Muhle R89 Grande as Rockwell 6C substitute

[Alex Jr]

6C weights 100gr and 6S weights 116gr. The 6S is matte. The design is the same. The 16grams and the matte finish makes the 6S that better?

The design tolerances are not the same. Razors can change even with the slightest mm difference. That can affect exposure, rigidity and the overall performance. (And more)

I feel a considerable difference between those two and I praised my 6C a lot.

I don’t dislike my 6C now, but like I said, the 6S is the real deal.

 

[gms]

I don't want to stop using my 6C but to try something different with similar results without the need to change plates. Most of the time I use plates 4/4/2 so its not really a problem to change plate. The 6C is really versatile razor. If I am unshaved for 6 or more days I can use plates 5/4/2 or 6/4/2 and get a perfect shave. This can't be done with R89 or GC .68-p.

Anyway, I ordered the GC 0.68-p and only the head of R89. I got both of them and I tried first the R89 because I think its milder and the head design its closer to 6C. I got a great shave without nicks or irritations. I really liked it. For shaving every 2 or 3 days is a good 6C alternative to break the monotony. Btw, as Jay21 said, the handle of 6C isn't compatible with R89 or .68-p head. But the Bulldog handle of Razorock .68-p fits perfet the R89 and 6C heads.

The .68-p looks really great. The head is very thin and it will be very easy to access dificult areas of face (under the nose or lips). But for the same reason it also looks very scary to me.There is almost no guard and I am not sure how much is the blade feeling when you are shaving. 6C has a very thick guard and CG very thin. R89 is somewhere in the middle.

The bulldog handle of GC has a fantastic grip and gives great weight and balance to the thin and lightweight head of 0.68-p. It fits also quite well to the R89 head althought it makes it a bit heavier. Also, the stand of 6C is perfect for the GC handle.

 

[WVShaver]

I don't want to stop using my 6C but to try something different with similar results without the need to change plates. Most of the time I use plates 4/4/2 so its not really a problem to change plate. The 6C is really versatile razor. If I am unshaved for 6 or more days I can use plates 5/4/2 or 6/4/2 and get a perfect shave. This can't be done with R89 or GC .68-p.

Anyway, I ordered the GC 0.68-p and only the head of R89. I got both of them and I tried first the R89 because I think its milder and the head design its closer to 6C. I got a great shave without nicks or irritations. I really liked it. For shaving every 2 or 3 days is a good 6C alternative to break the monotony. Btw, as Jay21 said, the handle of 6C isn't compatible with R89 or .68-p head. But the Bulldog handle of Razorock .68-p fits perfet the R89 and 6C heads.

The .68-p looks really great. The head is very thin and it will be very easy to access dificult areas of face (under the nose or lips). But for the same reason it also looks very scary to me.There is almost no guard and I am not sure how much is the blade feeling when you are shaving. 6C has a very thick guard and CG very thin. R89 is somewhere in the middle.

The bulldog handle of GC has a fantastic grip and gives great weight and balance to the thin and lightweight head of 0.68-p. It fits also quite well to the R89 head althought it makes it a bit heavier. Also, the stand of 6C is perfect for the GC handle.

I hope you like the .68P as well as the R89. There’s no need to be afraid of it, it’s quite mild feeling.

You may even decide to bump up to the Game Changer .76P or .84P head if you like the .68 you have.

If you ever order another one, the BarberPole handle is a great choice. I like it much more then my Super Knurl since it has just as much grip but with a thicker bottom piece to grip onto.

I think RazoRock is my favorite razor company so far. They put out amazing quality for the price and the Game Changer is my favorite razor so far.

I also loved my R89 but found it too mild most of the time. The 89 heads I’ve tried with more blade gap were amazing shavers. So I often put a blade shim in my R89 back when I used it every day and it was a nice bump up in efficiency. If you’re ever interested in shims there’s a lot of old threads on the subject and it gives you an easy way to test a slightly more aggressive razor with the one you already have.

