I'm sure I'm way behind the curve on this, but I had to share it . . . After years of being disappointed shopping at department stores for my shaving needs, the truth suddenly dawned on me . . Despite their big displays and attentive sales-people and easy accessibility, big department stores like Macy's, Dillard's etc. totally suck in their knowledge and ability to sell aftershave products. l was just in my local Macy's here in the Atlanta area and was greeted by a very refined nice looking gentleman and asked about their aftershaves. According to him they had ton's of aftershaves . . . Here's the problem Their understanding of what an aftershave is . . . is this . . It's simply the same as the cologne only with less alcohol. They know nothing about glycerin, witch hazel, menthol or any of the other skin goodies we men want and need in our aftershaves. I found this in other department stores too. This is amazing. What a huge gap in the marketing process. The only conclusion I can come to is that either most men are totally clueless about shaving or department store chains are missing a huge marketing opportunity by staying ignorant about men's aftershaves.
Department Store fiasco
- Thread starter umgowa997
- Start date
I think most of the reason for it is that they don't train sales staff to educate the public. They hire them to help the customer on a somewhat trivial level and expect the product to sell itself. Which might not be a bad thing. When you think about it, how many people who go shopping want to be educated? How many want to remain ignorant and just want to get what they want to get? I'm guessing the majority.
I didn't know what witch hazel or osage rub were until I joined b&b.
I think this boils down to the 21st century job of the salesperson. I wrote a lengthy paper on this that is soon to be published, but the jist of it is: Before the information age, people were ignorant/uneducated as to product availability, feature, benefits, and options. As a result, part of a salesperson's job was to educate a consumer. Since the information age has allowed consumers unprecedented access to information, opinions, and data on any product that they choose, the role of the salesperson has changed from that of an expert, to simply a manager of transactions. This works for the most part in retail, but a true, professional salesperson, despite this, will be well versed in product.
Probably, most people simply walk into a store, know what they're there for, pick it up, and pay for it. Imagine, if when you went into Macy's how wonderful it would have been if instead of walking you over to show you where you can find your "ole standby" product, the salesperson was on his/her toes and introduced you to something new that you may not have even thought of! Perhaps the product even cost a bit more too, and you take your "ole standby" and the new product. NOW, the store has not only made money on your purchase, they've sold you additional product, you leave smiling, an will more than likely come back for more!
What we have here is a failure to do (proper) business!
Aaron
OK, that was my sales training rant for the day!
Probably, most people simply walk into a store, know what they're there for, pick it up, and pay for it. Imagine, if when you went into Macy's how wonderful it would have been if instead of walking you over to show you where you can find your "ole standby" product, the salesperson was on his/her toes and introduced you to something new that you may not have even thought of! Perhaps the product even cost a bit more too, and you take your "ole standby" and the new product. NOW, the store has not only made money on your purchase, they've sold you additional product, you leave smiling, an will more than likely come back for more!
What we have here is a failure to do (proper) business!
Aaron
OK, that was my sales training rant for the day!
I have my mind made up before entering Macy's. Usually because after sniffing about 5 cologne soaked pieces of paper my nose is numb to all the scents and it's hard to tell the differance. I rely on this forum for advice on aftershave. I was reading a magazine, i belive it was Maxim and they had an article about shaving were they suggested not using aftershave. They made some comment about being your "Grandfather" if you use aftershave. Suits me fine, my Grandfather was a great man. I look forward to being like him! I known it's only Maxim but some people will actually listen to that awful advice.
- Thread starter
- #8
The media has been trying to engineer men's personal grooming habits for years . . They essentially view us as sheep willing to follow any cue we read in their vaunted publications or hear via their networks. I remember a time when they actually tried to get men to wear makeup and came out with statements like "This is the new wave in men's grooming . . make-up". Men were not about to be lead around by their noses then nor are they now. The idea of skipping aftershave? Unthinkable. To not have that exhilerating, bracing splash of alcohol, and menthol after shaving? Dream on.
I think the person in the fragrance department equates AS as a cologne that has been watered down. I don't think you will ever see a department store giving up space to sell a Thayers product when they can get hefty profit margins selling what they do now.
My feeling is that department store customers shopping at the fragrance counter purchase FAR more based on scent, than on the healing properties of the product. I don't have any scientific basis for this, just my opinion.
Remember, the same guy/girl that's purchasing department store AS probably shaves with canned goo. So you give them a "designer" scent, put it in a fancy bottle, price it accordingly and you have 99% of the products in a department store.
Beerman
Remember, the same guy/girl that's purchasing department store AS probably shaves with canned goo. So you give them a "designer" scent, put it in a fancy bottle, price it accordingly and you have 99% of the products in a department store.
