Looking forward to the SE comparisons Walt/
McVeyMac Straight Journal
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I hear ya on this one!
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- #1,665
Yesterday I received the V2 SE2 baseplate from ATT. So this morning I did side by side comparison shave of the Asylum RX (4) on the left side of the face, and a V2 ATT SE2 (2) shave on the right side with a Feather Pro blade loaded in each. I had done this comparison when I first got the Asylum RX, comparing it with the V1 SE2. During this initial comparison, I noted that the V1 SE2 with a Pro Super blade installed had a very similar face feel and aggressiveness as did the RX with a Pro blade loaded.
To provide a little background on the V1 SE2, this baseplate was launched by ATT back in the fall of 2016. The first AC SE type that ATT launched was the SE1, which is a closed comb AC type single edge razor. After the launch of the closed comb SE1, ATT released the first version of the SE2, the same type of razor except in an open comb version. Apparently a significant number of people who had purchased the SE1 then also purchased the open comb SE2. The people who had tried both the SE1 had mentioned here and other places that the SE2 shaved very similar to the SE1, and apparently provided ATT with this customer feedback. In response, Stan at ATT redesigned the SE2 to be more aggressive, and to increase the distance between it and the SE1 in the way it shaved. I received the first V1 SE2 in November, and ATT launched the V2 SE2 in mid December. However, by the time I was aware of this new version, more than 30 days had passed and I could not trade my V1 baseplate with a V2. ATT had a used V2 baseplate on their website at a reduced price, so I pulled the trigger on it.
My observation regarding the shave today is that the V2 SE2 loaded with a Pro blade does seem to be slightly less aggressive than the RX when both razors are loaded with Pro Blades. This is not surprising to me as the V1 SE2 was about the same in aggressiveness as the RX when the V1 SE2 was loaded with a Pro Super, and the RX with a pro. The other day was the first day that I shaved with the V1 SE2 using a Pro blade, and I found it to be significantly milder than the same razor loaded with a Pro Super blade, at least to the feel. From what I remember from a couple of days ago, the V1 SE2 loaded with a Pro blade is milder than the V2 SE2, which is what I expect. However, I did not do the side by side yet with these two razors, and I am making this judgment based on memory. For some inexplicable reason, finding the right angle with the SE2 seems to be more intuitive for me than it is with the RX. I have a theory as to why this might be coming from the SE sub-forum. The observation has been made that people coming to the AC style of SE razors with a strong Schick Injector experience prefer the Asylum RX; whereas, people coming to this type of razor from a strong DE background prefer the ATT SE line. Perhaps this is why I find the ATT more intuitive in use as I have not used a Schick Injector since about 1972.
I ended up with a BBS on the ATT V2 SE2 side of the face, and a BBS- on the Asylum RX side of the face. To be fair, the shaves were very close with respect to the result, and I should probably switch sides and repeat the experiment tomorrow. I had no weepers or irritation from either razor. In the end, one needs more experience with both of these razors to really get the maximum performance out of them than I have. It just seems like the ATT SE line appears to be falling into place for me sooner than the RX is. I suspect it is for the injector/DE reasons mentioned. Both of these razors are quality and precise instruments that will last for generations to come, as long as there are blades made to fit them. But from a well thought out design standpoint, the Asylum really does have the edge. I just have not observed any benefit to the additional cost in the resulting shave. It might be there, I just have not realized it yet.
Forgot to add, 8 days with the Arko.
To provide a little background on the V1 SE2, this baseplate was launched by ATT back in the fall of 2016. The first AC SE type that ATT launched was the SE1, which is a closed comb AC type single edge razor. After the launch of the closed comb SE1, ATT released the first version of the SE2, the same type of razor except in an open comb version. Apparently a significant number of people who had purchased the SE1 then also purchased the open comb SE2. The people who had tried both the SE1 had mentioned here and other places that the SE2 shaved very similar to the SE1, and apparently provided ATT with this customer feedback. In response, Stan at ATT redesigned the SE2 to be more aggressive, and to increase the distance between it and the SE1 in the way it shaved. I received the first V1 SE2 in November, and ATT launched the V2 SE2 in mid December. However, by the time I was aware of this new version, more than 30 days had passed and I could not trade my V1 baseplate with a V2. ATT had a used V2 baseplate on their website at a reduced price, so I pulled the trigger on it.