Don’t forget to try the Gillette Tech sometime as well. I have a feeling you’d really like that one and they can be had for $10-20 all day. If you really like the Tech and want to have a newer similar upgraded razor the Feather AS-D2 is very similar but costs $150ish.

One last razor I didn’t mention earlier is the Karve Overlander and that’s because I’ve never tried it. But based on what I’ve read it may also be a great fit for you and is at the top of my want list.

 

[gms]

I tried GC .68-p yesterday and I had a deep shave with 3 passes and no need for touch up fixes. But I had a burning feeling at some areas of my face after the shave and today I saw some neck irritation. Maybe the Bic blade was too sharp or I did mistakes with the shaving angle. Next time I will test it with a less sharp blade, maybe a Personna platinum. The desing of the GC is really beautiful and makes the 6C looks too bulky. I really like that the cap covers all the blade but I didn't like that much that I had to load the blade at the plate and not at the cap. But this way looks that the blade is grabed tight and more aling.

What about the mamba 70 with the neutral to slight possitive (~0 to +0.01 mm) blade exposure versus GC 0.68-p? Or the mamba 53 with the blade exposure neutral to slight negative (~0 to -0.01mm)? The GC has possitive blade exposure and maybe this is the reason I got the burning feeling and the irritation (or I shave wrong).

 

[Alex Jr]

But I had a burning feeling at some areas of my face after the shave and today I saw some neck irritation

There it is. My story with the game changer.

I hope you can figure it out. I couldn’t.

 

[WVShaver]

I tried GC .68-p yesterday and I had a deep shave with 3 passes and no need for touch up fixes. But I had a burning feeling at some areas of my face after the shave and today I saw some neck irritation. Maybe the Bic blade was too sharp or I did mistakes with the shaving angle. Next time I will test it with a less sharp blade, maybe a Personna platinum. The desing of the GC is really beautiful and makes the 6C looks too bulky. I really like that the cap covers all the blade but I didn't like that much that I had to load the blade at the plate and not at the cap. But this way looks that the blade is grabed tight and more aling.

What about the mamba 70 with the neutral to slight possitive (~0 to +0.01 mm) blade exposure versus GC 0.68-p? Or the mamba 53 with the blade exposure neutral to slight negative (~0 to -0.01mm)? The GC has possitive blade exposure and maybe this is the reason I got the burning feeling and the irritation (or I shave wrong).

The BIC is not a great blade in my GCs. They are the sharpest blade but aren’t anywhere near as smooth as a nice Russian blade like the GSB, Astra SP, etc.

Out of all the blades to try I think the GSB is the safest bet. It’s very smooth and still sharp. The Nacet, and Permasharp would be good to try as well. Along with the Russian Astras, and Russian 7 O’ Clocks.

But on the irritation I have to ask, are you applying pressure at all? If you are applying even the slightest bit of pressure stop and try it without pressure for just one shave. It will feel weird at first just dragging the razor across your face instead of pushing it into your face with pressure but it was probably the biggest improvement I made and the irritation and burn I used to get is a thing of the past as long as I’m smart about razor/blade choices.

 

[WVShaver]

Some more shave tips that work for me.

1.) After a hot shower I rub Dandruff Shampoo/Conditioner into my face and rinse it off with hot water right before applying cream/soap.

2.) After my final pass I turn the sink to cold water and rub the cold water into my face. This works best in winter when the water temp is lower and really helps cool your face after your shave. Menthol type creams also help in this regard.

3.) I dry my face and then I have witch hazel in a spray bottle and squirt some in my palm to rub on my face. After letting the witch hazel sit on my face a few seconds I turn the cold water back on and wash my face one last time with just a slight bit of hand soap added.

Optional - if you really irritate your skin badly I think the Gold Bond talcum powder works great rubbed on the trouble areas. The new corn starch formula isn’t as good but still works. I’ve also had luck with the gel aftershaves like Afta, or Gillette etc. but I don’t like how greasy they feel and only use them on rare occasions.

