Castle Forbes Identity Crisis!!!!

[strat1117]

I recently had the good fortune to receive a sample of Castle Forbes Lavender Essential Oil Shave Cream with my order from the good folks at Vintage Blades LLC. Without question, this is an absolutely wonderful product.

However, it left me wondering whether it was properly described as a cream, in that, to me, it seemed more like a soft soap.

So what's the deal with this stuff -- is it a soap or is it a cream? Inquiring minds want to know!!

 

[Jim]

Well there was a time when all creams were soft soaps. The alkalizing agent used dictated the end product-a hard soap or a soft soap.
Today cosmetic-ized creams are not saponified but are mixed in a lab with god knows what.

Check out the wiki on soap making for a terrific page of info.

 

[jonnyt]

Its a cream in that you can dip your finger in and scoop some out (with a bit of effort...) and it does behave like an extremely viscous liquid (stand your tub on it's side and check back a day later). But as far as lather making is concerned, I treat it like my soaps, ie, run my brush over the top for 20 to 30 swirls before mixing up lather. The only other creams I have that are similar in hardness are Acqua di Parma and Santa Maria Novella. These three take much longer than any other creams I own to pick up and mix product, but they are all worth the wait...

 

[mretzloff]

Cream! Castle Forbes, Santa Maria Novella, Celle, etc. are all creams, not soft soaps.

 

[mretzloff]

are mixed in a lab with god knows what.

True. Half the stuff on the ingredients lists for both creams and soaps is really surprising.

 

[strat1117]

Its a cream in that you can dip your finger in and scoop some out (with a bit of effort...) and it does behave like an extremely viscous liquid (stand your tub on it's side and check back a day later). But as far as lather making is concerned, I treat it like my soaps, ie, run my brush over the top for 20 to 30 swirls before mixing up lather. The only other creams I have that are similar in hardness are Acqua di Parma and Santa Maria Novella. These three take much longer than any other creams I own to pick up and mix product, but they are all worth the wait...

This is really what I was getting at. I used it like a cream -- taking a little almond-sized chunk and mixing it in a bowl. But, while I ended up with TONS of gorgeous lather, most of the chunk was still siting in the bowl. that's what made me think that, notwithstanding it being called a cream, this stuff behaves more like a soap!

I like it!

 

[MikeLip]

This is really what I was getting at. I used it like a cream -- taking a little almond-sized chunk and mixing it in a bowl. But, while I ended up with TONS of gorgeous lather, most of the chunk was still siting in the bowl. that's what made me think that, notwithstanding it being called a cream, this stuff behaves more like a soap!

I like it!

Yup. Use it as a soap.

Thing is, the next day the top layer is pretty much a real cream from the water you got on it the day before. So loading up is easier. CF rocks. There is nothing like it.

 

[mammoo]

I'm sure on the packaging for CF it says to not soak your brush so that you can give it a good scrub like you would with a soap. It's definitely a cream but it behaves much more like a soap. It also means it lasts much longer than other creams.

 

[SJBFIRE]

This is really what I was getting at. I used it like a cream -- taking a little almond-sized chunk and mixing it in a bowl. But, while I ended up with TONS of gorgeous lather, most of the chunk was still siting in the bowl. that's what made me think that, notwithstanding it being called a cream, this stuff behaves more like a soap!

I like it!

I was given the travel size tub of this stuff from ClassicShaving and ran into the same chunk problem when added to my brush. My solution was to run the brush over the top 20-30 times like other people are doing with it. I would compare the consistency to the Proraso/Omega soaps in the tubs. This stuff is a great creme but I cant see spending the going rate for a full sized tub.

 

[HoratioCaine]

Cream! Castle Forbes, Santa Maria Novella, Celle, etc. are all creams, not soft soaps.

And yet, the Santa Maria Novella is basically a variation on the stuff in the Proraso tub, which they call a soap. Go figure.

But yeah, CF is a cream, and one of the more annoying ones to have to contend with, imo. I'm not saying it's not great - it is - but I find it much more tricky to deal with. I have yet to find a truly satisfying way to work it. As you noted, trying to scoop out a dollop and bowl lather it leaves you with wasted product. Trying to scoop out a dollop, place it in the brush, and face lather with it (like I do with all my other creams) is a joke. That leaves the soap method. As noted, this can change the consistency of the cream over time, due to the exposure of the cream to the moisture in the brush. If this change happens soon (say, the next day, as elsehwere noted), it's a good bet your brush is too wet to begin with. Shaking out the brush well, and inverting the tub (i.e., turning it upside down) while working the brush over the cream, can help prevent an unwanted flood of water into the cream. But even at that, I've noticed a change in the consistency of the cream over time. This issue keeps me from using it more often than I otherwise might. That, and I prefer Trumper anyway, chemicals and laboratory concocting notwithstanding.