My observation regarding the shave today is that the V2 SE2 loaded with a Pro blade does seem to be slightly less aggressive than the RX when both razors are loaded with Pro Blades. This is not surprising to me as the V1 SE2 was about the same in aggressiveness as the RX when the V1 SE2 was loaded with a Pro Super, and the RX with a pro. The other day was the first day that I shaved with the V1 SE2 using a Pro blade, and I found it to be significantly milder than the same razor loaded with a Pro Super blade, at least to the feel. From what I remember from a couple of days ago, the V1 SE2 loaded with a Pro blade is milder than the V2 SE2, which is what I expect. However, I did not do the side by side yet with these two razors, and I am making this judgment based on memory. For some inexplicable reason, finding the right angle with the SE2 seems to be more intuitive for me than it is with the RX. I have a theory as to why this might be coming from the SE sub-forum. The observation has been made that people coming to the AC style of SE razors with a strong Schick Injector experience prefer the Asylum RX; whereas, people coming to this type of razor from a strong DE background prefer the ATT SE line. Perhaps this is why I find the ATT more intuitive in use as I have not used a Schick Injector since about 1972.
I ended up with a BBS on the ATT V2 SE2 side of the face, and a BBS- on the Asylum RX side of the face. To be fair, the shaves were very close with respect to the result, and I should probably switch sides and repeat the experiment tomorrow. I had no weepers or irritation from either razor. In the end, one needs more experience with both of these razors to really get the maximum performance out of them than I have. It just seems like the ATT SE line appears to be falling into place for me sooner than the RX is. I suspect it is for the injector/DE reasons mentioned. Both of these razors are quality and precise instruments that will last for generations to come, as long as there are blades made to fit them. But from a well thought out design standpoint, the Asylum really does have the edge. I just have not observed any benefit to the additional cost in the resulting shave. It might be there, I just have not realized it yet.
Forgot to add, 8 days with the Arko.
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Ah so - maybe that explains why I was initially somewhat underwhelmed with the Hawk in terms of finding the right angle.
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- #1,668
Today I repeated Yesterday's shave, except that I switched sides on the razor. Today the ATT V2 SE2 (2) was used to shave the left side, and the Asylum RX (4.5) was used to shave the right side. The reason that I did this is that the left side of my face is a bit more challenging than is the right as it has more problem spots. Yesterday I scored the left side at BBS- because of some of those spots.
All in all I will have to say that todays shave, I will have to give the RX side a BBS- score again, and the SE2 side a BBS, but this is splitting hairs (see what I did here
). I think that this result is technique dependent and has nothing to do with the inherent capability of the RX razor. After making this comparison for a second shave, the SE2 is still milder than the RX, but I have had no problem with irritation or weepers with either razor. However, I must concentrate with the XTG pass, especially above the lip, while using the RX to avoid them. It is easier to get too aggressive with the RX than the SE2 in my experience.
These are both fabulous tools and I highly recommend either one if you want a bomb proof razor that will last as many lifetimes as there are as long as blades are being made to fir them. I do like the esthetics and the design of the RX over the SE2, but the SE2 does work very fine for me.
On another note, I went to the grocery store that my wife shops at this morning in search of Williams, and to my surprise they carried it for $0.99 a puck. I picked up some Brut while I was at it
.
All in all I will have to say that todays shave, I will have to give the RX side a BBS- score again, and the SE2 side a BBS, but this is splitting hairs (see what I did here
). I think that this result is technique dependent and has nothing to do with the inherent capability of the RX razor. After making this comparison for a second shave, the SE2 is still milder than the RX, but I have had no problem with irritation or weepers with either razor. However, I must concentrate with the XTG pass, especially above the lip, while using the RX to avoid them. It is easier to get too aggressive with the RX than the SE2 in my experience.These are both fabulous tools and I highly recommend either one if you want a bomb proof razor that will last as many lifetimes as there are as long as blades are being made to fir them. I do like the esthetics and the design of the RX over the SE2, but the SE2 does work very fine for me.
On another note, I went to the grocery store that my wife shops at this morning in search of Williams, and to my surprise they carried it for $0.99 a puck. I picked up some Brut while I was at it
.Excellent comparisons between the two razors Walt, and congrats on finding Williams in a brick and mortar. I have yet to come across one and need to get mine online lol.
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- #1,671
I saw Williams in a Walmart in MD while visiting my son. Walmart has it online for a $1.70 for a single puck. If my grocery store did not stock it, I was going to see if my Walmart stocked it. My grocery store is Wegmans, which is a pretty high end grocery store in the NE that originated in Upstate NY. Interesting that they sell ) $0.71 under Walmart.
