Deep rock coticule?

[gumbo]

So I picked up a Pearlduck Deep Rock coti this week, just came in this morning so I haven't had a chance to lap or use it yet. It's a 5x2.5 natural combo.
I was wondering if anyone has any experience with them. I've seen a couple posts on other sites but not much with regard to how they compare to other stones. I know they are quite rare and so I'm not expecting a ton of replies, but someone who has actually used one want to chime in?

 

[Obiwan]

No first hand experience, but I'd love to see a pic when you get a chance?

 

[BakerAndBadger]

Pics or we won't believe you!!!

 

[Doc226]

 

[gary haywood]

i've used one and they are no differant to any other coticule i used ....Just the name not sure why there callaed old rock or deep rock nice stones that were selected for razors ....
gary

 

[gumbo]

i've used one and they are no differant to any other coticule i used ....Just the name not sure why there callaed old rock or deep rock nice stones that were selected for razors ....
gary

Gary, the old rock/deep rock stones were chosen as the top quality of all coticules at the time of sale. They are in fact "different" than other coticules, whether or not they are better finishers, faster cutters, more consistent, better looking, etc. is unknown, but they were for sure more expensive than all others at the time, and significantly so.
I know you mentioned you haven't found a difference, but I also know several people with experience with them have found them to be superior if not the best they have used. I'm not experienced enough to do a side-by-side comparison without adding extraneous variables, but I just wanted to let you know that they are in fact different.

Here's proof during WWI

 

[gumbo]

Here's pictures for those that were asking - Also I can say that of the 6 cotis I own, it is the first that literally "sparkles". I don't know if that's garnets or whatever, but it definitely has a ton of crystals in it.

 

[Legion]

That looks like a very nice stone, and I love the box.

The old rock stones of the old days where chosen partly for their appearance, they are a uniform colour, with no marks and inclusions, and partly for their speed. A barber who had customers waiting would find value in a rock that didn't take a long time to fix the edge. This may or may not be an advantage to you, as the faster stones often tend to auto slurry, making it a little harder to get that final degree of sharpness.

 

[Wid]

View attachment 294028

I'll take a few dozen at them prices

 

[Obiwan]

I know, right.

 

[gumbo]

Yeah 10 inches to boot! A dozen 10 inch old rocks please.
And thanks Wid for that info. I have to lacquer the label before I use it. Ill let you know if it auto slurries.

 

[Redhead]

I have an old rock extra extra coticule that might be similar to yours. Mine is a perfect soft creamy yellow and is very very dense. I have not weighed it but it is heavy for its size! These were meant to put the final edge on a razor. You will have to experiment to get the best edge. This is how mine works: Take the label off or use another blue if you have one and do a small pyramid to get a sharp edge. Then you can try the following; watery lather, oil, small amount of water or completely dry for 8-12 laps on the yellow, if you do too many and lose the edge go back to the blue (can also use lather) test edge for sharpness then back to yellow but don't over do it. Apparently these were popular with professional barbers as touch up hones that can be used quickly(like barber hone). Good luck
Red

 

[Doc226]

Using an inflation calculator the $60 from the start of WWI in 1914 in todays money it would be $1327

http://www.westegg.com/inflation/

Gotta remember $60 in the early 1900 was a LOT of money

 

[gumbo]

Still, get me a dozen 10 inch deep rock coticules for 1327 and I'm down!

 

[gary haywood]

Gary, the old rock/deep rock stones were chosen as the top quality of all coticules at the time of sale. They are in fact "different" than other coticules, whether or not they are better finishers, faster cutters, more consistent, better looking, etc. is unknown, but they were for sure more expensive than all others at the time, and significantly so.
I know you mentioned you haven't found a difference, but I also know several people with experience with them have found them to be superior if not the best they have used. I'm not experienced enough to do a side-by-side comparison without adding extraneous variables, but I just wanted to let you know that they are in fact different.

Here's proof during WWI
View attachment 294028

this topic as come up before and i gaurantee the old rock is like any other coticule . mine was exactly the same as yours in apearance ... You can buy nower days standard coticule salect coticule kosher grade coticule . standard being the cheapest kosher being the most expensive..You pay for the look . standard as more inclusions etc while kosher has pure creamy plain surface .. the performance and resulting shaving edge is no differant.. bart would explain way better than me..i asked same question a very long time ago..

i have been a barber for 25 years my freind is a barber he's 81 years old him and his dad used a little coticule fior maintaining razors.. barbers hone don't compare to a coticule they cut way quiker than any coticule and they were used for quik touch ups coticules would of been used in between customers by the aprentise if he was a dab hand with his x stroke . old rocks are nice to have and have god collectable value but the extra dollars would of been for looks ...my favourite coticule is my standard 150x40mm la vainette ..

why is it nower days we have to pay more for certain layers ie la vainette doubled in price as did la patite blanches at one point la grosse blanches were on the rise ... i have used loads of coticules and they all do the same job and produce same shaving edge .. My old rock was no differant infact i preferd my la vainette .

