Straight razor plunge-- Carbon steel vs. Stainless

[duderdo]

Hello!

I've been DE shaving for about 4 or 5 months now, and I feel like I'm a bit of a veteran already-- I get a damn fine shave every day, but I'm looking for something a little bit "more". I'm happy with my shaving routine as it is, but getting a straight seems like the necessary extension to my daily ritual.

That said, I'm a chef by trade, and carbon steel knives are the only blades I use. They stain easily, but steps necessary to produce a product-- a clean towel, a tidy workstation, a clear plan of "what's next?"-- the steps that prevent a knife from staining in the first place, can all be easily transferred to the daily shave, it seems to me.

Anyways, am I being too biased? If I do start shopping for a straight, should I consider stainless? When shopping for a straight, what are the nicknames, if any, for carbon steel blades?

Thank you!

 

[Seraphim]

Carbon steel is good.

So is stainless.


Those DE blades that you have been getting such great shaves from are stainless.

 

[Defend Tacoma]

In the interactive guide to Straight Razor shaving FAQ at the top of this forum is this discussion on the topic. Unfortunately that's about all I know! Good luck!

 

[eto]

I have a carbon straight. And I also use carbon steel knives to cook with.
Unlike the carbon knives, with straights you only will be using water and a shave cream with them. So they wont stain like a knife. As long as you dry them after using and a light stropping you should be fine.
Also don't try and zest any lemon's with the straight and you will be fine.

 

[Seraphim]

Certain carbon straights will indeed stain quicker than you would expect

 

[Slash McCoy]

Personally, I have a slight preference for carbon steel, but I am thinking about getting a nice stainless for travel. When you are on the go and living out of hand luggage, care and maintenance of personal gear can become an issue, and stainless is more forgiving in that regard.

 

[professorchaos]

They'll both shave well. Stainless, being more ductile, can be a little trickier to hone.

As you likely know, if you dry a carbon steel well, you don't have to worry about staining. I'd go so far as to say that my vintage Sabatier chef's knife stains more easily than any straight I have.

 

[mparker762]

One other data point is that the commercial razor manufacturers long ago went to stainless steel, first for DE blades then for cartridge blades, and I don't think they were worried about staining. Stainless holds its edge better when used in a wet, corrosive environment.

 

[duderdo]

Thanks for the replies everyone.

One other data point is that the commercial razor manufacturers long ago went to stainless steel, first for DE blades then for cartridge blades, and I don't think they were worried about staining. Stainless holds its edge better when used in a wet, corrosive environment.

True. But unlike in a kitchen, where I've seen red seal chefs using incredibly dull knives of any make, it sounds like this kind of nonchalance won't cut it when it comes to your face, making it necessary to hone and strop regularly.

 

[professorchaos]

Thanks for the replies everyone.



True. But unlike in a kitchen, where I've seen red seal chefs using incredibly dull knives of any make, it sounds like this kind of nonchalance won't cut it when it comes to your face, making it necessary to hone and strop regularly.

You won't necessarily need to hone regularly, you will need to strop before every shave.

 

[mparker762]

True. But unlike in a kitchen, where I've seen red seal chefs using incredibly dull knives of any make, it sounds like this kind of nonchalance won't cut it when it comes to your face, making it necessary to hone and strop regularly.

Also, a perfectly honed and maintained sushi knife would be considered incredibly dull by razor standards. That kind of nonchalance also won't cut it when it come to your face. Not being snarky, just making sure you realize that razors and shaving are on another plane of seriousness. Back to your original question, both stainless and carbon steel razors work fine, but carbon steel razors take a bit more work. They're a bit easier to hone, but more work to keep sharp over the long haul. Cosmetic considerations are distinctly secondary - if you're maintaining your carbon steel razors well enough that they can hold their sharpness more than a few shaves then they're very unlikely to stain.

 

[WilliamIam]

No, NO NO STAINLESS

*ahem*. ok.
Carbon steel is going to be the only that can be properly honed. Stainless is hard (physical property) and won't give you a reliably good edge.

I like looks of a lot of the new razors on ebay, but if they have a stainless blade, I pass on them.


Why do you have the knives you have? Edge quality? Well... Let your knives speak for you.

Stainless is nifty, but not worth it. I've had my straight 6 months and have never had a serious problem with rust. I have one tiny spot of patina on the spine because I somehow dripped water in the drawer where I store it. But no harm done.

 

[mparker762]

No, NO NO STAINLESS

*ahem*. ok.
Carbon steel is going to be the only that can be properly honed. Stainless is hard (physical property) and won't give you a reliably good edge.

I like looks of a lot of the new razors on ebay, but if they have a stainless blade, I pass on them.


Why do you have the knives you have? Edge quality? Well... Let your knives speak for you.

Stainless is nifty, but not worth it. I've had my straight 6 months and have never had a serious problem with rust. I have one tiny spot of patina on the spine because I somehow dripped water in the drawer where I store it. But no harm done.