 

[gms]

I don't apply pressure when I am shaving. I let the weight of the razor do the trick. That's why I want the razor to have a decent weight. I might be wrong sometimes with the angle when I am shaving ATG. I am sure my technique needs improvements. After the shave I am using alum block and balm. I also have a cream from a dematologist but I rarery need it.

I usually use Barrister and Mann omnibus base shaving soaps (my favorite) and sometimes Wholly Kaw siero base (untill I finish them).

With 6C the Bic blades are perfect for my face. Bic works also good with R89. Other blades that works with 6C but not that good as Bic are Feather, Astra blue (the green is nightmare bad), from 7 O' clock I don't remember if the yellow or green works better (but not both). Nacet was bad for me, Permasharp better but still bad, Wilkinson nightmare bad, Personna platinum decent but not that sharp. I have to test some of them again with CG. But I am thinking to test first the mamba series razors. I have always the 6C, R89 options and I can improve my technique with GC. There is always a possibility the Bic blade I used with GC to had problem (I usuall use the only once).

 

[WVShaver]

It sounds like you have everything down fairly well. I also find Omnibus the best soap out of the ones I tried. None came close. Most soaps didn't work well for me, but perhaps I wasn't loading enough soap. It may be sacrilege but anymore I often use Gillette Labs shave gel. I think it works better then most of the soaps I have tried and is close to Omnibus. It also has a nice menthol cooling effect which helps with irritation - Similar to Proraso Green except I think the gel works a lot better and has more of that thick consistency that Omnibus has. It is expensive at the local stores but can be had online for $4-5 a can if you look around.

Did you ever try Gillette Silver Blues? Out of every blade out there I think it is the most consistent and smooth blade I have tried. But I've also had good luck with blades you didn't like so the GSB still may not be for you but it's worth a try. On the 7 O'Clocks I recently tried both Yellow & Green Russian ones and thought they both worked great. I haven't tried the Indian ones in those colors. But I have tried the 7 O'Clock Blacks made in India and they were a great blade as well but fairly costly at around $30 per 100.

I have the original Mamba head and the 70 but never gave them much of a chance. I always planned to revisit them along with countless other razors I got in the beginning so perhaps I will like it more now that my technique is far better. I only shaved with the 70 a couple times but going from memory it seems like it was hard to get it to cut very efficiently.

Even though I do not own one I think the Karve Overlander may be what you are looking for but it's pricey. Many people seem to praise it's smooth ATG ability. It's on my shortlist of razors. But the old Gillette Tech may also serve you well for cheap. If you like the R89 but want a bit more efficiency you may want to try the Yaqi R89 clone, or the one from Maggards as I believe both are slightly more efficient. The Razorock MJ-90 is also based on the 89 but has a much wider blade gap and I'm not sure it would be the best option for you.

 

[gms]

I did a quick check and I didn't find the Karve brand to the EU sites I usually buy shaving items. I think I will order the RR mambas and I will try again the GC. I really like the design of GC but I am not sure if the .68 is really mild. On the other hand the Mamba razors are milder and I hope I can make one of them work....

 

[WhiskerLess]

I did a quick check and I didn't find the Karve brand to the EU sites I usually buy shaving items. I think I will order the RR mambas and I will try again the GC. I really like the design of GC but I am not sure if the .68 is really mild. On the other hand the Mamba razors are milder and I hope I can make one of them work....

Will watch this thread.
6S - 4/4/2 plate user here as well, consistent BBS comfortable irritation free shave with it.
I am always curious on how it compares with GC .68.

 

[gms]

Will watch this thread.
6S - 4/4/2 plate user here as well, consistent BBS comfortable irritation free shave with it.
I am always curious on how it compares with GC .68.

I ordered the Mamba 70 and I will use the GC .68 again. After I used the GC and the R89 the head of 6C looks to me thick and bulky. I know that the dual plate system of 6C/6S makes the head that bulky but still is way too uncomfortable compared to GC or Mamba's head design. I will post again about the mamba 70 and the GC .68

 

[Vitt]

6C weights 100gr and 6S weights 116gr. The 6S is matte. The design is the same. The 16grams and the matte finish makes the 6S that better?