I never spent any time in the grocery store looking at their shaving gear lately as I assumed that all they had were cartridge razors (where I used to get my cart blades) and canned goo (where I used to get my shaving cream). I have not looked there in over 2.5 years. They had Williams stacked two high and what looked to be a shelf deep. They also had Van Der Hagen Soap, Brush, and a set containing soap, brush and brush stand. Now that I know this it will be interesting to see how much of the Williams they actually sell in this store.
I have not shaved with Williams since I was a teenager. From what I have read, the scent of the contemporary Williams is the same as the vintage stuff. This was my father's go to shaving soap while I was growing up, so I hope that it is a nostalgic experience for me. I might grate the puck, but I am definitely not going to add fragrance to it. What do you Williams aficionados suggest in that regard?
Wegmans is amazing. I truly miss it.
As always a great read Walt! Glad you found the Williams. I am struggling with it at this point so have no pointers to offer. Sorry.
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- #1,674
I am in Central PA, and the Wegmans here opened in 2002. My son lives in Severn, MD, and they had one open near them about 3 or 4 years ago. They have done a major expansion since 2002, but their quality seems to remain as always.
I'm getting sick of the Arko (not really, but at least I found Williams at a similar price to what I paid for Arko), so I decided it is about time to take the plunge. My wife goes to the grocery store every other week, so that is all a puck has to last. Heck, if I play my cards right, I might actually save money with this wet shaving deal after all
. But that would require that I sell about 25 to 30 razors to work out. And what fun would that be?Walt, For me the best overall lathers I have had is a teaspoon of water on the puck, keep the puck in a mug have the brush just barely damp, load the you know what out of it, then some more add water little by little. I have had the best luck doing the same thing that I do to MWF, or the Pen's soaps. Actually, I load all my soaps this wy and get pretty good results
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- #1,676
Thanks Dave. I use a similar approach except that I use a shake of the saturated brush to bloom the lather. Then load on a brush that has bee shaken dry. The bloom water goes into the scuttle and I build the lather there. I did a test lather tonight, and I got a decent lather that seemed to hold up for the few minutes I waited. It was enough to get a three pass shave.
So the scent of this soap is very reminiscent of the Williams of old. I don't think that the fragrance is as strong as it used to be, but that might be an improvement. Now that the Williams scent is back in the forefront of my olfactory memory, I think I like Arko better
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- #1,678
Straight shave 578 today with the Genco Master Barber again.
We had about 7 inches of wet snow overnight, and I was busy digging out from 06:00 to 10:00. Schools are closed and the University had a delayed start. Working from home today as I cannot afford the commute time with everything I have to do today.
However, I did just get a shave in, and this is my maiden voyage with Williams. I was able to get a very good lather with this soap that held up well on the face, and with only a little whipping came back to life in my scuttle. I am going to rank today as DFS +. there is a problem area where I can discern the essence of whisker.
The Williams performed very well. Not the most pleasant smelling soap in the den, but it doesn't make me puke either. I think I am going to switch back and forth between the cheap soaps that I have in the den. I have Arko loaded in my Ansgar Tolksdorf soap lid that matches my Schwarzweisskeramik scuttle. I placed the Williams puck in a coffee mug that sits on my vanity. I think I will use these two soaps until they are finished. Not sure how long the Williams will last, but I typically get about 2 months out of a stick of Arko smashed into my soap lid. These to soaps should get me to the point where we are starting to get some consistent warm weather around here.
We had about 7 inches of wet snow overnight, and I was busy digging out from 06:00 to 10:00. Schools are closed and the University had a delayed start. Working from home today as I cannot afford the commute time with everything I have to do today.
However, I did just get a shave in, and this is my maiden voyage with Williams. I was able to get a very good lather with this soap that held up well on the face, and with only a little whipping came back to life in my scuttle. I am going to rank today as DFS +. there is a problem area where I can discern the essence of whisker.
The Williams performed very well. Not the most pleasant smelling soap in the den, but it doesn't make me puke either. I think I am going to switch back and forth between the cheap soaps that I have in the den. I have Arko loaded in my Ansgar Tolksdorf soap lid that matches my Schwarzweisskeramik scuttle. I placed the Williams puck in a coffee mug that sits on my vanity. I think I will use these two soaps until they are finished. Not sure how long the Williams will last, but I typically get about 2 months out of a stick of Arko smashed into my soap lid. These to soaps should get me to the point where we are starting to get some consistent warm weather around here.
Then it's going to be in the 50's this weekend! Wacky stuff this winter!
