Restoration question

[chamm]

There isn't (yet) a DE restoration forum, so I'll ask this question in a general forum and hope for an answer.

I got a $20 NEW LC on eBay. It was one of those gold tone ones that have a rose colored top plate. The online pics were gorgeous, but when I got it, it had a teeeeensy little spot on it. Nothing that affected the shave, but enough that I just had to fix it. (I'm sure nobody here can relate...) So I used some foaming bathroom cleaner on it. No dice. I tried denatured alcohol. Still nothing. Then I (foolishly) took some Goof-Off to it, and it all went to hell. If you're not familiar with Goof-Off, it takes off anything. I mean, really, it'll take the stripes off a tiger. Now it didn't take the spot off the razor, but I'm pretty sure what it did was take the lacquer finish off the brass, and brass, when exposed to oxygen, does all sorts of fun things. More spots appeared, and these spots wouldn't come off for anything. The more I washed it, the nastier looking it got.

Now, please keep in mind, I fancy myself a semi-professional trombone player, and a music educator. I took an instrument repair class in college, and you'd think I know my way around working with brass. I guess I just wasn't sure if the top cap was actually brass, so I went a little nuts on it. In my defense, this isn't an $8000 musical instrument, so I threw caution to the wind a little bit. Also, I figured it's a good learning experience, since at worst, I'm going to make a $20 razor shave like a $20 razor and look like a $15 razor.

So today, I finally got out my Dremel. (I never know when to quit.) With a buffing disc, (and no polishing compound) I was able to remove the spots completely, and now it has a clean, somewhat dull, shine. It still doesn't look nearly as nice as when I bought it, but not bad.

My question is this: If I leave it exactly the way it is, I'm fairly sure it's going to oxidize and turn ugly. If I continue to do nothing even longer, it may develop some of that green crud. Should I run out to Home Depot and pick up some fine rouge, put it on my Dremel, buff it to a mirror-like finish and spray it with a coat of lacquer? (That's what you'd do with a brass instrument.) I don't have a spray gun, so I'd have to just buy some aerosol stuff. Or should I just leave it as is? I'd really like it to look nice again, but from experience, I don't think the lacquer they used at the Gillette factory is much like the lacquer they use on a trombone. I couldn't imagine exposing a trombone to the things a razor is exposed to. For one, putting a musical instrument into hot water will cause all the lacquer to completely come off. Oil from your skin will eat through the lacquer over the years. Also, if a trombone goes without lacquer, I've never seen it develop that green crud that shows up on old razors. It pretty much functions identically, except it looks like it belongs to a hobo.

Do razors use a completely different alloy of brass than brass instruments? Is the top cap of my razor even made of brass? Are there different types or grades of lacquer that are heartier than the stuff used on instruments? If I spray it with a can or Rust-O-Leum, can I expect the finish to look nice for another 90 years, even though I'm running it through hot water, lather and a scratchy beard every day?

I know it's lots of questions, but I'd appreciate any advice anyone has to offer. Thanks in advance!

 

[mblakele]

The way you describe it, the original gold or nickel plating was long gone. I think most gents would either have it replated, or enjoy the raw brass patina for what it is.

I believe the top cap is red brass. As you probably know there are many different kinds of brass. If you try instrument lacquer, let us know how it works out.

 

[chamm]

Well, I know that instrument lacquer requires application by an HPLV sprayer, which can run hundreds to thousands of dollars, so I'm not going to be applying that. I've got a good friend in the instrument repair business who owes me a few favors, but I think I want to save those favors for the next time my wife runs over my trombone three hours before opening night of a gig. (True story!) As far as the original finish, I've see tons of these razors on eBay that have the gold-tone base plate with a rose brass top plate. (see example)



I can't imagine that ALL of them have lost their original plating, so I have to think that was the original design for the piece. Looks kinda nice, if you ask me. Mine USED to look like that. I suspect that the finish is the solid brass with a lacquer layer to keep it from oxidizing. So I'll head to Home Depot tonight, pick up an aerosol lacquer, spray it, and let you all know how it turns out. In the meantime, if anyone has any additional insight, I would really like to hear it.

 

[mblakele]

No, that is plate loss. That particular eBay seller removes all the remaining plating with something like brasso, then sells them. I kind of doubt he would apply any protection over the brass, but I might be wrong.

