A&E Kaizen, allergic reaction?

[vorpal]

Greetings,

not sure how to start with this, but here goes. I had a Kaizen box for more than a year and recently I decided to start shaving with it again and oh boy, the spots that are usually prone to acne had a huge outburst, I tried for a month, shaving with it on and off...and I have concluded that it's the one causing it. I don't know why, I don't even put water in the damn thing, I always take a small amount with my finger and work on it in another bowl then store it away from humidity/heat. Is it the soap, the fragrance? (To be fair this has to be the soap with the strongest scent that I have in my collection, tremonia dark limes is second but I never had problems with it)

Last but not least, a question: does zingari man watchman have the same base? I really wanted to try it but now I'm a bit scared. How trustworthy is it as a company?

 

[APBinNCA]

As always with A&E, there is a bit of irritation lottery. Is it The Kaizen soap or another Kaizen base soap? I could suggest other possibilities and solutions, but I am going to go with what others have said: why waste your time with something that doesn't work for you? You could try Low Scent Skeletor in K2.

As for Zingari Man, you shouldn't have any trouble. Heather seems to, mostly, only make soaps that don't cause irritation. Supposedly, The Merchant has caused some trouble. I don't see how, I have it. There are a couple of recent threads on here if you search, A&E vs Zingari Man. I am not sure what "same base" you are referring to, but The Watchman is Sego base. It is really nice. You can get a sample from Maggards.

 

[vorpal]

Kaizen soap, the one with the naked Asian woman riding a... seahorse? Anyway, that.

The thing is, I never EVER had any specific issues with soaps, but the moment the kaizen comes in contact with my skin -- I get all red. (Neck & chin especially)

For some reason I was under the (false) impression that the Zingari was using the same (or similar) formula for the soap base. Anyway, good to know about the Watchman, I'll be grabbing one soon, hopefully it's as good as people say, slick and protective.

 

[Barbarian80]

The entire Zingari business model is geared towards the inclusivity of all skin types- their product ingredients strongly consider the health of your skin and her soaps are not strong scented for this very reason. So if you have overly sensitive skin Zingari soap is worth a try. I can certainly vouch for it- it's very high quality soap and IMO a step above the Kaizen base.

It is very well documented that A&E soaps can be very risky to some users skin types that don't react well to it. There are threads all over B&B and elsewhere about adverse skin reactions to certain A&E products. It's your money your skin and your decision.

 

[APBinNCA]

The thing is, I never EVER had any specific issues with soaps, but the moment the kaizen comes in contact with my skin -- I get all red. (Neck & chin especially)

I have had this exact reaction to one of the A&E soaps, but on my cheeks right up to my eyes. I have a lot of his scents, but I just accepted that I am going to end up buying one that doesn't work occasionally. When I get one that works, I really like the K2 and K2e base.

 

[thp001]

We can all be cynical about mass manufactured shaving soaps, or cosmetics in general, but an unbelieveable amount of money is thrown into researching the chemistry and ingredients used in these modern products. A lot of the "synthetic" ingredients people turn their noses up at were developed because many natural products are much more likely to cause irritation, including natural essential oils, waxes and fats which are front and center in many artisan soaps. Hell, just plain soap itself can irritate due to its slightly alkaline nature which is the whole reason things like SLS were created. Kaizen also contains Lanolin which is a known irritant for many. Fun anecdote, I remember talking to an Aussie sheep shearer years ago who made the mistake of shearing one day during a hot summer while wearing shorts, legs were lumpy as cauliflower and red raw afterwards from the Lanolin in the wool. A lot of artisan soaps also use superfat, those unsaponified fats could potentially degrade over time and interact poorly with ones skin chemistry, especially if one has a huge stash of soap where tubs are sitting for long times with no use.

Ingredients list: Ariana and Evans Kaizen Artisan Shaving Soap, 4oz - Kaizen Base - https://maggardrazors.com/products/ariana-and-evans-kaizen-artisan-shaving-soap-4oz-kaizen-base

 

[vorpal]

We can all be cynical about mass manufactured shaving soaps, or cosmetics in general, but an unbelieveable amount of money is thrown into researching the chemistry and ingredients used in these modern products.

Agreed. I have all kinds of soaps, but I have to admit -- I never found another that had protected my skin quite like the Kaizen, it's the sole reason I'm REALLY looking into artisan soaps for the first time, and since people say that the Zingari is even better minus the irritation... I'll give it a try.

