La Lorraine?

[Acmemfg]

Hone shopping.
As I'm a Belgian Coticule fan, I came across a La Lorraine..
About $100, word has it that the stone is somewhat like a cross between a BBW and yellow coticule.
I'm waffling between it and a Shapton 16k. I realize they are two completely different rocks. I own a La Veinette and a BBW. Highest grit hone (s) I currently have are a Naniwa 12k
SS, Zulu Grey, and Coe Arkansas Grey. Any insight as to what might be the better path?

 

[Christian1212]

Have you tried a gok 20k edge? I really love it for synthetic finishing. Might also look at one of those slates that Griffith sells (think there are a few).

 

[Empire straights]

Hone shopping.
As I'm a Belgian Coticule fan, I came across a La Lorraine..
About $100, word has it that the stone is somewhat like a cross between a BBW and yellow coticule.
I'm waffling between it and a Shapton 16k. I realize they are two completely different rocks. I own a La Veinette and a BBW. Highest grit hone (s) I currently have are a Naniwa 12k
SS, Zulu Grey, and Coe Arkansas Grey. Any insight as to what might be the better path?

I think Griffith sell la Lorraine for cheaper. The one I have isn't that different from the feel of a really fine bbw. A little keener, not quite as smooth.

 

[Wid]

Your Zulu and Coe would be good to follow the Coticule or 12K.

I’d look at a Jnat or Thuri

 

[Acmemfg]

@Christian1212
I picked up a Vermont Green slate hone from Griffith a couple years back after a conversation with Ertan Suer (who can work magic on one of those). It's a serviceable edge for sure but at this point the Zulu Grey still ranks at the #1 slot in my arsenal.

 

[Wid]

Even a black or translucent ark would be nice. Follow the 12k and get a real nice edge.

 

[cotedupy]

As Rick hinted at - I'm not certain you need either LaL or a Shapton 16k given what you have already.

If I had to choose one I would say the Shapton, the blue Belgian stones probably have better, more distinct, and interesting uses for knives (imo).

 

[Empire straights]

You can probably get a decent jnat for half that price from Japan avenue on a popular auction site. Can get a great one for that price, I've gotten several from there.

 

[Matt O]

I sure like my Zulu Grey, and the edges I get off of it.

I spent a substantial amount of time tinkering with it, and the two things that worked best were:

1. Using an Atoma 1200 to raise a slurry…diluting it down a little bit at a time as I went, until it was just a whisp of slurry in water. Insanely sharp and comfortable for my face!

2. I tried using a full nagura progression on it as if it were a super hard JNAT…and this also worked out really really well!

Vr

Matt

 

[SliceOfLife]

I've had a few Lorraines. Definitely a huge step up from a typical BBW... but they don't do anything a half-decent yellow coti doesn't do... and a good yellow coti outperforms them handily. So it's basically a downgrade from your LV.


What are you looking for? A better shaving finish? Vs a SS 12k and a La Veinette? I wouldn't bother with another high grit synth; anything they do; the 12k could do if you worked with it enough.

Thuri/PDSO/Jnat/Ark would be the only naturals I'd see as a logical upgrade to a good LV. And pasted balsa could be considered one too depending on preferences.

PDSO/Thuri if you get a good deal. Jnat if you feel like getting spendy and find one you like from a reputable seller. Ark if you don't mind spending a bit of time learning how to use it properly with your razors. Pasted Balsa if you want something easy to use and cheap.

 

[Acmemfg]

Have a healthy inventory of Arkansas stones. Tried to sell a Dan's surgical black a while back...no takers .
Also a number of Coe stones. Still making up my mind on those.
The mention of Thuris got my attention....are these the real deal or a wannabe?

Thuringian Water Hone​

From nearby the Thuringian quarry, as the Original Escher Stone, comes a new supply of black to grey-blue colored raw material.

Ultra-fine natural blue/grey water hone in high quality for the final hone of razors, scalpels, knives, edge tools, butcher knives.
The new Thuringian hone is somewhat harder than the Original Escher material, but has recently yielded towards lighter color, in the direction of the Original Escher, producing a similar high-grit hone.

 

[SliceOfLife]

Those are mueller stones. They are soft and gritty and maybe 5k. Been getting sold as Thuringians by resellers for a decade. Big scam.

 

[Acmemfg]

@SliceOfLife
Thanks for the heads up

 

[H Brad Boonshaft]

What is the problem with the Ark. As said, they do take some prep and a learning curve, but most folks that go on the journey end up with either a Black /Translucent Ark or a Jnat.

A $100 Kopa is all you need to finish, diamond slurry and or down the road a hard tomo will give you stellar edges and is an easy stone to learn. If you need more keenness and your skin can handle it, Diamond or CBN paste will get you as keen as you want.

I would look at why the Ark is not working for you, hard to improve on an Ark edge. Years ago, I learned to hone razors on a Translucent Ark and for years tried to improve on that edge with tons of stones synthetic, natural and paste, nothing came close until Jnats.

Chef Knives to Go still sells Nakayama Kopa’s for $75, if out of stock get on the email list and jump on it when emailed, they go quick.

 

[Empire straights]

What is the problem with the Ark. As said, they do take some prep and a learning curve, but most folks that go on the journey end up with either a Black /Translucent Ark or a Jnat.

A $100 Kopa is all you need to finish, diamond slurry and or down the road a hard tomo will give you stellar edges and is an easy stone to learn. If you need more keenness and your skin can handle it, Diamond or CBN paste will get you as keen as you want.

I would look at why the Ark is not working for you, hard to improve on an Ark edge. Years ago, I learned to hone razors on a Translucent Ark and for years tried to improve on that edge with tons of stones synthetic, natural and paste, nothing came close until Jnats.

Chef Knives to Go still sells Nakayama Kopa’s for $75, if out of stock get on the email list and jump on it when emailed, they go quick.

Agreed that the only thing that approached the level of keenness of a well done hard ark edge is a very fine/ hard jnat. Other novaculites generally don't even come close it seems to me. My Charnleys are smoother and still very keen but not the same as a hard ark. I've got a really soft and fine llyn idwal that will match my hard Arks but it's a weird stone, I've never had another stone like it.

 

[Acmemfg]

When did I say or elude to the idea I had/have a “problem” with an Arkansas stone?
I have many…among those shown here:

soft, hard, translucent, surgical black.
Add a few by Jonathan Coe (Arkansas Grey, Bethesda Black, Dota Creek).
Feeling the collection was a tad redundant I put the surgical black on the market; nary a nibble. Decided I was meant to hang onto it. And so it remains in the arsenal to this day.

 

[SliceOfLife]

What's that hard, a Dans true hard? It's pretty.

 

[Acmemfg]

Preyda soft on top. All the others are Dan's

 

[Wid]

If that Dans were a 1” I would have been interested. It’s still a nice stone.

As far as the Coe stones, I really like mine. Jon isn’t cutting anymore as far as I know.

Beautiful translucent.

 

[H Brad Boonshaft]

“When did I say or elude to the idea I had/have a “problem” with an Arkansas “stone?”

“I came across a La Lorraine. About $100, word has it that the stone is somewhat like a cross between a BBW and yellow coticule.
I'm waffling between it and a Shapton 16k. I realize they are two completely different rocks. I own a La Veinette and a BBW. Highest grit hone (s) I currently have are a Naniwa 12k SS, Zulu Grey, and Coe Arkansas Grey. Any insight as to what might be the better path?”

If not a problem and you are getting stellar edges off you Arks, what is it that you are looking for with Slates or the 16k?

Proper Ark edges are keen and comfortable.