You might want to recheck your assumptions. Firstly, stainless steel razors, generally speaking, tend to be softer than their carbon steel counterparts. Secondly, among carbon steel razors harder is generally preferred over softer. Among stainless steel razors this preference towards hardness isn't so pronounced, some of the most highly regarded stainless steel razors are of only moderate hardness (about 57hrc).

You're generally right about skipping stainless razors on ebay, because nearly all of them are from manufacturers that are on the "avoid" list, *not* because stainless is unsuitable for razors. There are some really excellent stainless razors out there, the vintage Henckels Friodurs, as well as modern stainless steel razors made by Dovo, Livi, Robert Williams and Bill Ellis.

I mentioned it in an earlier post above and will reiterate it - the benefit of stainless steel for razors has nothing to do with cosmetic issues. The commercial razor makers (gillette, schick, wilkinson, feather, etc) all switched to stainless steel many decades ago, and they weren't concerned at all with how pretty their disposable blades looked as the owner threw their used blades in the trash. They switched because stainless steel was markedly superior for shaving - when wilkinson sword introduced the stainless steel razor blade they very quickly captured a huge chunk of the market from gillette, because their blades performed much better. The benefit of stainless is to slow down the effect of corrosion on the cutting edge of the blade. Stropping can help clean the edge and can help minimise the corrosive damage, but it cannot eliminate it. Stainless gives your razor another level of protection to help the blade perform at its best over long periods of time. Our blades are not disposable, we can strop them and hone them and keep them running well despite the corrosion, so the advantages of stainless are not as significant for straight razors. So if you prefer carbon steel razors then that's fine, you have the tools at your disposal to make them work. But it is foolish to deny that stainless does not have some real advantages in the wet, salty, alkaline environment that razors are required to perform in.

Personally I don't talk to my knives, but since they know a lot about being knives and very little about being razors I'd be inclined to doublecheck anything they tell me with some actual razors. Because while all razors are knives, not all knives are razors.

 

[Seraphim]

No, NO NO STAINLESS

*ahem*. ok.
Carbon steel is going to be the only that can be properly honed. Stainless is hard (physical property) and won't give you a reliably good edge.

I like looks of a lot of the new razors on ebay, but if they have a stainless blade, I pass on them.


Why do you have the knives you have? Edge quality? Well... Let your knives speak for you.

Stainless is nifty, but not worth it. I've had my straight 6 months and have never had a serious problem with rust. I have one tiny spot of patina on the spine because I somehow dripped water in the drawer where I store it. But no harm done.

Cheap stainless may be a no-go. But to say stainless=cheap is erroneous. Henckels Friodurs are extremely well regarded. As are Dovo stainless razors.

There are also numerous examples of complete garbage carbon razors. You cannot paint with such broad strokes.

 

[dmcconnell]

Cheap stainless may be a no-go. But to say stainless=cheap is erroneous. Henckels Friodurs are extremely well regarded. As are Dovo stainless razors.

+1: I have owned both Dovo Inox and Henckels Friodur stainless razors. They are both excellent performing shavers and while somewhat more difficult to hone than typical carbon steel, the edge is very durable. There is nothing wrong with a quality stainless blade....IMHO.

 

[duderdo]

This is a good discussion, the kind I was looking for, distinctly like one you might hear between knife enthusiasts

I appreciate the feedback.

 

[Ru4scuba?]

+1: I have owned both Dovo Inox and Henckels Friodur stainless razors. They are both excellent performing shavers and while somewhat more difficult to hone than typical carbon steel, the edge is very durable. There is nothing wrong with a quality stainless blade....IMHO.

Ok...what about touching up stainless? Any difference? I have a Barbers hone and CroOx pasted strop and balsa paddle. Will that be sufficient (dont mean to hijack but I thought I'd ask here...)

 

[mparker762]

Will that be sufficient

yes. The main difference between HCS and stainless when honing (including touch-ups) is that stainless takes a little longer because it tends to be a bit more abrasion-resistant. FWIW the same is true for very hard HCS razors. Give your stainless razor a few more laps on the pasted paddle or barber hone than you would for a HCS razor; if you normally do 5 laps on the barber hone then do maybe 7 or 8 for a stainless razor.

 

[RetroGrouch]

yes. The main difference between HCS and stainless when honing (including touch-ups) is that stainless takes a little longer because it tends to be a bit more abrasion-resistant. FWIW the same is true for very hard HCS razors. Give your stainless razor a few more laps on the pasted paddle or barber hone than you would for a HCS razor; if you normally do 5 laps on the barber hone then do maybe 7 or 8 for a stainless razor.

+1 This has been my experience too.

 

[PhatMan]

Hi,

I have an 8/8 Henckels Friodur and two (2) 5/8 Dovo EnVogue stainless razors.

They shave every bit as well as my carbon steel razors, and I have not noticed that they are markedly different to hone nor in the maintainance of their edges

Have fun !

Best regards

Russ