They're correct and you do not wear a vest without a jacket.
Question on wearing vests
- Thread starter Rusty Blade
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They're correct and you do not wear a vest without a jacket.
Good post, Doc4, and I agree, although I have no idea how a designer like Thom Browne thinks a vest should fit given how tight and "high water" his suits are! I would never have thought a fashion trend would develop that had a fit that looked like the wearer was wearing the suit he wore at this eighth grade graduation, but what do I know! Perhaps he has never designed a suit with a vest. he also seems to believe in buttoning the top button of a broadcloth shirt without a tie. I can tell I am over the hill!
Also, I do not know whether I would ever wear a vest without a jacket. They do have those bright red Christmas things. There are cowboy and other types of leather vests. I think I would keep my vest on, if I were taking my suit coat off. I do not quite believe in never removing my suit coat.
Also, I do not know whether I would ever wear a vest without a jacket. They do have those bright red Christmas things. There are cowboy and other types of leather vests. I think I would keep my vest on, if I were taking my suit coat off. I do not quite believe in never removing my suit coat.
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I have two Filson vests. They aren't worn with jackets, unless it's really really cold.
- Thread starter
- #24
Hmmmm...something isn't right here. If three piece suits are no longer in fashion and every men's store I visit has racks full of vests...then do you wear dress pants, a vest and jacket that all mismatch? Heaven forbid!! Vests are a casual attire for around the office. I see several people at work that casually wear a vest and dress shirt and tie....no jacket. What gives...did I miss that edition of Men's Vogue?
tankerjohn
A little poofier than I prefer
Lots to unpack here...
Re Filson: Yes, I think its perfectly alright to wear Filson and similar vests by themselves since they are functional for working outdoors and the like. And they could even work as casual wear if you're going for a rugged Americana or western look. But definitely not office wear, unless your office is on a ranch or you live in Billings, Montana.
Re suit vests with no jacket: Danger Will Robinson! Not to say its improper or can't be done. If the fit is right and the colors work, I suppose, theoretically, it can be pulled off. But you greatly risk coming off like a reject from the 1800's, or worse, the 1990's (yes, I totally stole that line from some guy's menswear blog). And if you do it too much, you risk becoming "vest guy". Proceed with caution.
Re odd vests with jackets: I think this can look very nice, but needs a practiced hand to get it coordinated right. Again, there's a risk of coming off costumy.
Re the bottom button: I suppose it should be unbuttoned, but buttoning it is a much lesser faux pas than wearing the vest open or even buttoning the bottom button of a suit coat. Much of menswear is basically vestigial from bygone eras. Jacket lapels come from men in the 1700's unbuttoning their coats and pressing back the edges when it got hot. And of course jackets have vents so we ride horses. So I guess its just in keeping with this tradition that we still follow the sprezzatura of a fat, long dead, king when buttoning our vests and jackets.
Re Filson: Yes, I think its perfectly alright to wear Filson and similar vests by themselves since they are functional for working outdoors and the like. And they could even work as casual wear if you're going for a rugged Americana or western look. But definitely not office wear, unless your office is on a ranch or you live in Billings, Montana.
Re suit vests with no jacket: Danger Will Robinson! Not to say its improper or can't be done. If the fit is right and the colors work, I suppose, theoretically, it can be pulled off. But you greatly risk coming off like a reject from the 1800's, or worse, the 1990's (yes, I totally stole that line from some guy's menswear blog). And if you do it too much, you risk becoming "vest guy". Proceed with caution.
Re odd vests with jackets: I think this can look very nice, but needs a practiced hand to get it coordinated right. Again, there's a risk of coming off costumy.
Re the bottom button: I suppose it should be unbuttoned, but buttoning it is a much lesser faux pas than wearing the vest open or even buttoning the bottom button of a suit coat. Much of menswear is basically vestigial from bygone eras. Jacket lapels come from men in the 1700's unbuttoning their coats and pressing back the edges when it got hot. And of course jackets have vents so we ride horses. So I guess its just in keeping with this tradition that we still follow the sprezzatura of a fat, long dead, king when buttoning our vests and jackets.
Waistcoat. one wears a vest under ones shirt (just some friendly cross-Atlantic ribbing 
)
)- Thread starter
- #27
Boy oh boy...I must have missed the memo. I need to go back to fashion school. But then again...I found this site:
How to Wear a Vest Casually [outfit breakdown]
It appears just about anything goes...
