Help identifying the source of my irritation

[The Blackadder]

I just had a few thoughts with regard to your issues. The brush can actually wind up irritating your skin more than the razor. I see someone else suggested bowl lathering and I think that it would definitely save your face from some wear and tear.

Also, some people who have sensitive skin do well with Proraso White and Mitchells Wool Fat and several artisans sell unscented versions of their soaps. The guy from Razor Emporium has a few videos where he recommends shaving with cold water. I don't enjoy that, but it apparently helps some people with sensitive skin.

Make sure the blade that you are using is not too dull. If you are feeling any amount of tugging, it's too dull. If you are getting nicked, you might be pressing down on the razor; only use the weight of the head and avoid shaving against the grain. Keep in mind that the direction of the grain of your hair growth can change depending on the specific part of your face. You can determine it by drawing your hand across your growth. The direction that feels the roughest is opposite to the grain.

Finally, some people are allergic to nickel, other metals, or polymers. You can try an uncoated stainless steel blade, like the Astra Blue. Feather used to make an excellent plastic razor called the Feather Popular. The use of an uncoated stainless steel blade and plastic razor might lessen your exposure to leeched metals. In general, I don't like the idea of using an Alum block. I use alcohol free Thayer's Witch Hazel and it works very well for me.

Great points, thank you

 

[know1special]

Like you, I also use cold water to shave. I switched several years ago and my overall skin health improved immediately and dramatically. IMHO, it's important to use sharp blades and possibly a more aggressive razor as the whiskers will be stiffer and more resistant to cutting when using the cold water method. Employing a shallower angle may help as well, at least on the first pass.

Looking at your OP, I would also recommend forgoing the scrubbing, the touch-ups and the alum and see how you get on. If there is improvement, you could add back one of those elements at a time to see if they cause issues.

Best of luck!

 

[JoWolf]

Hello everyone. I'm new to the forum, I've participated in other threads and lurked a lot before signing up, this is my official introduction. I've been DE shaving for just two months after reading a lot here and watching tons on videos on YouTube. As I said in another thread, I suffer from Dermatitis. My skin is oily around my nose, and dry towards my cheeks, jawline, sideburns and neck. This has put me in a tough spot since I was young. Started shaving with an electrical razor, which gave me terrible irritation specially in the neck. After many years I switched to cartridge razors which were more efficient and helped a bit with irritation. Finally I discovered DE razors and here I am. I'm quite new and of course need still tons of practice, but this is my hobby now. I have a Merkur Progress, a 20-dollar Rockwell brush (don't know the model), blades from different makes and several soaps and creams, a couple of post-shave balms and an alum block. When I started my idea was just to have a simple quick shave, so I began with Cremo since it just needed hot water and hand scrubbing. Got some decent results, with a couple of nicks and cuts, as expected. Then I switched to a Taconic soap, which I rubbed directly on my face and lathered. I'd say I got some of my best shaves that way, but the lime in my soap was a bit to much for me. I tried green Proraso twice, which gave me kind of a rash. Two weeks ago I started shaving exclusively with cold water and noticed a lot of improvement in my skin. Hot and warm water produced a lot of dryness and inflammation, cold water seems to have solved that. However, after a couple of hours or sometimes many hours, I get some red spots (not very noticeable) above my jawline, close to the sideburns and next to my mouth. Usually those three spots itch like hell. I sooth them applying water and a cream prescribed by a doctor for my condition (Nutradeica). I've read everything there is to read on the forum regarding irritation (The wanderer's guide and some others), but I can't pinpoint the reason. I've mapped my face, apply almost no pressure, the works. Only thing I avoid is hot shower and hot water, because it's literally poison to my face. I'll describe my shaving routine so you may help find the issue. I have fair, light beard by the way:

- Shave every day four times a week for work
- Prepare my face just splashing cold water and scrubbing for about a minute
- Face lather with Nivea sensitive shaving cream using my brush
- Do just one pass WTG and touch ups
- Rinse with cold water
- Apply alum block to my face
- Rinse after 30 seconds and dry face
- Apply Nivea sensitive skin balm
- I've only used Astra SP blades, 5 times tops each

Now I haven't shaved for over two days and the itchy spots are almost gone, so there's definitively something causing them during the shave. Strangely nothing happens to my neck, which is supposed to be the most sensitive place. What should I start testing, apart from technique? Quit the alum, change blades? I don't think it's the cream or balm, they are supposed to be for sensitive skin. Thanks in advance