 

[kingfisher]

...
But yeah, CF is a cream, and one of the more annoying ones to have to contend with, imo. I'm not saying it's not great - it is - but I find it much more tricky to deal with. I have yet to find a truly satisfying way to work it. As you noted, trying to scoop out a dollop and bowl lather it leaves you with wasted product. Trying to scoop out a dollop, place it in the brush, and face lather with it (like I do with all my other creams) is a joke. That leaves the soap method.....

Not so fast, Horatio. There is one other option available, and for me (in my limited experience with CF Lime) it's the one that works best.

Take out said dollop as though you were going to bowl lather. It doesn't have to be much. Rub it only your beard with your fingers, and keep doing so until your stubble breaks up all the clumps and it is pretty evenly spread over your beard (takes about 30-45 seconds). Then, take your brush to it and face lather it. Works great.

 

[strat1117]

Not so fast, Horatio. There is one other option available, and for me (in my limited experience with CF Lime) it's the one that works best.

Take out said dollop as though you were going to bowl lather. It doesn't have to be much. Rub it only your beard with your fingers, and keep doing so until your stubble breaks up all the clumps and it is pretty evenly spread over your beard (takes about 30-45 seconds). Then, take your brush to it and face lather it. Works great.

All I did was rinse off the unused chunk and put it back in with the rest. I even worked it smooth so you can't tell the difference. Based on the sample (which will probably last for months), I ordered a large tub of the CF Lime EO to add to my permanent lineup.

 

[Cuttingboard]

I treat CF like a soap and face lather and its absolutely amazing, well worth the price IMHO. Great thick slick lather that never fails to impress me every morning.

 

[TorzJohnson]

Not so fast, Horatio. There is one other option available, and for me (in my limited experience with CF Lime) it's the one that works best.

Take out said dollop as though you were going to bowl lather. It doesn't have to be much. Rub it only your beard with your fingers, and keep doing so until your stubble breaks up all the clumps and it is pretty evenly spread over your beard (takes about 30-45 seconds). Then, take your brush to it and face lather it. Works great.

+1 This is the same method I use.

 

[HoratioCaine]

Not so fast, Horatio. There is one other option available, and for me (in my limited experience with CF Lime) it's the one that works best.

Good call. Would you believe I actually tried that one too? Really, I did; I'm not just saying that to make myself look smart. I just forgot about it, because I only did it once. You're right, it works, but it wasn't my cup of tea. Maybe I'm lazy, or I'm just spoiled by the softness of the English creams, which face-lather beautifully without a bunch of different methods to make them work.

I certainly don't want to slag CF creams, though. I was one of their biggest champions back in the day, and still highly recommend them. They are exceedingly high quality, and even though they're not actually made in the castle anymore, they are still very much part of a small business operation all overseen directly by Andrew French, the man who originally created them. For some, the difficulty in lathering them could actually be seen as endearing, a by-product of their unique nature. Here's a little piece of trivia: French only buys lavender essential oil for the CF cream from producers who grow their own lavender and extract the oil themselves. This, he says, ensures the highest quality in the oil, and accounts for why it smells so darn good.

 

[Torcams]

I had a similar crisis and issue with CF. I ended up with my new standard method based on feedback from Jim that works great. Thread here.

 

[strat1117]

Well, I used my new tub of CF lime this morning. I just treated it as if it was a soft soap; that is, I soaked my brush first, and then swirled it over the top of the tub a few times before face lathering. Absolutely superb results. One of the most satisfying shave experiences I have had to date (and, astonishingly, it didn't include tallow)!

This stuff is so good it could make me rethink everything.

 

[Phog Allen]

Well, I used my new tub of CF lime this morning. I just treated it as if it was a soft soap; that is, I soaked my brush first, and then swirled it over the top of the tub a few times before face lathering. Absolutely superb results. One of the most satisfying shave experiences I have had to date (and, astonishingly, it didn't include tallow)!

This stuff is so good it could make me rethink everything.

Hi Neil. Glad you discovered CF lavender. And what I emboldened on the quotes is quite true. It is the only brand of cream I keep around. It is the best shave cream I have ever used. I have a jar of it and it is almost gone. My jar of lavender is like yours. Very dense and it is easier to use it like a hard soap. This is why it has lasted me YEARS in a large-ish rotation of hard soaps. No need to dig it out of the jar and try to get that dense little piece lathered up. Besides, CF is so danged efficacious you only use about 1/8-1/4 teaspoon for each shave. It still makes a mountain of lather. My jar of Cedarwood/Sandalwood is not nearly as dense as the lavender but I still carefully lather it from the jar. Works great.

Regards, Todd