How to Wear a Vest Casually [outfit breakdown]
It appears just about anything goes...
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tankerjohn
A little poofier than I prefer
See what I mean? That guy is totally on the brink of looking like the best friend in a 90's rom-com.
I wear a casual Barbour jacket vest all the time but would not wear a suit separate vest without a jacket. I think it looks silly and someone lacking in finesse and attention to detail. I feel the same about gents who do not polish their dress shoes. But I'm the guy who wears a suit or sport coat to work when everyone else is wearing khakis and polo shirts. If you want to read a proper men's magazine about gentlemen's style, check out The Rake. The Rake magazine
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Clearly your notion of "casual dress" differs from mine - blue jeans or shorts and T-shirt supporting some obscure local Indie band.
Then again, I've never worn much different at my workplaces (now retired) unless it was a uniform.
Hi. If I ever start wearing vests again (highly doubtful) I will button the bottom one. It's there for a reason, and I really am a little bit OCD when it comes to those things.
Given the length of the old Kings vest, one also wonders if the bottom button was left unfastened because of extra girth or just being lazy after a trip to the loo. Since that also increases in frequency at an older age.
Leaving the bottom button of a waistcoat undone is very practical: when you sit, the waistcoat will spread a bit, but should still cover your waist if properly cut and fitted. With the bottom button done up, the waistcoat may ride up your body and expose the top of the trousers and possibly the braces (belts are not worn with waistcoats), which defeats one of the purposes of wearing the waistcoat in the first place.
(Readers on the other side of the pond may substitute "vest", "pants", and "suspenders" as necessary).
(Readers on the other side of the pond may substitute "vest", "pants", and "suspenders" as necessary).
- Thread starter
- #34
It is interesting how men's fashion has evolved over time. Back in the day there were strict rules of dress...now those rules are flaunted and it seems anything goes as long as it looks good. Jeans are a good example of this -- at one time jeans were work apparel and a signature of counter culture. Now jeans are considered high end fashion when worn properly. I personally like the look of jeans with dress shirt, tie and vest (even with the bottom button unfastened). Or with a sport jacket. Very hip and chic. it even looks good on older guys as well. The days of ill fitting baggy suits as standard office apparel are gone. Thank heavens.
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Agree...on many occasions when my wife and I went to dinner I would wear really dark fitted jeans, white spread collar shirt and dark navy cashmere sport coat. For summer wear, I normally wear white fitted jeans, blue spread collar shirt and a linen sport coat. I still see a lot of ill fitting suits around the office, the jacket is a couple sizes to big and hangs off the shoulders and the pants have no shape. Even if your a chubby guy, I fitted suit will make you look thinner. Wearing a shower curtain does not. A good tailor is a man's best friend!
This ^^^
Every man should have an excellent tailor they work with. Once you find one, you'll know it.
To me "rules of dress," like most "customs," can be broken, if one is doing it intentionally and/or one appears to be doing it intentionally. And if enough people "violate" a rule on purpose, it becomes a fashion and "within the rules."
Given the historic, conventional rules, I cannot think of a reason I would button the bottom button of a suit coat or a waistcoat. This is because the only reason I can think of to button either of those buttons is because one does not know the rules, not that one is intentionally ignoring the rule to make a particular statement, and I want folks to think I am socially aware.
I can possibly see wearing a waistcoat without a suit coat and even with jeans, if I wanted that look, and I don't think anyone would think that I think it is traditional to wear a waistcoat in that fashion. But my doing that is unlikely because I would not want that look. I think the danger of looking like a best friend in a 90's rom com is great.
Now, if someone in the public eye whom I really respected and thought had a sense of style, started wearing waistcoats from three-piece suit sets with a dress shirt without a tie, I might be shallow enough to do the same.
By the way, I think wearing a waistcoat that contrasts with a suit one is wearing is dangerous ground. Although I read that this has a long history in menswear. How to Wear Men's Waistcoats & Odd Vests — Gentleman's Gazette I think what one really does not want is a look that says, I have two three-pieces suits and I like to mix and match the pieces. (Although that link leads to an article that says that is a good idea! There is also the concept of wearing a contrasting suit coat over trousers and a waistcoat that match. I do think avoiding costume is a good rule.) So a red or green vest at Christmas, maybe. Or a tartan plaid from one's Scottish clan, perhaps. Or perhaps some kind of vest that has some contrast with the suit fabric, but does not look like it was simply transplanted from another suit set. I think a contrasting vest would go better with a sports coat or perhaps a blazer though.