I have a hundred suggestions. I came to the community same as you. Problem skin. It took me the best part of three years to sort out my sensitive skin issues. Anything that irritates your skin, get rid of it. It is not worth another try. I found veggie based products to work best for my skin. Try to minimize the amount of products and equipment used in your shave. Ideally a fixed four is the easiest to troubleshoot. The fewer moving parts the easier it is to spot problems. Never shave irritated skin. A good lathering brush is the safest, gentlest way to exfoliate skin. Avoid scrubbing your skin. Equipment and razor cleanliness a must for sensitive skin. I used Cold for quite awhile in my shaves. I have healthy skin now so prefer warm water shaves. B&B will help you solve your issues. I found journaling to help me in my shave journey.

 

[The Blackadder]

Equipment and razor cleanliness a must for sensitive skin

Do you recommend dipping the head of the razor in alcohol after each shave? How do you clean your gear?

Thanks

 

[JoWolf]

Do you recommend dipping the head of the razor in alcohol after each shave? How do you clean your gear?

Thanks

An alcohol dip would be the minimum and better than a water rinse. In my opinion.

I am a weekly face and head shaver. I single use Feathers. Post shave. My razor is washed and dried. A fresh blade is washed to remove the wax. Disinfected with iso, oiled, locked and loaded for the next shave. I thoroughly rinse my boar hair and lightly work it dry on a clean towel. It is a larger than usual brush and performs better when slightly combed out, a few minutes, a few times over the week. This keeps it fluffy and shaped nice for optimal performance. I never give equipment a thought it was dazzling when removed and placed back on the shelf. I shampoo the boar twice a year with a clarifying shampoo. My designed shave follows a careful routine and plan.

Obviously not the way I shaved when I got here. My Shave evolved over the years. At the beginning my razor blades did not get cleaned and oiled. Not all shavers are OCD.

Your four weekly shaves can be designed to suit your needs and available time. The most important is to stay small with the fewest components in your shave. This also ensures products that do not have desired or beneficial results in your shave are thrown out. We all have different skin and shaving parameters. Design your shave to suit your needs. It is a trial and error for all aspects. Sensitive skin issues must be the most important. I did not put as good an effort in the beginning and in the end it held my shave back. An uncomplicated fixed four is the easiest and quickest way to resolve issues. My fixed four delivers repetitive, comfortable issue free shaves.

 

[The Blackadder]

An alcohol dip would be the minimum and better than a water rinse. In my opinion.

I am a weekly face and head shaver. I single use Feathers. Post shave. My razor is washed and dried. A fresh blade is washed to remove the wax. Disinfected with iso, oiled, locked and loaded for the next shave. I thoroughly rinse my boar hair and lightly work it dry on a clean towel. It is a larger than usual brush and performs better when slightly combed out, a few minutes, a few times over the week. This keeps it fluffy and shaped nice for optimal performance. I never give equipment a thought it was dazzling when removed and placed back on the shelf. I shampoo the boar twice a year with a clarifying shampoo. My designed shave follows a careful routine and plan.

Obviously not the way I shaved when I got here. My Shave evolved over the years. At the beginning my razor blades did not get cleaned and oiled. Not all shavers are OCD.

Your four weekly shaves can be designed to suit your needs and available time. The most important is to stay small with the fewest components in your shave. This also ensures products that do not have desired or beneficial results in your shave are thrown out. We all have different skin and shaving parameters. Design your shave to suit your needs. It is a trial and error for all aspects. Sensitive skin issues must be the most important. I did not put as good an effort in the beginning and in the end it held my shave back. An uncomplicated fixed four is the easiest and quickest way to resolve issues. My fixed four delivers repetitive, comfortable issue free shaves.

View attachment 1647536

Thanks. What products do you use to wash your razors and blades, apart from alcohol? What kind of oil do you apply to them?

 

[JoWolf]

Thanks. What products do you use to wash your razors and blades, apart from alcohol? What kind of oil do you apply to them?

Pre shave beard oil. Most are basically olive oil, aloe etc. and fragrance. Mineral oil can also be used. You are protecting naked steel from oxidation, which starts immediately when the blade is unwrapped.

I just use whatever bar soap and a face cloth to wash the three razor parts. It is a gold plated brass razor. A towel dry and slight buff. I also put a drop of oil on the head threads and handle socket after it’s cleaned. Silky smooth thread action. Fatip’s require a little blade alignment when loading. The pictured razor used exclusively into its fourth year. It was my third choice when I started out.