I never tried the 6C, and lots of ppl say they are virtually the same. Having said that, the 6S being machined SS possibly has closer tolerances than the 6C, which I believe is cast. I am not 100% certain but according to a YouTuber, the 6S is machined in the US and the 6C is made in China. I know there are some good quality razors coming from China these days but who knows, maybe the quality varies. I can't find that particular video from that YouTuber anymore after a quick search. Not sure if he deleted it.

 

[gms]

Maybe the tolerances are different as you and Alex Jr are saying. The 6S costs more and its logical to have better production specifications.
Also is well known that the 6S is from USA and 6C from China. Rockwell says it at their official web FAQ site: here
But as I said after using other razors the 6C looks to me way too bulky and only if Mamba 70 and GC .68 fail my expectations I will consider to buy the 6S. I am not home now to post a side by side image of 6C/GC/Mamba to see the profile differences.

 

[DeBladeRunner]

That’s why I’m careful about internet info.

The day my 6C shaves me the same as my 6S I’ll grow a beard. They are not the same and this “drag” thing is non existent in my humble opinion.

I wouldn’t trade 1 6S for 100 game changers. They shave very differently.

The 6C is a nice razor, but the 6S is the real deal.

But I guess that ship has already sailed.

Tell us what you think of the GC. Enjoy!

I Have owned the 6C, 6S, and the J crew 6C..My favorite version was the gun metal 6c..It’s just more maneuverable and smoother than the much heavier 6s.While I’m in no worry to get rid of the 6s anytime soon.

 

[Albert V]

I had the Muhle R89 and sold it shortly after getting the Rockwell 6C. I liked it so much that I sold that 6C and got the 6S which is my only razor now. I use plates 3 and 4 and5 depending on growth but rarely ever change plates.

 

[gms]

About the 6S and 6C comparison I just found from Rockwell site that 6S parts are not the same after all. Rockwell says here:

Our Rockwell 2C and 6C models share the same parts so they are interchangeable. While the Rockwell 6S parts have slightly different dimensions and geometry. As a result, we don't recommend combining 6C parts with 6S parts.

The day my 6C shaves me the same as my 6S I’ll grow a beard. They are not the same and this “drag” thing is non existent in my humble opinion.

So Alex Jr you are right, no need to grow beard

I got the Mamba 70 and I used it twice. Mamba 70 design is different from other safety razors I have. The head is very curved and requires to find and maintain a specific shaving angle. This isn't that easy to do when I try to shave near and under the chin. On the other hand mamba 70 has almost no blade feel and this gives me a feeling of safety that I don't have with other razors (not even with 6C).
At the first shave with mamba 70 I used a Bic blade. I had to pass some spots 2-3 times more because at those spots I haven't maintain the correct angle. Sometimes I also pushed the razor a bit more. The result was a decent shave, some nicks but at least no irritations.
The second time with mamba 70 I used a Feather blade. Big mistake... The blade was too sharp and I got a deeper shave but plenty of irritations and redness.

I also shaved again with Game Changer .68. This time I used a Persona platinum blade and I was very very careful. With GC I feel the blade on my face. Not much but I do feel it. This time I gave attention to that blade feel and I was careful. GC .68 is very effective and this time I had a deep shave with no nicks and no irritations. Alum block almost didn't burned my face at all. Impressive...

I have to note that with 6C the Personna platinum blade couldn't manage to shave smooth under the chin and I had to use more sharp blades (Bic and Feather). With GC the Personna blade had no problem shaving me under the chin. Maybe the more positive blade exposure of GC makes the blade to work better.

With the next shaves I will use the GC .68 with Bic blade and plenty of caution. I will also try to improve my technique with mamba 70. I really like the safety feeling of mamba razor and I think if I can manage to maintain the shaving angle it will give me similar shaving results like GC gave me this time.

