They are excellent blades. I especially like them, prefer them, in my iKon slant. For me,they are both sharp and smooth.
BIC Chrome Platinum
- Thread starter KRpdx
- Start date
I tried these in roughly Fall/Winter of last year (2017) & remember having mixed results. In reviewing some of my notes from my journal entries, I got 8 CCS shaves out of each blade with my DE89, Maggard Slant, & Merkur 37C Slant. They weren't the closest of shaves, but were "reasonable" (IMHO).
In contrast...
When used in my Maggard V3, V3A, & V3OC, I got DFS results on shaves 1-4 with them, but had a marked increase in irritation on shaves 5-8.
I was also using the Stirling Executive Man soap & Nivea Sensitive post-shave balm (I think.)
At least, that's what I recall. If you'd like to check out the details of the entries I made in my journal when the experiences were fresh in my memory, they are on page 6-7 of my journal here: BassPlayerBoz's Shave Journal
In contrast...
When used in my Maggard V3, V3A, & V3OC, I got DFS results on shaves 1-4 with them, but had a marked increase in irritation on shaves 5-8.
I was also using the Stirling Executive Man soap & Nivea Sensitive post-shave balm (I think.)
At least, that's what I recall. If you'd like to check out the details of the entries I made in my journal when the experiences were fresh in my memory, they are on page 6-7 of my journal here: BassPlayerBoz's Shave Journal
- Thread starter
- #23
That's thorough documentation! Thanks for adding to the conversation...
No problem. But - like any other opinion on shaving gear - take it w/ a grain of salt. That was just my experience. Some folks swear by these blades. As they say.... YMMV....
Ron R
I survived a lathey foreman
I tried one in my Razorock SLOC which is a easy razor for any blade, they come out sharp on first shave and after that it was not that great for me it seemed. I will try a different tuck and see if they are any better later on in a different razor, lots of great blades that are just as good or better IMO.
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Been DE shaving for about 4 months, and just had my first really great shave with a Bic Chrome Platinum (first time shaving with a BCP). I have been fighting razor burn, only on my chin, since starting DE shaving. Setup today was BCP blade, and RazoRock Game Changer -- ZERO irritation, and an efficient, smooth shave. Funny thing is I didn't use my Proraso White preshave for the first time - I just wet my face with bloom water (Sapofonicio Varesino Felce Aromatico), lathered up, and had at it. Myrsol Blue aftershave. Happy to remove the Proraso preshave step from the equation going forward - makes the shave quicker and easier. REALLY love the blade feel of the Bic...
After the sixth shave with the Bic Chrome Platinum I put it to rest (AKA the blade bank) even if I knew it had plenty of life left.
Not the sharpest nor the smoothest, overall a very good blade. It gave its best in a mild razor like the Maggard V3.
I will surely buy Bics again.
Not the sharpest nor the smoothest, overall a very good blade. It gave its best in a mild razor like the Maggard V3.
I will surely buy Bics again.
I work in product development and any sort of quantative testing is going to be better than qualitative testing involving a human face and something that is quantitative like sharpness. It’s not like he only tested two blades. He tested dozens. What is the chance that out of dozens of blades Astras come near the bottom and somehow they are really towards the top? There are enough sample points to show the ability of his methods to show relative performance. I would say that you can’t definitely say that two blades that are next to each other couldn’t be inversed in standing. But no way Astra is jumping 15 places due to sub-optimal media tension. I definitely don’t trust all the qualitative reports of Astra SPs being sharp when on a qualitative test, even if flawed, they are on the dull end for new out of the box, after 1 shave, and after 2 shaves. I honestly think people are drunk in love with $9.95 per 100 price and it’s PPI St Petersburg pedigree.
I trust Chase's method more than I trust a poll of self styled experienced users. My personal experience is that user reviews are pretty useless, Most don't chase BBS, most don't shave their head, which is strike two from the get go. I find Chase's findings a lot more valuable. Yes I do think Bic's are sharper.
It depends on methodology. I can come up with quantitative testing that yields garbage, nothing useful for the issue here. Qualitative data from experienced users can be better. It depends. There are odd results in that test data that I didn't see with our survey data, and I'm confident that if (or when) I continue with blade surveys, there wouldn't be odd results as long as the number of experienced users offering opinions on each blade were large enough. It is true that price affects opinion, but I think that the influence was negligible with our experienced users who offered ratings.
If BICs are sharper than Feathers, then I'm sure that survey data from experienced users would reflect that, as well.
We disagree about the reliability of user reviews.
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I don't know what you mean by "user reviews", but our survey data is better than just any user review on the Internet. The surveys that I ran, as few as they were, were done with a clear, transparent methodology and collected ratings from experience B&B members with their names stuck with their ratings. The B&B members had to provide numbers on how many blades they've tried, etc., to help justify their experience. That survey data applies directly to the issues of sharpness, smoothness, longevity, and consistency of razor blades used to cut hair. The quantitative sharpness data from that one source was collected with a questionable methodology. Even if the tension in the test media is consistent, that doesn't mean that the results truly represent sharpness, at least how we perceive it in real-world conditions when cutting hair on skin.
I agree, one CAN make a testing protocol that is garbage. However, a face on a human that knows what blade is being tested and has all the bias issues inherent in all humans for the sake of measuring something that is quantative IS garbage. In the industry I’m in, subjective testing is done by validated professionals and done blind. They don’t know what they are testing. And all subjective tests are done against a witness. The tests are typically witness, product 1, product 2, product 3, witness re-run. People shaving aren’t doing this.
Transparency doesn't mean reliability, or relevance to me. I shave to BBS, and I shave my head daily. Most don't do either. I don't have sensitive skin. I've read enough blade and razor reviews from folks who don't share my needs and experience to conclude that their opinions are generally of little value to me. .