My first journal entry: GC.68OC, GOLD GRANDE, YAQI CHROME MELLON - A JOURNEY - https://www.badgerandblade.com/forum/threads/gc-68oc-gold-grande-yaqi-chrome-mellon-a-journey.585819/

My shave is markedly different. It’s a process as well as a journey. Sadly for us beginners few short cuts. That can be a good thing.

 

[SalS]

I would change a few things and see if it helps. First prep your face with witch hazel or a very diluted apple cider vinegar like 4 parts water 1 part ACV. Either will clean your beard of oil and wax that prevent water from penetrating the hair. Use warm water not cold. Ditch the brush. It really isn’t necessary given the incredibly slick no brush creams like Kiehl’s Sensitive or Jack Black. They give better performance anyway without subjecting your skin to drying soap and the friction of the brush. I would finish only with pure aloe vera gel not aloe vera lotion and thats its. My two cents.

 

[Doc Dan]

I love Mitchell's Wool Fat shaving soap. It is my favorite. A close second is La Toja Sensitive, but since that is being discontinued, perhaps Stirling Naked and Smooth (unscented) and Stirling Unscented Beeswax would be good choices?

 

[desertcat]

@The Blackadder first of all great username.

Before worrying about buying/trying other products, I’d suggest immediately ceasing the use of alum. If you get small nicks/weepers you can give them a small dab from the block, but I’d stop applying it liberally after the shave.

I’d also suggest not face lathering. When I was just getting started, I had a tendency to lather with a lot of vigor trying to build the necessary aeration/cushion and it was causing a lot of irritation. Try bowl or palm lathering. And consider shooting for a lather texture that’s a bit wetter, drippier, looser. Some members who face lather make more of a glaze, with almost no scrubbing action. That might work too.

How long are these shaves taking? My skin gets bothered when the shave takes too long—beyond 15 minutes sometimes.

Finally I think your whiskers probably need more thorough preparation. A glycerin soap (or any soap really) can help strip the oils and allow more water to penetrate the hairs. This does not mean scrubbing your face with a washcloth—it means allowing time, temperature, and the chemical action of soap to make the cutting business easier.

Finally, not enough can be said about delicate razor handling. Use as little pressure as possible when bringing the blade against the face. This simply takes focus and practice.

If all of the above don’t improve your skin’s reaction, then it’s time to address your products. New soap or different blades might be in order. See if you can get samples from retailers or users on the forum. Best of luck and I hope improvement comes easily.

 

[SalS]

As someone else noted your beard and skin prep is lacking. That really determines how your shave is going to go. I use this product as a general cleaner, exfoliater and toner and it gently removes grime, oil and dead skin cells without a hint of irritation. It is an excellent shave prep. The bottle last months for me.

Glycolic Acid 7% Exfoliating Toner | The Ordinary

The Glycolic Acid 7% Exfoliating Toner is an alpha hydroxy acid that exfoliates the skin for improved skin radiance and visible clarity.

theordinary.com

I really doubt yours issues are related to a dirty razor btw. I think if you prep better and use a top quality brushless cream you will see a dramatic improvement so long as you shaving carefully and only use enough pressure to get the job done.

 

[Dtownvino]

I am very empathetic to this. I have folliculitis and psoriasis. There is already great info here. I’ll add what works for me.

Ethos Tibu Sabuni is my number one shave cream, but I can use most Ethos shave soaps in S and F base.

I like blue Dawn dish soap for washing my razors followed by a microfiber cloth.

I always cork and palm strop a blade. That should remove any burrs. I the alcohol dip before my first shave. Blades are user dependent and my beard is likely more coarse than yours from your description.

70% alcohol dip (or spray if you have a bottle) after each shave.

I can now shave pretty much irritation free unless I do something foolish. It took me years to get here.

Razor matters a lot too. I do best with things like the Blackland Blackbird Lite, Karve Overlander, etc… some blade exposure and not a huge gap.

Good luck, keep us posted.

