Witch Hazel Question
- Thread starter GMen
- Start date
Thanks all! I figured as much, just wanted to be sure.
This thread needs more bacon goodness!
Ammonium chloride. AKA sal ammoniac, is a relatively benign solid that is used as a solder flux (available in just about any hardware store), cattle feed supplement, in medicine and cosmetics, and as a flavoring in vodka and liquorice. It is not a gas. It is formed by the reaction of ammonia with hydrogen chloride (the gas that forms hydrochloric acid when dissolved in water).
When you mix chlorine bleach and ammonia the primary gases produces are chlorine gas and nitrogen trichloride, both highly toxic when inhaled in large (or even small) quantities.
Not to beat a dead horse but this is exactly the type of chemical misinformation that started this thread in the first place. (The question of what is an alcohol and is is present in a steam distillate).
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I apologise in advance if my take on this is incorrect, but it seems to me that this whole discussion revolves around a definition laid down by the US Federal Governmentor, worse still, the dreaded FDA? I hate to throw fat on the fire, but I've found Thayer's Witch Hazel products to work tremendously well, and I couldn't care less if the US government considers them genuine or not.
Bacon?
More like melted plastic to me. Every time I crack open my store-brand bottle, I envision a lighter going to my Lego men. Ugh.
I'll take the fake Thayer's please.
More like melted plastic to me. Every time I crack open my store-brand bottle, I envision a lighter going to my Lego men. Ugh.
I'll take the fake Thayer's please.
Hi, everyone! I found an article on witch hazel distillation that I thought might be of some interest?
http://www.topical-formulations.com/topical/200502/natural.htm
Also, here is an MSDS for Witch Hazel Distillate, BA.
http://www.whazel.eu/BA.pdf
I make no claims of any of this being about genuine witch hazel or of any expert knowledge on the subject.
Stuart
http://www.topical-formulations.com/topical/200502/natural.htm
Also, here is an MSDS for Witch Hazel Distillate, BA.
http://www.whazel.eu/BA.pdf
I make no claims of any of this being about genuine witch hazel or of any expert knowledge on the subject.
Stuart
I'm not arguing or trying to make any point. I merely presented an article that I thought would be of interest. If information is not welcome, I will delete my post. I make no claim that the article is about genuine witch hazel as previously defined in this thread.
Stuart
Stuart
+1I apologise in advance if my take on this is incorrect, but it seems to me that this whole discussion revolves around a definition laid down by the US Federal Governmentor, worse still, the dreaded FDA? I hate to throw fat on the fire, but I've found Thayer's Witch Hazel products to work tremendously well, and I couldn't care less if the US government considers them genuine or not.
I love my Thayer's Alcohal Free Cucumber witch hazel stuff. It seems to moiusturize my face better than anything except for Arko aftershave lotion.
How well does Dickensons or or real Witch Hazels moisturize the face? I have used it in the past for a skin cleanser but do not recall it's moisturizing properties.
i agree supernaut. i use the "real" witch hazel as a vehicle in inks and yes it does smell like burnt plastic!!! who would put that on their face! i'll stick with the fake thayer's as well!
I have just spent the better part of my morning reading every word on the preceding 9 pages and have concluded this:
I shant commence with the giving up of inebriation for lent as I do not wish to remove the antimicrobial and disinfectant properties inherent in my daily alcohol enjoyment.
That said, why do I never feel better when inebriating myself during a cold/flu bout?
By the way...
I use witch hazel not as an aftershave, but rather to triumph over the wrath set forth in Malleus Maleficarum.
You have been warned...
I shant commence with the giving up of inebriation for lent as I do not wish to remove the antimicrobial and disinfectant properties inherent in my daily alcohol enjoyment.
That said, why do I never feel better when inebriating myself during a cold/flu bout?
By the way...
I use witch hazel not as an aftershave, but rather to triumph over the wrath set forth in Malleus Maleficarum.
You have been warned...
It seems to me we have some crossed wires.
Most plants have natural levels of alcohol, I don't see anybody confused or not understanding this.
The FDA definition of Witch Hazel that complys with it being a DRUG requires it to have 14% alcohol, that is clear.
I think the debate/argument is whether or not Witch Hazel that is recovered via means other than those that require adding alcohol, has the same effects as the 14% alcohol version.
Now presumably they didn't steam distill Witch Hazel thousands of years ago, so that obviously points to there still being benefits to adding undistilled/alcohol free/naturally recovered Witch Hazel to products.