 

[gary haywood]

this is mine it was only 4x2 and it was old rock extra extra fine .. nice creamy soft surface ..

 

[gumbo]

this topic as come up before and i gaurantee the old rock is like any other coticule . mine was exactly the same as yours in apearance ... You can buy nower days standard coticule salect coticule kosher grade coticule . standard being the cheapest kosher being the most expensive..You pay for the look . standard as more inclusions etc while kosher has pure creamy plain surface .. the performance and resulting shaving edge is no differant.. bart would explain way better than me..i asked same question a very long time ago..

i have been a barber for 25 years my freind is a barber he's 81 years old him and his dad used a little coticule fior maintaining razors.. barbers hone don't compare to a coticule they cut way quiker than any coticule and they were used for quik touch ups coticules would of been used in between customers by the aprentise if he was a dab hand with his x stroke . old rocks are nice to have and have god collectable value but the extra dollars would of been for looks ...my favourite coticule is my standard 150x40mm la vainette ..

why is it nower days we have to pay more for certain layers ie la vainette doubled in price as did la patite blanches at one point la grosse blanches were on the rise ... i have used loads of coticules and they all do the same job and produce same shaving edge .. My old rock was no differant infact i preferd my la vainette .

So you're saying, in a nutshell, that all coticules perform at the same speed and can all leave the same finish?
I appreciate your comment Gary, but I really find that hard to believe. I only have a handful of cotis and to me, they all perform differently. I understand the concept of cognitive dissonance (I am, after all, a psychologist) but the differences between them are striking, and it can't just be made up in my head.
I used the deep rock last night, and it was a very fast cutter. I set the bevel on my diamondine in about 15 minutes, without slurry. I've never been able to do that with any of my other stones. It took some pressure a la pacocot, but it swarfed very fast without autoslurry.
2 of my stones definitely autoslurry, and another of my natural combos similar to the Salm rocks posted by sham et al really is only good to polish.
I don't believe they all act the same, and physics would tell me that to be true too - garnets come in various sizes with various facet characteristics (acute, obtuse, etc.), and would therefore cut differently.
Then again, this really is the "how many licks does it take to get to the tootsie roll center of a tootsie pop" question...there's no way to control all the variables, unless we build a honing machine and use the exact same razor with the exact same bevel on the exact same stone, etc.
The world may never know.

Beautiful stone by the way.

 

[gary haywood]

I'm not saying all coticules are the same speed with slurry. we all no that use them some are fast some are moderate and some are slower some are extremly fast and can set bevels and even remove nicks . with water some are slow some are very slow .. are you asking if the deep rock can produce a nicer edge than the other stones as in other coticules ? If so then using the dilucot method which i use with all my coticules the shaves i get are all typical nice buttery smooth finished edge that i could hardly tell apart.. the differances could be down to the user . a maxed out coticule edge feels all the same to me compared to my old rock i did'nt notise any beter quality in the shave it self.. if thats what you were asking thats my experiance using the coticule s with dilucot method. i have guys send me razors to test for them and there razors shave just as typical coticule edge nice and smooth.. emanuel has vintage old rock and la vainette and side by side they both deliver the same shave qulity . there are some coticules that are more difficult to reach the desired keeness for some honers but once they get there the shave is normaly very rewarding and smooth, so in a nut shell i'm saying my old rock was not better than my other coticules i have and have used ...

the differance with slurry can be very differant but the finished edge is pritty much the same for me at one point the finished edges were described as eith mellow , brisk or engaging i find my edges to be mellow thats the only way i can describe the feel while shaving and very skin freindly which is what a coticule edge is renowed for ....
regards gary

 

[Disburden]

I have five of them. They are very good coticules, I use circles on them because they are smaller sized.
usually they are faster stones on both slurry and water.

I collect these and old rock coticules.

 

[gumbo]

I have five of them. They are very good coticules, I use circles on them because they are smaller sized.
usually they are faster stones on both slurry and water.

I collect these and old rock coticules.

FIVE!?!?!?

That's fantastic man, I'm in love with this stone already, I can't imagine having 5 of them.