Tibu Sabuni Vegan Shave Crème

This is our new Skin Beneficial Vegan Shave Crème that contains our EOS Complex which is a unique blend of 36 luxurious, exotic and beneficial skincare ingredients that enhance the skin's overall condition and feel with continuous use.

ethosgroomingessentials.com

Blackbird Lite

The Blackbird Lite is the toned down version of the Blackbird with half the blade feel for a gentler experience. Machined from stainless steel to shave closer and smoother. Proudly made in the USA.

www.blacklandrazors.com

The Overlander

Our newest safety razor, the Overlander is designed to be versatile and intuitive to use. The Overlander shares the same handle thread and diameter as the Christopher Bradley, so handles and stands are interchangeable. Handles will be available separately in the near future.

karveshaving.com

 

[The Blackadder]

I would change a few things and see if it helps. First prep your face with witch hazel or a very diluted apple cider vinegar like 4 parts water 1 part ACV. Either will clean your beard of oil and wax that prevent water from penetrating the hair. Use warm water not cold. Ditch the brush. It really isn’t necessary given the incredibly slick no brush creams like Kiehl’s Sensitive or Jack Black. They give better performance anyway without subjecting your skin to drying soap and the friction of the brush. I would finish only with pure aloe vera gel not aloe vera lotion and thats its. My two cents.

I might try some warm water shaves in the future, but cold water has really been helpful lately. I usually get inflammation from warm-hot water. Will try some brushless shaves, thanks

Before worrying about buying/trying other products, I’d suggest immediately ceasing the use of alum. If you get small nicks/weepers you can give them a small dab from the block, but I’d stop applying it liberally after the shave.

Thank you, I’ve just stopped using the alum

I’d also suggest not face lathering. When I was just getting started, I had a tendency to lather with a lot of vigor trying to build the necessary aeration/cushion and it was causing a lot of irritation. Try bowl or palm lathering. And consider shooting for a lather texture that’s a bit wetter, drippier, looser. Some members who face lather make more of a glaze, with almost no scrubbing action. That might work too.

I’m transitioning to bowl lathering, but I’ll confess I’m having problems getting the right consistency. Just found a great tutorial on YouTube, will try it in my next shave

How long are these shaves taking? My skin gets bothered when the shave takes too long—beyond 15 minutes sometimes.

Unfortunately, something like 20 minutes. I’m really new and I really can’t rush things. I just ordered a Henson razor, that might help with lack of technique and time.

I remember in some of my best shaves, I just rubbed the soap puck on my face (Taconic lime, glycerin) and face lathered. Was also very fast. I switched because the lime in my soap was bothering a bit my skin. Might revisit this method again in the future

 

[Doc Dan]

Another thought occurs to me (do everything one change at a time till it is right, not all at once) is that a softer synthetic brush may be what is called for. I like the Mühle Silvertip Fiber from Rudy Vey. However, Yaqi and other have inexpensive very soft brushes such as a cashmere knot or plissoft. I am not certain, but they would definitely be easy on the skin and hypoallergenic.

 

[SalS]

@The Blackadder I have a Henson medium, its my only razor and it will be unless Henson does a stainless. You will like it. The RK blades they carry are excellent blades.

 

[The Blackadder]

Another thought occurs to me (do everything one change at a time till it is right, not all at once) is that a softer synthetic brush may be what is called for. I like the Mühle Silvertip Fiber from Rudy Vey. However, Yaqi and other have inexpensive very soft brushes such as a cashmere knot or plissoft. I am not certain, but they would definitely be easy on the skin and hypoallergenic.

Is it posible to create lather in a bowl and then apply it on your face without using a brush, to discard that factor immediately? I know some have recommended brushless creams, but the truth is I have like 20soaps/creams (TOBS, Stirling, Zingari, Tabac, Cella, RazoRock, Speick, Arko, PAA, A&E, etc), and I don’t want to continue piling up until I discover the true reason of irritation.

In fact, I haven’t shaved in two days and the upper part of my cheekbones itch a bit, kind of a mild rash

 

[DesertIguana]

Is it posible to create lather in a bowl and then apply it on your face without using a brush, to discard that factor immediately? I know some have recommended brushless creams, but the truth is I have like 20soaps/creams (TOBS, Stirling, Zingari, Tabac, Cella, RazoRock, Speick, Arko, PAA, A&E, etc), and I don’t want to continue piling up until I discover the true reason of irritation.

In fact, I haven’t shaved in two days and the upper part of my cheekbones itch a bit, kind of a mild rash

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Looking at the images you posted you beard don’t grow in single direction. Like row of corn in field.

Welcome to my club, if I over do it trying to get super smooth shave in single pass I get irritation.

Maybe you need take it easy, and try two to three passes, with you Razors Weight doing work.