Also, this stuff is cultural or situational for want of better terms. I am an old fat white business guy. I might not look good in something a young creative arts guy from Japan would look fabulous in, or a trim young and handsome professional athlete.
Given the historic, conventional rules, I cannot think of a reason I would button the bottom button of a suit coat or a waistcoat. This is because the only reason I can think of to button either of those buttons is because one does not know the rules, not that one is intentionally ignoring the rule to make a particular statement, and I want folks to think I am socially aware.
I can possibly see wearing a waistcoat without a suit coat and even with jeans, if I wanted that look, and I don't think anyone would think that I think it is traditional to wear a waistcoat in that fashion. But my doing that is unlikely because I would not want that look. I think the danger of looking like a best friend in a 90's rom com is great.
Now, if someone in the public eye whom I really respected and thought had a sense of style, started wearing waistcoats from three-piece suit sets with a dress shirt without a tie, I might be shallow enough to do the same.
By the way, I think wearing a waistcoat that contrasts with a suit one is wearing is dangerous ground. Although I read that this has a long history in menswear. How to Wear Men's Waistcoats & Odd Vests — Gentleman's Gazette I think what one really does not want is a look that says, I have two three-pieces suits and I like to mix and match the pieces. (Although that link leads to an article that says that is a good idea! There is also the concept of wearing a contrasting suit coat over trousers and a waistcoat that match. I do think avoiding costume is a good rule.) So a red or green vest at Christmas, maybe. Or a tartan plaid from one's Scottish clan, perhaps. Or perhaps some kind of vest that has some contrast with the suit fabric, but does not look like it was simply transplanted from another suit set. I think a contrasting vest would go better with a sports coat or perhaps a blazer though.
Also, this stuff is cultural or situational for want of better terms. I am an old fat white business guy. I might not look good in something a young creative arts guy from Japan would look fabulous in, or a trim young and handsome professional athlete.
Some of our conversation may be at cross-purposes. There's big differences between the sorts of waistcoat that
a) are part of a 3-piece suit
b) are for wearing with blazers, ties and dress slacks
c) are casual for chinos or jeans
d) are work-wear related (eg Filson)
Different rules and attitudes apply. And when you ask I see several people at work that casually wear a vest and dress shirt and tie....no jacket. What gives...did I miss that edition of Men's Vogue? I'd make the following observations ...
1. I much prefer to talk about style than fashion, and so let's leave stuff like GQ and Vogue out of the calculations.
2. Ask the same question but without mention of the vest ... guys at work who wear a suit and tie to work, and then leave their suit jacket on the back of their chair or door hook, and walk around all day in shirt and tie but no jacket ... what gives? It's a frequent look for office wear ... and one at which most people don't bat an eye. My personal preference is to keep the jacket on; please don't take that as me saying it's a rule, but just my preference (and I'd be happy to see more people adopt it too ... I think it makes for a cleaner look, compared to the billowing muffin-top dress shirt without a jacket we see so often. My own personal opinion is all.)
Waistcoat. one wears a vest under ones shirt (just some friendly cross-Atlantic ribbing
Wait until we start talking about pants.
It IS there for a reason ... to let you show the rest of the world that you know you aren't supposed to button it up.
You know, I really love the new-look B&B ... but the loss of Custom Titles is a crying shame!!
- Thread starter
- #39
Okay....so maybe I will hold off on posting that thread about when its appropriate for men to wear a man-skirt (kilt)...
Seriously though guys...I've enjoyed the conversation and reading all the various opinions and views. I learn something new every day.
Now...what shall I wear tomorrow?
Seriously though guys...I've enjoyed the conversation and reading all the various opinions and views. I learn something new every day.
Now...what shall I wear tomorrow?
Okay....so maybe I will hold off on posting that thread about when its appropriate for men to wear a man-skirt (kilt)...
Seriously though guys...I've enjoyed the conversation and reading all the various opinions and views. I learn something new every day.
Lets not forget about the lava-lava for the man-skirts.
It's good to read others views on these subjects.