Chase's findings I have found to be both relevant and reliable.
I'll leave it at that.
Chase's findings I have found to be both relevant and reliable.
I'll leave it at that.
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To be clear, I don’t think a quantative test will decide that blade A is better than blade B. Nor do I think that there is a best blade. But sharpness is not subjective. It can be measured. Sure, the method is unlikely to give an absolute result, but outside of downright incompetence, when plenty of blades were closely ranked, there is no way that a blade with a “49” is quantatively sharper than a blade with a “39” like a Nacet. It may very well feel better, it might even, considering many factors, even shave closer.
Ouch!
It doesn't look like the surveys that I conducted with B&B members were garbage. The results seem reasonable. You and others can focus on sharpness, but if you want ratings for smoothness, longevity, and consistency, then surveys are the best that you're going to get.You're right that blind testing is best. If anyone would like to attempt such a feat, then I would wish him good luck and look forward to reading about his methodology and results.
He's got some odd results that might stem from a flawed methodology. Here are just two examples:
1. A Derby Extra is almost as sharp as a Feather after both have been used once
2. After one use, a BIC becomes just about as sharp as a new Feather
What is being measured in that testing is "the maximum force required to cut the test media." Putting aside the issue of whether tension is being consistently applied to the test media before cutting and how much tension is being applied, the author states, "The logic is that the lower the force required, the sharper the blade." That's the thinking, and it's not bad, but it might not be totally true. Who's to say that those forces involved with cutting the test media in a perpendicular manner directly relate to the forces involved with cutting hair from skin at different angles? There may be screwy things going on here. It's very possible that cutting edge roughness, not sharpness, can cause premature fracture in the test media, leading to lower measured forces and the appearance of more sharpness. It's also possible that there are nonlinear effects going on here with respect to the magnitude of forces in cutting the test media versus the magnitude of forces in cutting hair. Who knows? I don't, but I know that some of those quantitative results are odd, as I mentioned above.
I apologize for the language. I don’t think your survey is garbage. I think that humans, myself included, stink at determining subjectively an objective trait. I think things like “smoothness”, “forgiveness”, “how many shaves you get” are better for a person to answer and I enjoy reading opinions about that. Having a bunch of blades all measured one way versus recollection of people who all shaves differently to tell me an objective attribute is a better way in my opinion. Shy of suspecting foul play, if you ask me what blades are relatively sharp, I’ll take the measurement data.
Now I think it was you that brought up the question of test revelance. This is an absolute important concept. What is being measured here is truly simple, however. You can have an irrelevant test for sure, but you can also have an irrelevant attribute. With this in mind, it is possible that completely objective sharpness might be irrelevant to perception of sharpness in terms of how sharp it “feels.” Perhaps the length of bevel, number of bevel surfaces, etc plays a role and isn’t measureable. The interesting point to remember we are guaging the sharpness feel with our skin, which we are purposely trying not to cut.
Now I think it was you that brought up the question of test revelance. This is an absolute important concept. What is being measured here is truly simple, however. You can have an irrelevant test for sure, but you can also have an irrelevant attribute. With this in mind, it is possible that completely objective sharpness might be irrelevant to perception of sharpness in terms of how sharp it “feels.” Perhaps the length of bevel, number of bevel surfaces, etc plays a role and isn’t measureable. The interesting point to remember we are guaging the sharpness feel with our skin, which we are purposely trying not to cut.
My alternate theory is that BICs are indeed sharper and that survey results may reflect anti- Derby bias and/or confusion over which production date was being used. It's the flip side of the PolSilver cult phenomenon. I generally agree with mbb703 above.
Ouch!
You're right that blind testing is best. If anyone would like to attempt such a feat, then I would wish him good luck and look forward to reading about his methodology and results.
He's got some odd results that might stem from a flawed methodology. Here are just two examples:
1. A Derby Extra is almost as sharp as a Feather after both have been used once
2. After one use, a BIC becomes just about as sharp as a new Feather
.
In my case, I struggle with how to deal with judging “sharpness” in rating my shaves. I’ve completed a period of blade evaluations to try to find another blade worthy of a 100 purchase. Monday I’m starting a lathering product testing period. In doing so I decided to log each shave experience. I’ve logged ~90 shaves. I’ve tested about 20 blades in that time.
I ended up not recording a sharpness judgment in my logs. It ends up impacting what I do end up judging. I judge efficiency; how much touch-up needed to get to closeness I want. I also record forgiveness depending on whether I have any visible blood after cold rinse, or bleeding alum takes care of, or if I have to pull out the styptic stick. I judge smoothness based on tugging feel on ATG pass. I judge how long into the day I stay DFS or better for closeness. Then I also judge post-Shave look/feel based on redness or burn. All those are impacted by sharpness, but I make no attempt to just isolate sharpness as an attribute judged by my face. Sure, I’ll give you my opinion of sharpness for Derby vs Feather, but I’ll hesitate to tell you Voskhod vs Rapira Platinum Lux.
I ended up not recording a sharpness judgment in my logs. It ends up impacting what I do end up judging. I judge efficiency; how much touch-up needed to get to closeness I want. I also record forgiveness depending on whether I have any visible blood after cold rinse, or bleeding alum takes care of, or if I have to pull out the styptic stick. I judge smoothness based on tugging feel on ATG pass. I judge how long into the day I stay DFS or better for closeness. Then I also judge post-Shave look/feel based on redness or burn. All those are impacted by sharpness, but I make no attempt to just isolate sharpness as an attribute judged by my face. Sure, I’ll give you my opinion of sharpness for Derby vs Feather, but I’ll hesitate to tell you Voskhod vs Rapira Platinum Lux.