The original would have looked more like any of these: http://www.mr-razor.com/Rasierer/The NEW/The NEW.htm

 

[alex2363]

Well, I know that instrument lacquer requires application by an HPLV sprayer, which can run hundreds to thousands of dollars, so I'm not going to be applying that. I've got a good friend in the instrument repair business who owes me a few favors, but I think I want to save those favors for the next time my wife runs over my trombone three hours before opening night of a gig. (True story!) As far as the original finish, I've see tons of these razors on eBay that have the gold-tone base plate with a rose brass top plate. (see example)

View attachment 382321

I can't imagine that ALL of them have lost their original plating, so I have to think that was the original design for the piece. Looks kinda nice, if you ask me. Mine USED to look like that. I suspect that the finish is the solid brass with a lacquer layer to keep it from oxidizing. So I'll head to Home Depot tonight, pick up an aerosol lacquer, spray it, and let you all know how it turns out. In the meantime, if anyone has any additional insight, I would really like to hear it.

If you buy one of those brassed up razors, it will take constant cleaning and shining for it stay looking shiny. Every other day you may have to take out the polish and do some buffing. The brass needs a good layer of plating so it can look good and require less maintenance.

 

[bakerbarber]

Try some Flitz or Simichrome.

 

[mswofford]

I shave regularly with a deplated Gillette New. I doesn't tarnish that easily if you clean and dry it regularly. If it does, I use Simichrome as mentioned above. For those who want to protect it, Google: Testors #21839. It is designed for models and is thin lacquer in a 3 oz. spray can, about $5.00. I have not personally used it but it looks like the answer for us razor freaks. My razor did not come from that seller. The surfaces where the blade goes are untouched, in fact the guard plate still has the original plating and lacquer which is worn off on top of the teeth from shaving.

 

[Jeff_H]

Yep, that look was never a Gillette standard. The handle and baseplate still have the factory gold wash finish on it, the cap has been polished down to the red brass. I have one like that as well, and I too like the look. Mine did not come from that same seller, but the razor is the same none the less.

If you want to protect it long term, spend $40 and have it replated in Nickel, if you like that. Gold will run you in the $70-$80 range, Rhodium closer to $100. There is a guy who also replates in Rose Gold, which will look very similar to the all brass look of your top cap. I assume that cost around the same as regular gold.

If you don't care to spend that, a $5 can of high gloss lacquer will probably do ok. Not sure how it will wear against tough whiskers and hot water. No experience with that.

Good luck.

 

[chamm]

Well, I buffed it up with some rouge and a buffing wheel on a Dremel. Nice mirror-like finish again. I went ahead and sprayed it with two coats of Rust-O-Leum Clear Lacquer, and it's currently drying. I suppose time will tell how well it holds up, but it looks OK now. If it starts to tarnish again, I'll probably have it re-plated. I'd love to rhodium, but I think nickel is more likely within my budget, and it'll probably outlive me.

 

[gearchow]

yeah, I don't like the polished brass look. I had a long and short comb head with a bar handle (carefully selected the handle) replated in nickel and I love them. I had traded with Bob (cooncatbob) to get that done. He didn't do the replating, but he did all of the polishing prior to replate and he was an excellent craftsman.

A nickel plated NEW is a good tool.

-jim

PS. I very partial to nickel.

 

[mswofford]

If you don't care to spend that, a $5 can of high gloss lacquer will probably do ok. Not sure how it will wear against tough whiskers and hot water. No experience with that.

Good luck.

Jeff, you're right. I know from experience that a PROLONGED soak in hot water will dull the lacquer. Daily use of shaving and rinsing; not so much.

 

[chamm]

Early indicaton is that the lacquer may be a failure. It looks pretty nice, but the surface is... not sticky, exactly, but not glide-along-the-face smooth. I might've put it on a little thick, so I'll give it another day or two to cure.

I'm glad you guys pointed out the thing about this eBay seller. I don't think he's being dishonest or anything. I mean, the rose brass looks nice, but after very close inspection, it's apparent that the gold finish was rubbed off. There a few tiny corners where he missed it and the original finish shows through. I just thought that was the original Gillette look. I literally went on eBay and searched for Gillette NEW Long and the picture above was the first 3 or 4 entries.

 

[gearchow]

Early indicaton is that the lacquer may be a failure. It looks pretty nice, but the surface is... not sticky, exactly, but not glide-along-the-face smooth. I might've put it on a little thick, so I'll give it another day or two to cure.

