are too forgiving to this soap because it smells so good?

 

[Stubblefield]

I don't find the Cade to be particularly fragrant, but it is excellent.

Damp brush, a few more swirls than most other soaps (20 or so), dampening the puck and brush first. I start my brush a little on the dry side, as I lather in a bowl. I'll work the soap for about 20 seconds (it will seem fairly stiff at first) then slowly add a few drops of water. After about 30 seconds I'll start to get the lather I want, adding a few more drops of water as necessary. after 40 seconds, I'm done. I follow this method with all my soaps (except Pens, which only requires 5 swirls).

I never try and get the water balance on my brush right before lathering, preferring to start on the dry side and adding water as I go. I find this works much better for bowl lathering.

 

[Cookie_Junkie]

Maybe people are too forgiving to this soap because it smells so good?

Honestly, if I ever was to be blamed for forgiving something to this soap, that would be the slight drying effect.
And yet, I just keep using it, not forgetting to match it with something up there in the moisturizing department.
YES, the scent/feeling (call it whatever you want) IS worth it!!!
And I love the lush tallow-involved cushionning as well.

 

[xgunterx]

View attachment 49943

Above: I started with a really shaken out brush and loaded the brush 3 times (!) by swirling 20 times. Now if somebody dares to say I have to use more soap ...
I can whip up a lather, but it is different from my other soaps where I can get a good lather in notime.
It's like whipping up some eggwhite. It's airy and nothing compared to a full fat cream to put on strawberries.

View attachment 49944

Above: This is only after 1-2 mins. The lather is already vanishing.

View attachment 49945

This is the lather I get from Tabac after only swirling for 10 times on the puck. It is creamy and thick.

View attachment 49946

The same for my P.160. It is a thick creamy lather with no trouble at all in a min of time.

View attachment 49948

And this is the lather from my hidden treasure which I didn't talk about the last days.

I will try again with the boar brush, but my expectations are below sea level.

 

[RayH]

Gunter, try this. get rid of the aluminum bowl. I couldn't lather for squat using it. I put mine in a plastic sealable bowl (GLAD) and using a cheap boar brush (VDH) was able to get a great lather with it. I was making the lather on the soap itself instead of in a separate bowl. Here's a a video from Shave My Face on lathering with a boar. You might find it helpful.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIsj58fqVjY&feature=channel_page

I find that it works very well.

 

[xgunterx]

8<
Here's a a video from Shave My Face on lathering with a boar. You might find it helpful.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIsj58fqVjY&feature=channel_page

Thank you, but it isn't. I don't like his method (I find it kind of spoiling) and I don't like his lather at all.
No offence (and please don't), but I really think his lather sucks big time.
But I really appreciate your help.

I tried again with a boar brush, swirled it 20 times on the puck and I could definately see the damage on the puck (scratches) and tried to lather up in my moist left hand. It gave me still that airy whipped up eggwhite-alike lather.
I did it again with Tabac and within 20 seconds I got a very dense lather. The same with my Meat and Potatoes bath (!) soap of Woody's.
Maybe the soap just isn't my piece of cake.

When my wife gets home, I'll try to get her to work as a camera(wo)man.

 

[jhclare]

This is a long shot - but maybe you got a dud puck? Maybe it was part of a bad batch.

I don't know how common this is, or even if it happens at all, but you never know!

 

[RayH]

No offence (and please don't)

None taken. But I found my biggest problem with Cade was the bowl itself. After replacing it with a plastic one, I've found I can get a great lather using my Omega pure badger also. Perhaps you should try face lathering with it to see what happens.

 

[scooby074]

Hmm, Im still a noob, but i cant find a problem in your technique. I use L'Occataine soap myself and have no problems with lather. Im using a Omega Hog brush and i usually face lather.

Maybe your using too much water? In the pictures the lather looks a little "thin". I soak my brush in HOT water while I shower, then give it a thorough squeezing before i load the brush. I have a semi-wet face when i begin to lather. Sometimes I may have to add a DAB of water , but thats it.

Try the upside down brush loading technique. As strange as it sounds it made a big difference in the quality of my lather. I can get the same or better lather out of L occataine as i do out of Prorasso Green. I use the same general technique for both.

Good Luck.

 

[porman]

I have the same problem with getting good lather from my TOBS Herbal Sandalwood soap.

No problem with L'Occitane though. I manage to get rich and creamy lather from it, no problem what so ever.

 

[Ignatius]

Here's what I do:

Shake out brush, swirl on puck for 20 seconds. Swirl on face for at least 30 seconds.

Thats it.

Always creates slick, cushioning lather.

I'm convinced bowls are the source of this foamy lather problem.

 

[The Nid Hog]

Here's what I do:

Shake out brush, swirl on puck for 20 seconds. Swirl on face for at least 30 seconds.

Thats it.

Always creates slick, cushioning lather.

I'm convinced bowls are the source of this foamy lather problem.

I couldn't agree with you more. I get a rich, think lather with Cade and I produce it the same way that you do. Why would I want to lather in a bowl when I can do it right on my mug?

 

[BatNastard]

You're getting too much water. I've used this stuff since Xmas and it prefers a drier brush. I find that if I use water on top of the puck I get a denser lather but not necessarily so much better. Here's what I do:

Soak brush for 5 minutes in hot sink. Squeeze, shake good 4 or 5 times. (At this point if I've left water on the puck, I pour it off). Press down hard and swirl for 30 seconds - 1 minute. Brush should get pretty clumpy with soap. Swirl this soap on face. Dip brush in hot sink once, swirl 30 seconds or more and make sure it's fully mixed. Repeat. Killer lather each time.

 

[andrew98]

...And this is the lather from my hidden treasure which I didn't talk about the last days...

And what is that, exactly?

-Andy

 

[xgunterx]

And what is that, exactly?

-Andy

Woody's Meat and Potatoes bar.

It's a bath soap and can be used as a shampoo and shaving soap as well.
I use it in the shower in rotation along with my 9 Porto Claus soaps (my wife owns the other 10) and has excellent moisterizing capabilities.
I use it sometimes as a shampoo as well if I forget to bring the shampoo of Woody's in the shower.
I milled half of the huge bar (13oz) and it is in rotation with my other shaving soaps.
Here is the review.

 

[cymric]

Dude, below are two pictures from my experiment. I took a completely dry Cade puck which was used yesterday. The brush is an Omega boar 'pura setola', as you can see. It's still fairly new. I let the brush soak in water of about 55 to 60 degrees C, hardness 8.4 dGH, for half a minute, then shook it fairly dry, until the bristles would still cling together, but remain straight up or down. Water wasn't flowing out of it any more, in any case. Pressed it gently on the cake of soap until it was covering about 2/3rd of its surface. Swirled gently, occasionally pressing the suds back down on the puck. Continued for about 45 to 50 seconds until I got a thick creamy mass on the puck without any bubbles visible---say the kind of thick stuff you get with Tabac, yet a little thinner. Transferred the brush to my bowl where perhaps two or three drops of water remained, ran my finger on the inside of the soap container to grab all remaining dissolved soap, and began building, adding no water for the time being. After about one, one-and-a-half minute, I grabbed a camera, and took the shots shown below. So you see I have a hard time understanding why you run into such trouble with Cade. Perhaps you should focus less on soap swirl count, and more on the appearance of the dissolved soap...? In 45 to 50 seconds I make about 80 swirls, which is nearly three times as much as you do. (I don't believe in the 3 second-spin, unless it's a cream.)