Plating loss on my EJ89LBL

[Eaaqas]

Hi all,

I was dumb and accidentally knocked my EJ89 off its stand onto my granite countertop! This morning while shaving I noticed the two small marks of copper color marking the side of the razor.

What does this mean for upkeep? Is it going to rust out soon? Do I need to get it replated asap? Do I need to make extra care that it is cleaned and dried?

Thanks!

 

[BSAGuy]

Oops. Hope the injury is not fatal.

 

[nuclearblast]

Usually Zamak razors can't be replated because they won't withstand the chemical process used to strip the old plating off.

The copper color you see might be a good sign actually. I'm not really sure (maybe Chris could confirm this), the Zamak is isolated with copper before receiving the actual plating. So if you see copper probably the Zamak isn't exposed yet. But when/if it gets exposed it's only a matter of time until it starts to disintegrate.

 

[Eaaqas]

Well dang it. I have no idea what that means . Given that it will disintegrate, do I need to isolate it from everything else?

Thanks for the quick response. I'm so clumsy. Attached is a pic of the damage! I guess I will just have to use straights only

 

[nuclearblast]

Luckily, you can purchase a new top cap (the R89 cap is the same as EJ's) and it's not expensive.

http://www.shaving.ie/products/muhle-replacement-top-plate-r89.html

But I'd just use it for now and see how it holds up.

 

[forrestgump]

keep it dry. you could try to put some clear nail polish over it to help it last. i sure understand your frustrations over this, but these things happen. remember though, Christmas is right around the corner

 

[Eaaqas]

True! Thanks for the advice and support I'll keep everyone updated!

 

[Eaaqas]

What are the symptoms of Zamak rot? Will the top cap just fall apart on me? Sorry, I haven't found any symptom posts!

 

[StubbleOfSteel]

What are the symptoms of Zamak rot? Will the top cap just fall apart on me? Sorry, I haven't found any symptom posts!

Pretty much what I've read here. You will twist it on or off and it will just fall apart. I have and love my EJ. I just know or expect it to fail in 3 years or so. Then I'll just buy another.

30-40 bucks is my limit though. I fear spending Muhle type money. My understanding is it's the same materials.

 

[TheChariot]

The good news is that the most fatal spot for Zamak rot is usually the threads, so perhaps it'll last longer since the damage is on the top cap. I'd recommend getting a backup razor. A second DE89 is good to have around if you're committed to that razor. They're fragile enough where the thread post can actually snap completely if dropped. Or you could look at it as an opportunity to try something different so that you won't be left with nothing if your DE89 succumbs to rottage. Or just get a backup DE89 head.

 

[Eaaqas]

Thanks for the pertinent info! I'm having my wife put on some nail polish and we will see what happens. I plan on purchasing another DE at some point, so I'm not too worried about this guy. If it happens sooner rather than later I am prepared with a couple straights that I can use.

It is definitely a good starter razor, but after being on here long enough I've decided to go with something adjustable. We will see what the future brings.

Thanks again


Edit: Crumbling sounds kind of exciting. I want to get a slow-mo video of my face as it falls apart during a shave

 

[nocutsnonicksnoweepers]

Usually Zamak razors can't be replated because they won't withstand the chemical process used to strip the old plating off.

The copper color you see might be a good sign actually. I'm not really sure (maybe Chris could confirm this), the Zamak is isolated with copper before receiving the actual plating. So if you see copper probably the Zamak isn't exposed yet. But when/if it gets exposed it's only a matter of time until it starts to disintegrate.

Edgar, you are on the mark, as usual.

For those interested, here is a synopsis of the plating process for zinc-based metals (pot metal).

Many of you are familiar with the word Zamak. In the pot metal industry, it is the flagship alloy. It is a trade-name for a particular pot metal that uses 99.99% pure zinc and has a constant 4% aluminum composition. More on why this is important - a little further down in my discussion*. The name Zamak is an acronym of the German names for the metals of which the alloys are composed: Zink (zinc), Aluminium, Magnesium and Kupfer (copper).

Many may not know this, but there are different grades of Zamak - each based upon differences in the content of the metals that are part of the alloy. Each grade has its own "personality" and thus, not all Zamak is the same Zamak.

So.....if you think that having various grades of Zamak is bad enough......think about all of the "junk" pot metal that is out there - and does not meet the same exacting content standards of Zamak. The variability of pot metal (and the way it acts, based on that) is staggering - and a big cause for issues related to replating it.

Pot metal is considered to be an "active" metal. It does not do well in an acidic environment. Many plating solutions are acidic. Nickel is somewhat acidic. Rhodium is dissolved in sulfuric acid and the plating solution has quite a low pH. If pot metal is put into an acidic bath, it either turns BLACK or bubbles (as the acid breaks it down). Pot metal will not accept plating from an acidic bath. The unfortunate side note for plating companies, is that this blackening, bubbling pot metal releases contaminants into the plating bath - and poisons it. This gets very expensive. I have ruined several plating baths with pot metal.