Also hydration, aka drinking lots of water help skin health.

People gave you ideas to try, see what works.

 

[JoWolf]

Is it posible to create lather in a bowl and then apply it on your face without using a brush, to discard that factor immediately? I know some have recommended brushless creams, but the truth is I have like 20soaps/creams (TOBS, Stirling, Zingari, Tabac, Cella, RazoRock, Speick, Arko, PAA, A&E, etc), and I don’t want to continue piling up until I discover the true reason of irritation.

In fact, I haven’t shaved in two days and the upper part of my cheekbones itch a bit, kind of a mild rash

View attachment 1648462

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View attachment 1648465

In fact, I haven’t shaved in two days and the upper part of my cheekbones itch a bit, kind of a mild rash

You are correct in Not shaving irritated skin. The mildest shave would only elevate irritation. This would be an ideal time to try skin conditioning creams. I use Neutrogena Hydro Boost as a night cream When Needed. I also use Neutrogena Hydro Boost as part of my post shave skin nourishment; only if my skin feels on the edge of irritation after the shave. I do not use either on most of my shaves. Point being only use products that have an immediate healing or calming to irritation. If no relief is felt. Throw the product out. It ain’t working.

Most of the shaving sensitive creams and soaps that I tried, never improved my irritation. I would point out that many of us have skin chemistry and needs that are not easily handled by most of the advertised sensitive shave products. Not that they aren’t good, just that they may not work for your skin problems. Around the two year mark in my shaving I threw out every bottle and container with sensitive claims. No relief, no need to finish the container with continued suffering. It can be a long time buying and trying products to help your condition. My best advice don’t waste time on products that don’t work for you. Regardless of how well they work for me. It is expensive, discouraging and disappointing when products specific for sensitive skin don’t help, it can be a long process.

 

[Ron R]

I'm not sure you have mapped your beard grain direction and if not it will help lower or your reduce irritation with any shaving system out there.

Use a sharp blade and try not to over use a blade like some of us do at times. Sharp blade snips the whisker easier and efficiently.

I like to use a dedicated Yaqi 24mm Cashmere synthetic brush and brush wash my whole face with a gentle soap called CeraVe (scentless), 100's of thousands of women and men use it daily for washing their face(gentle on the eyes) and will prep your beard for the shave.
5 to 10 second load on brush is all that is needed and it is unbelievable the lather that it creates with a brush to clean the skin and my skin feels good afterwards. Been using this for at least 4 years. (Optional( , I like to apply a dollop(pea size) of Aloe Vera gel just before applying my shave soap lather to my wet face. Lots of industrial hand soaps are slightly alkaline on the PH scale where CeraVe is more neutral making it a ideal soap for daily use.

You mentioned bowl lathering and I recommend that also to reduce the amount of times you are scrubbing your face with a brush, a 26mm synthetic brush has a luxury cloud like soft tips that should not irritate your skin also.

Stay with your cold water rinses and on final rinse when cleaning soap residual from face I use a warm water rinse to remove the shave soap followed with a cold water rinse, if you enjoy doing that is is more or less your body telling you to keep doing it.
Witch hazel beard cleanse with 16% alcohol is a great alternative to aftershaves if your sensitive to fragrances. Witch hazel has been used for skin problems for decades .

Finally you might not be able to shave against the grain(ATG) like thousands of folks with sensitive folks can not do that.
I will leave a beard map for you and other maybe newbies are reading these helpful suggestions others have mentioned already!
(Old archive photos, print one off )

Have some great shaves!

 

[The Blackadder]

I'm not sure you have mapped your beard grain direction and if not it will help lower or your reduce irritation with any shaving system out there.

I have mapped my face. They follow one “similar” pattern in my checks and face, the neck is a tad more wild, but not so much

with a gentle soap called CeraVe (scentless), 100's of thousands of women and men use it daily for washing their face(gentle on the eyes) and will prep your beard for the shave.
5 to 10 second load on brush is all that is needed and it is unbelievable the lather that it creates with a brush to clean the skin and my skin feels good afterwards. Been using this for at least 4 years. (Optional( , I like to apply a dollop(pea size) of Aloe Vera gel just before applying my shave soap lather to my wet face. Lots of industrial hand soaps are slightly alkaline on the PH scale where CeraVe is more neutral making it a ideal soap for daily use.

I’ve had great results with cerave cream for my body, but I can’t find the bar soap you refer to