Also, not to offend anyone, but my intellect can't stop me from seeing many of these Artisans as snake oil peddlers at this point. Just me? Anyway.

 

[catchacoolbreeze]

Agreed. I have all kinds of soaps, but I have to admit -- I never found another that had protected my skin quite like the Kaizen, it's the sole reason I'm REALLY looking into artisan soaps for the first time, and since people say that the Zingari is even better minus the irritation... I'll give it a try.

Also, not to offend anyone, but my intellect can't stop me from seeing many of these Artisans as snake oil peddlers at this point. Just me? Anyway.

Not offended but I think it is an interesting statement. I don't know how to view it because snake oil makes me think of something that claims to be one thing but it is not. I don't really see any of these companies really advertising or making claims at all. None of these soaps claims to be the slickest or most moisturizing. Its really just - here is another soap. All of the hype comes from the the forums or youtube influencers (which I imagine is some form of advertising - not sure if they tell them what to say). I don't know all of the artisans out there but I have really only see the owners of Blackland and Colonial Razors on the forums (yes I am sure there are more that actively participate out of my normal sphere of the search button).

 

[APBinNCA]

Also, not to offend anyone, but my intellect can't stop me from seeing many of these Artisans as snake oil peddlers at this point. Just me? Anyway.

Not to stir the corpse of Milton Friedman, but this is true "free market capitalism." You sell a product unencumbered by any restraint or restriction, innovate or die. Or keep rebadging your product in different clothes. I will be the first in line to complain about EU restrictions on cosmetic ingredients, but without some oversight the customer is the product safety tester. Maybe that's acceptable, you try something something and if it doesn't work you try something else. Maybe there is a line where that isn't acceptable?

 

[thp001]

Not to stir the corpse of Milton Friedman, but this is true "free market capitalism." You sell a product unencumbered by any restraint or restriction, innovate or die. Or keep rebadging your product in different clothes. I will be the first in line to complain about EU restrictions on cosmetic ingredients, but without some oversight the customer is the product safety tester. Maybe that's acceptable, you try something something and if it doesn't work you try something else. Maybe there is a line where that isn't acceptable?

Free market for these things works fine if one does due diligence in researching and testing ones products thoroughly to make sure they're as safe as possible. This kind of thing just simply isn't possible by artisan soap makers, at least not to any clinical standard. What makes it worse is that the constant one-upmanship in formulas in this space makes for some incredibly tedious ingredients lists, which makes for much more end user risk of bad reactions.

 

[vorpal]

Free market for these things works fine if one does due diligence in researching and testing ones products thoroughly to make sure they're as safe as possible. This kind of thing just simply isn't possible by artisan soap makers, at least not to any clinical standard. What makes it worse is that the constant one-upmanship in formulas in this space makes for some incredibly tedious ingredients lists, which makes for much more end user risk of bad reactions.

Indeed. I take a look at the bloated ingredient lists for most of these Artisan products and I get quite intimidated. In any case, I choose to trust Zingari, I've heared their stuff is at least somewhat tested? (A Greek reviewer mentioned it..maybe it's inaccurate) Again, in what scale? Anyway, I'll be receiving the splash and the Watchman tomorrow, we'll see.

 

[RayClem]

A&E Kaizen now comes in three versions: Kaizen, Kaizen 2, and Kaizen 2e with emu oil. Peter is constantly experimenting with new formulations and new scents. His newest formulation is VR1 which is a vegan formula unrelated to Kaizen.

The original Kaizen soap/scent contains Stearic Acid, Beef Tallow, Aqua, Goats Milk, Potassium Hydroxide, Kokum Butter, Shea Butter, Castor Oil, Cocoa Butter, Sodium Hydroxide, Glycerin, Manteca, Aloe Juice, Avocado Oil, Hemp Seed Oil, Apricot Kernal Seed Oil, Lanolin, Agave, Slippery Elm, Sodium Lactate, Xanthan Gum, Silk Amino Acid, Tussah Silk, Marshmallow Root. While you might be allergic or sensitive to something in the formulation, it is often the scents that cause issues. In this case Kaizen contains: Mandarin, Calabrian Bergamot, Lemon Peel, Neroli, Honeysuckle, Green Apple, Rose, Tobacco Absolute, Haitian Vetiver, Sandalwood, Cedarwood. You might be sensitive to one or more of the scent notes.