Most pot metal will plate in an alkaline solution. Typically, pot metal is plated in alkaline copper. Nothing special about it - copper is copper - BUT, with this type of plating solution, the dissolved copper is in an alkaline (opposite of acidic) medium. Pot metal does not react negatively in this environment, so the copper can be plated over the pot metal. This layer of alkaline-plated copper now "seals" the pot metal - and protects the pot metal from the acid in a nickel bath. Since the acid does not contact the pot metal, the nickel will then plate over the copper. Once the nickel is in place, chrome is frequently plated over the nickel on many modern, pot metal razors.

This copper layer is what is seen in these photos.

* One of the biggest issues with pot metal is that many pot metals can have varying aluminum content (as compared to the fixed 4% aluminum content found in the trade-name Zamak pot metal). The more aluminum in the pot metal, the more the pot metal takes on an "aluminum personality". Aluminum will not accept traditional electroplating WITHOUT a preparatory step called "zincation". Zincation is exactly what it sounds like. It is the plating of zinc onto the aluminum. Once the aluminum has been zincated, it takes on a more "pot metal personality" and can then, like pot metal, be plated in alkaline copper. After this, the plating process is the same as with pot metal.

Alkaline copper is not the easiest product to source. Most copper plating solutions are acidic copper - and WILL NOT work with pot metal. I stock alkaline copper. I also utilize "pot metal safe" nickel stripping chemicals. I have successfully replated quite a bit of pot metal in my days, BUT I do not offer pot metal plating as a part of my replating services - because of the variability with pot metals. When you take into account that there are four different varieties of Zamak and numerous pot metals of questionable composition, the possibilities for replating problems increase in a big way. These different pot metals look similar and there is no way to know what pot metal one is actually working with. Because of this, results are too variable for pot metal replating to be considered a viable replating service.

Now, my friends, you understand how pot metal razors were actually plated by the manufacturer. The manufacturer stipulates the type of pot metal to be used in a product. They know the characteristics of the pot metal that they use. Because of this, they know exactly what sort of preparatory steps are needed to plate the pot metal. Having this information, allows the manufacturer to plate their razors consistently.

The problem arises, when the plating is compromised and the razor needs a replate. The replating specialist is not privy to the tech specs of the pot metal used by a manufacturer, so it is a guessing game and a gamble. Additionally, many pot metal razors are chrome-plated. The chrome has to be stripped for a replate. Chrome strippers can be unfriendly to zinc-based metals - and if chrome is manually buffed-away - pot metal may accidentally be exposed if the buffing process goes through the chrome and compromises the nickel underneath. Thus, the reasons for why pot metal razors are not typically considered to be able to be safely replated!

My lecture endeth here! There will be no Metallurgy 101 exam. Just sharing some of my science geekery to help readers better understand why there is always such a big problem with the finish on pot metal razors.

 

[socialjunk95]

Keep using it until it fails. I'm sure it'll take a while and then you can pick up a r89 cap for cheap as suggested by Edgar!

 

[OverCr]

I really appreciate it when someone takes the time to explain a subject like nocutsnonicksnoweepers did.
Thank you.

 

[Eaaqas]

I really appreciate it when someone takes the time to explain a subject like nocutsnonicksnoweepers did.
Thank you.

+1. Very informative post. Now I figure I could have asked my Father-in-law that makes swords, but reading it is so much easier. Thank you very much!

 

[Bill01]

Excellent explanation of the process!

 

[TheChariot]

He's definitely the guy who would know. Thanks for taking us to the classroom! And for reminding me why I will probably never work with metal on that level.

 

[BSAGuy]

When you do get another DE, go vintage Gillette. Super Speeds, Fat Boys, Slims, Olds, News, etc. all are brass and will last forever. I have a 104 year old Single Ring that I use frequently as well as several open combs from the '20's and '30's as well as several 1950's razors. All shave great and will outlast me.

Thanks for the pertinent info! I'm having my wife put on some nail polish and we will see what happens. I plan on purchasing another DE at some point, so I'm not too worried about this guy. If it happens sooner rather than later I am prepared with a couple straights that I can use.

It is definitely a good starter razor, but after being on here long enough I've decided to go with something adjustable. We will see what the future brings.

Thanks again


Edit: Crumbling sounds kind of exciting. I want to get a slow-mo video of my face as it falls apart during a shave

 

[nuclearblast]

Excellent explanation of the process!

+1

Thank you Chris!

 

[patten1969]

Luckily, you can purchase a new top cap (the R89 cap is the same as EJ's) and it's not expensive.

http://www.shaving.ie/products/muhle-replacement-top-plate-r89.html

But I'd just use it for now and see how it holds up.

+1. Those heads aren't meant to be heirlooms. New heads are cheap, and can also be used as an excuse to get a new handle!