I think the question should really be how more or less effective is one than the other, and whether the added benefits of say, the added alcohol, out-weigh the benefits of not dousing your face in burning alcohol.
Edit: damn it, just spotted how old the thread is. Sorry.
Most plants have natural levels of alcohol, I don't see anybody confused or not understanding this.
The FDA definition of Witch Hazel that complys with it being a DRUG requires it to have 14% alcohol, that is clear.
I think the debate/argument is whether or not Witch Hazel that is recovered via means other than those that require adding alcohol, has the same effects as the 14% alcohol version.
Now presumably they didn't steam distill Witch Hazel thousands of years ago, so that obviously points to there still being benefits to adding undistilled/alcohol free/naturally recovered Witch Hazel to products.
I think the question should really be how more or less effective is one than the other, and whether the added benefits of say, the added alcohol, out-weigh the benefits of not dousing your face in burning alcohol.
Edit: damn it, just spotted how old the thread is. Sorry.
Wow, I'm affraid you're WRONG, WRONG SOOOOOOO WRONG!!!
Witch hazel (hamamilis virginianna) is called just that, weather it's a liquid product or not! I distill AND use my own w/h product. It's not the alchohol that makes it astringent, it's the phyto-chemicals. My product is every bit and maybe more astringent as Dickinson's (sp) with alchohol! Your advice to people is misleading and incorrect.
They use alchohol in there processing because they harvest in winter, when it's easy to harvest, there are NO leaves! The plant flowers in winter and leaves out in spring (old timers call it "winterbloom"). Also, Dickinson's crews clear cut entire creek beds of "brush" and skid it out, just like lumber (thus disturbing the entire surounding eco-system). My product contains no alchohol, why does it work so well on my "roids"? It doesn't sting or burn, it just sooths and cools and shrinks the "roids".
Oh btw, "Now presumably they didn't steam distill Witch Hazel thousands of years ago", They made a tea! Like, DUH! Do the research. Alchohol is the preservative, it also helps in recovery of phyto-chemicals that are dormant in the winter.
I distill FRESH leaves and twigs, that way the plant is live and vital when it goes into the still. It produces a "WITCH HAZEL" that is natural, alchohol free!!! and works, I mean, REALLY works! SO, what I figure is this, you work for Dickinson's!
That means you are informed, but that also means you are paid to mis-inform the poor readers of the this forum.
"so that obviously points to there still being benefits to adding undistilled/alcohol free/naturally recovered Witch Hazel to products."
"naturally recovered Witch Hazel" *** is that?
Steam distillation IS the best means to produce a w/h that has all the best natural effects and yes it is still(pardon the pun) all the things they say it is, NO ALCHOHOL, NONE, ZERO, ZILCH, NADA, NIEN. IT DOESN'T NEED IT!
Witch hazel (hamamilis virginianna) is called just that, weather it's a liquid product or not! I distill AND use my own w/h product. It's not the alchohol that makes it astringent, it's the phyto-chemicals. My product is every bit and maybe more astringent as Dickinson's (sp) with alchohol! Your advice to people is misleading and incorrect.
They use alchohol in there processing because they harvest in winter, when it's easy to harvest, there are NO leaves! The plant flowers in winter and leaves out in spring (old timers call it "winterbloom"). Also, Dickinson's crews clear cut entire creek beds of "brush" and skid it out, just like lumber (thus disturbing the entire surounding eco-system). My product contains no alchohol, why does it work so well on my "roids"? It doesn't sting or burn, it just sooths and cools and shrinks the "roids".
Oh btw, "Now presumably they didn't steam distill Witch Hazel thousands of years ago", They made a tea! Like, DUH! Do the research. Alchohol is the preservative, it also helps in recovery of phyto-chemicals that are dormant in the winter.
I distill FRESH leaves and twigs, that way the plant is live and vital when it goes into the still. It produces a "WITCH HAZEL" that is natural, alchohol free!!! and works, I mean, REALLY works! SO, what I figure is this, you work for Dickinson's!
That means you are informed, but that also means you are paid to mis-inform the poor readers of the this forum.
"so that obviously points to there still being benefits to adding undistilled/alcohol free/naturally recovered Witch Hazel to products."
"naturally recovered Witch Hazel" *** is that?
Steam distillation IS the best means to produce a w/h that has all the best natural effects and yes it is still(pardon the pun) all the things they say it is, NO ALCHOHOL, NONE, ZERO, ZILCH, NADA, NIEN. IT DOESN'T NEED IT!
Your ideas are intriguing to me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.
Chris, never has so much been said with so little! BRAVO, my friend!!