I think that GC .68 is similar to plate 4 or 5 of Rockwell 6C but it shaves smoother ATG. Maybe the increased blade feel of GC makes me maintain smaller shaving angle with ATG shave. Mamba 70 efficiency is similar to plate 4 of 6C but it feels more like the plate 3 or even plate 2.

I like both Razorock razors. GC .68 is more effective, easier to use but not too smooth and not too forgiving. Mamba 70 feels safer but harder to master. R89 is also good but I think I prefer more the stainless feeling of RRs. In time I will know if I will use all of them with rotation or only one.

After using those 3 razors the Rockwell feels now bulky. Check the photo comparison of my 6C and RR GC 0.68p. Both hands have the same height and its clear that 6C head is almost twice as thick...

Rockwell 6C/6S looks like a safer choice for a beginner. But the truth is that most users use 6C and 6S with plates 3 and 4. And most mild razors offers the R3 and R4 efficiency and safety without the confusion of many plates. With the knowledge I have now I believe that R89 is the best choice for a beginner. It works only with the angle that the head design permits and this is very helpful for a beginner. Its also price friendly.

I want to thank you all for your replies and help you gave me. Especially WVShaver for the time he spend to write analytic suggestions and shaving tips.

Some time in the near future I will post here my final thoughts about the Game Changer and Mamba razors.

 

[Alex Jr]

So Alex Jr you are right, no need to grow beard

Oh shait I was already thinking about a nice handlebar

@gms the difference is there for me, I don’t know how or why, but I can certainly feel it. I didn’t know Rockwell had that note, interesting!

It’s like a tech clone, it’s 95% tech but in the end it isn’t a tech, it misses something. (By the way you need a tech )

I’m glad you’re enjoying the process, that’s what’s all about.

Keep us updated!

 

[WVShaver]

I’m happy to hear things are working out for you and am glad I could help. I imagine the more you shave with these the more comfortable you’ll get.

To me the .68p is very mild anymore and my .84p has even felt very tame. I’m not sure if it’s just more time spent with the razors or if it’s better lather over time.

I’ve actually been using the canned Gillette Labs Gel a lot of times and it’s amazing stuff for canned goo. If I’m not using it my preferred soap is B&M Omnibus. Most soaps never produced a thick enough lather for me to feel comfortable when shaving. That Gillette Labs canned stuff is expensive but much better then the other canned stuff I’ve tried in the past and I’d rather use it then most shaving soaps I’ve tried.

I only used my Mamba 70 a couple times and it was early in my shaving journey but I remember it was hard to get it to cut my hair so probably didn’t have the right angle down at the time. It was just an odd shaver and I quickly moved on but would like to revisit it someday.

I agree the R89 or GC .68p are probably better starter razors then the 6 series for the reasons you mentioned. It’s far simpler and I believe both shave smoother then the 6C while being much nimbler in the nose area. I like heavy razors but I’m not a fan of the really thick head.

And as you mentioned almost everyone uses plate 3-5 with 4 being the normal sweet spot. Plates 1-2 are almost pointless for most people and plate 6 isn’t overly aggressive. Rockwell would have probably done very well offering just 1 plate with one side being around a 3 or touch over and the other side being about a 4 or 4.5 on their scale. Or instead of offering really thick heads because of the dual plates just have single use plates like most other razors.

On your blades you use 2 of the ones that always causes the most irritation for me - Feather and Bic. Since my technique is far better anymore they don’t bite me nor cause much irritation but they still feel rough on my face and I just can’t justify their use when there’s so many other amazing blades out there.

I can’t remember if you said you tried the Gillette Silver Blues? If you try just one more blade that would be my recommended blade. There are plenty of other good choices like Astras, Permasharp, Nacet, Wizamet, Wilkinson Swords, Gillette Platinums, Gillette 7 O’clock varieties and others that you can try but if I had to just pick one that’s available today the Silver Blues would be my pick. But you may like the Nacets better since there a tad sharper.

Feel free to keep us updated on your progress in the future.