I'm glad you guys pointed out the thing about this eBay seller. I don't think he's being dishonest or anything. I mean, the rose brass looks nice, but after very close inspection, it's apparent that the gold finish was rubbed off. There a few tiny corners where he missed it and the original finish shows through. I just thought that was the original Gillette look. I literally went on eBay and searched for Gillette NEW Long and the picture above was the first 3 or 4 entries.

put it in the oven at low low temp?


Just my opinion, but sellers do that because they acquired a NEW with worn plating for a few bucks and wanting to gain maximum profit, they polish off the rest of the plating and attempt to palm off product that Gillette would never have let out of the factory. Because Gillette knew that un-plated brass sucks for a shaving instrument. Works great as a bell though.

Just my grouchy old opinion and YMMV.

Look, nice NEW razors aren't scarce, you just got to keep your eyes open for them. So hunt one down with with nice gold plating still intact or send the one you got off for replating. If you were to think replate from the start, then you would have picked up a cheap one, but you already have this one, it's not satisfactory, so just replate it and you will soon forget the extra bit of change spent.

-jim

 

[Kerrplunk]

Well, I know that instrument lacquer requires application by an HPLV sprayer, which can run hundreds to thousands of dollars, so I'm not going to be applying that. I've got a good friend in the instrument repair business who owes me a few favors, but I think I want to save those favors for the next time my wife runs over my trombone three hours before opening night of a gig. (True story!) As far as the original finish, I've see tons of these razors on eBay that have the gold-tone base plate with a rose brass top plate. (see example)

View attachment 382321

I can't imagine that ALL of them have lost their original plating, so I have to think that was the original design for the piece. Looks kinda nice, if you ask me. Mine USED to look like that. I suspect that the finish is the solid brass with a lacquer layer to keep it from oxidizing. So I'll head to Home Depot tonight, pick up an aerosol lacquer, spray it, and let you all know how it turns out. In the meantime, if anyone has any additional insight, I would really like to hear it.

The guy who sells these razors does not ship you the one pictured! Bait & switch..

 

[chamm]

Honestly, though, I don't think I got hosed on this one. I see these exact ones going on eBay for <$50. I paid less than $20 shipped for mine, so I don't think it was a scam. I think just about any structurally intact, functional razor is going to fetch at least $20 on the 'bay. No bent or broken teeth, no flea bites.

I'm not sure about the oven thing. The idea occurred to me as well, as it would certainly harden the lacquer. The problem is, at least with musical instruments, if the brass gets too hot, the thermal expansion of the metal is what cracks the lacquer and causes it to come off. The actual lacquer can take quite a bit of heat, but it's brittle and can't change shape with the metal. Still, if the worst that can happen is that I end up with an un-plated razor, I think I'm still in the ball game. I might also put up a WTB in the marketplace for an already plated NEW LC head, see if anyone has one laying around. I honestly don't need or really even want the handle, but I love the head. And who knows, maybe this lacquer experiment will turn out OK in the end.

 

[chamm]

The guy who sells these razors does not ship you the one pictured! Bait & switch..

I don't believe I purchased mine from the same guy. I'm 100% sure that the one I purchased was the one I saw pictured in the auction, because I checked the pictures very carefully and saw matching scuffs and marks on the head.

Sounds like this particular eBay seller might not be so reputable, though.

 

[Kerrplunk]

I did buy a razor from this seller. I'm here to tell you it's not the same razor. Glad to read you got what you paid for..

 

[chamm]

I did buy a razor from this seller. I'm here to tell you it's not the same razor. Glad to read you got what you paid for..

That seller (at least the one where I got the picture above) has a 100% positive feedback rating. Did you leave feedback about the bait & switch?

 

[Kerrplunk]

I did. I also called eeeebay. They could careless. I could've sent it back, but I'm not willing to pay shipping for it, and return postage.

 

[alex2363]

That seller (at least the one where I got the picture above) has a 100% positive feedback rating. Did you leave feedback about the bait & switch?

Those feedbacks are instant upon receiving the razor. Just like you are in awe of the brassy razor, so are the inexperienced buyers that post the positive feedback instantly without testing the razor. They post a good feed back too soon. I bet that after a few days when the razor gets cruddy and needs constant cleaning, they would realize that the brass needs some kind of plating protection. I am sure the feedback may not be the same from experienced razor buyers.

Experienced razor buyers would not pay for those unplated razors because they know better. If he was selling them for $10 bucks that would be different since it would leave room for plating costs.

[ by the way your writing style is exquisite]