Beerman
Here in the UK I'd say that the majority of aftershaves are bought by women for their partners, and it pretty much all about the scent, with a passing nod to skin care - and women know a lot more about moisturisers and squat abut splashing alcohol on their faces. I recently PIF'd a vintage bottle of Denim AS to a colleague because he said...
a. he'd forgotten how cool the bottle is
b. his wife keeps buying him 'Joop and s**t'
He's been wearing it every day since, even though his missus hates it.
a. he'd forgotten how cool the bottle is
b. his wife keeps buying him 'Joop and s**t'
He's been wearing it every day since, even though his missus hates it.
I learned about witch hazel, aloe, and lots of good inexpensive aftershaves from my Grandfather. My Dad did not use any of those products after he got used to minimal shaving in the Navy. If not for my Grandpa introducing me, and B&B continuing the education, I would not be aware of how to shave well.
- Thread starter
- #13
You bring up a very good point . . . I think the knowledge of how to shave well is kind of a lost art. It's getting revived a bit through forums like B&B, but that's a fraction of the population. I've been thinking a lot lately about getting my son (who shaves) and my nephews (who also shave) and putting them by a sink and mirror and having them shave with my products and telling them what I know. I'll bet they'd be blown away.
yes, there is nothing much of interest in your mall department store.. product wise or peoplewise..
Yeah, salespeople pretty much know squat when it comes to the products. I went into a high end store just to see if they had any real shaving creams or soaps such as TOBS or T&H and such. All the saleslady had that she thought was supposed to be great was LAB Series products. I tried to explain exactly what I was looking for and she couldn't understand what I was talking about. Fortunately there was a L'Occitane store nearby so I went and bought another puck of Cade.
I had a somewhat similar experience while reading GQ about three months ago; their grooming editor/expert basically stated that aftershaves were only used by "old" people and are useless. He encouraged readers to wear cologne instead. I couldn't believe what I was reading.
I think you're probably accurate with both conclusions. I rarely used any sort of AS before a buddy got me started with a DE and some real shaving products. It was then that I sat down, surfed quite a bit, found B&B, and started educating myself.
<rant>Flash forward to a week ago and I find myself in Nordstrom. I was greeted by a nice enough woman who, when I asked about aftershave balms, asked what kind of cologne scent I like so that she could sell me the set. She wasn't able to give me any information at all about what balms they had that might have better than average healing and conditioning properties.
When I wasn't buying anything quickly enough, I was handed off to a gorgeous blonde, probably in her early 20's, with an accent from Eastern Europe. Her expert sales tactic was to hand me a couple of cards with different colognes sprayed on them, then put her hand on my arm and tell me, "I would love this one on you."
I walked. What you're telling me is, I'm not in your league (which I wasn't), so you think I have such a low opinion of myself that a sad line like that would coax my wallet out of my pocket. A little flattery is OK, I suppose, but come on. I was not impressed. I'll stick to doing my own research, get samples where I can, and purchase online from a vendor that is part of this community, where I'll be happy to part with my money.</rant>
Sad to say, we of such communities as this are not the typical target market of the majority of department stores. Ours is a niche interest and best served by niche products from niche suppliers - all of which have been greatly enabled in recent years by the rise of the teh Interwebs.
Let's face it guys - until and unless there is a shaving revolution, driven by P&G/Gillette as market leader, we must frequent, generally, non-mainstream suppliers.
Talking about Cologne/EDT - my favorite was Liz Claiborne for men (green bottle, square red top) but I haven't seen that in a few years (edit: doh! SWMBO sez Perfumania).
Let's face it guys - until and unless there is a shaving revolution, driven by P&G/Gillette as market leader, we must frequent, generally, non-mainstream suppliers.
Talking about Cologne/EDT - my favorite was Liz Claiborne for men (green bottle, square red top) but I haven't seen that in a few years (edit: doh! SWMBO sez Perfumania).
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I am sorry to say that I don't think that things will change anytime soon. The shaving market is dominated by Gillette/Schick and their tactics are to sell cheap razors with expensive cartridges. The canned goo and aftershaves they make are mass market, high margin products that are geared to be part of a "system" to be sold to the consumer. Buy our razor, carts, goo and aftershave, and you are set. Most men are clueless, as was I, about what constitutes a good shave, meaning proper prep., lather, razor, blade, and post shave. If I had not stumbled onto B&B, I would have remained part of that crowd. The department stores are merely selling higher priced versions of junk. Besides, the prices are absurd. A department store balm can easily cost $40.00, and it has little in the way of goodies. Some of our niche companies, like SCS, make a great product for $10.00 that really works. That's the way it is, as marketing is the name of the game.
My barber tells me of a day where you would get a haircut and a singe. The idea was, after you got your haircut essential oils would leak out of the end of your hair so thet would singe your hair to sort of cauterize the wound so to speak. I'll bet it smelled funky in that barbershop after a long day.
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