How do I choose a vintage watch

[strop]

This thread http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showth...ch-Would-Love-Some-Help?p=7533157#post7533157 has some really nice watches! So I don't hijack it, I thought I would start a new one.

As I wander thru the antique stores I frequently see a lot of watches. I know what to look for in razors, pens, and tools, but I've never looked at the watches because I had no idea what to look for. Without joining a watch forum and spending as much time there as here, is there any quick tutorial that can give me a place to start? Brands? Particular writing on the back? Particular features? Thanks.

 

[noelekal]

A vintage watch "in the wild", any vintage watch in the wild, is buying a "pig-in-a-poke."

Unless it is a well-known desirable brand and model of watch or else features a solid gold case then I wouldn't be a buyer for one that wouldn't wind, set, and run. Don't venture into non-running examples of the really desirable ones unless you know them well and they're priced right. Don't venture into solid gold models that won't work unless you can buy them at "melt" value. Don't pay a premium for someone else's "differed maintenance."

If it'll wind, set, and run then buy it right with room to spend to have it serviced. Don't neglect having it serviced after acquisition. Like other collectibles, buy the watch and not the story, either of its ownership history (unless really documented well) or of its service history. If your watchmaker is honest, be prepared for the occasional news that, even though it is running, it's a worn out clunk that's been neglected and run so long that it would cost more to try to repair the worn-out movement than the watch is worth.

For the most part, I avoid any gold-filled or gold-plated watches and certainly no chrome-plated cases. Solid gold or solid stainless steel cases are best if bought right. Rose gold and white gold can be worth a slight premium over yellow gold.

Never assume that the vintage watch will ever be truly waterproof. Even with gaskets and seals changed out, one risks grief and aggravation dunking even a newly serviced vintage watch. To each his own, but I never understood this compulsion to wet ones watch.

Despite the inherent fears that come with buying a vintage watch with unknown service history, they can be pretty sturdy and very dependable once serviced.

Here's an Omega automatic from 1954, before and after. Before photos pulled off the Ebay auction on which I took a chance. This one runs great and looks much better in person than my crummy photos can show. Was purchased on a whim that worked out well. Didn't expect to like it as much as I do. I choose it for wearing more often than I anticipated.

Before









After






A sad early production Zodiac Sea Wolf purchased for cheap and rehab'ed to be a fun weekend or Friday casual watch. Rated for 660 foot depths and with new seals in place, I still won't even wear this one out in the rain without putting it in a pocket.

Before (auction photos)





After




The watch that fired my interest in vintage watches. A 1950s 18-jewel Glycine in its solid 18kt gold case, found in a .50 caliber ammo box full of handloading components, dies, and other shooting supplies given me in the early 1980s. The person giving the ammo box to me didn't want the watch.

 

[strop]

Thanks. How do you know it is solid gold vs gold plate? Will it say?

 

[knlgskr]

Hamilton was probably the best American-made watch; there are many Swiss-made and Omega is one of their best.

 

[noelekal]

Should indicate on the case back. Not all will but if one is able to remove the back it will be found to be there on the inside. Gold ones will have gold hallmarks and the fineness of gold notated, .585 for 14kt, .750 for 18kt. Gold-filled will make mention of that fact, sometimes having the micron thickness of the gold.

 

[noelekal]

A bit more of a "post-graduate" pig-in-a-poke example, this Speedmaster was purchased from a pawn shop in Abilene, Texas for (relatively) cheap and then sent off for service. Turned out to be a solid performer which is just good fortune for me as I was not well-versed on the ins and outs of proper chronograph function which adds a measure of added mechanical complication to the watch. It just "seemed" to all work properly, standing there at the counter in the pawn shop.

We had a light dusting of snow on the day when it came home from being serviced so set it out on the thin coating on the porch steps for this photo.

 

[vanhooglesnort]

Also consider sleeper brands that are high quality but not so iconic. Rolex is great, but not nearly as good as their marketing. Older watches from Eterna, Longines, Bulova, etc. are often great and nearly as often quite reasonably priced.

Always remember when buying vintage to EXPECT the watch to require a service, and to EXPECT to pay a qualified watchmaker for his time. As a hobbiest/watchmaker in training I service my own and I am often purchasing a "just serviced" watch that hasn't been cleaned in 20+ years.

 

[strop]

Thanks for all of your replies. Not sure I would have any idea how to take the back off, especially with the attendant looking over my shoulder!

Is there a ballpark figure as to what it costs to get it back from the watchmaker?

 

[noelekal]

A poor photo of a solid white gold Lucien Piccard automatic from the late 1950s, perhaps early 1960s, this one came back from my watchmaker only today after a basic service which cost $75.

I like my watchmaker. He's reliable, friendly, and gives sound and "timely" advice to someone who is a pretty rank amateur when it comes to watches. His price structure is more than reasonable.

Here's his site.
http://www.paulswatchandclockrepair.com/index.htm

Here's his price list.
http://www.paulswatchandclockrepair.com/brochure/TRIFOLD_NEW-IN.jpg

 

[vanhooglesnort]

That's pretty cheap indeed. With the costs of materials it's hard to imagine he can stay in business at those rates. Nice find!

 

[Curse The Sky]

First, decide what you want. Do you want a mechanical wind-up watch, an automatic (self-winding), or an electronic / quartz? Quartz is usually the most accurate and the cheapest, but lacks the charm of a mechanical / automatic movement.

Next, decide on your budget. There are great vintage examples anywhere from $50 all the way up to six figures. The more you spend, the better the shape a watch should be in, but brand and features will play a huge roll. A solid-gold cased Omega is probably going to fetch $500+ even in shoddy condition.

Next pick some brands you'd like. Your budget should dictate what brands are within your reach. If you want to spend under $100, look into Bulova, Waltham, possibly Elgin, and others. For $100-200, you will start to find some Hamiltons, and maybe a few Longines. Over $200, you might start to find some Omegas, though I really suggest spending $300-400+ to get a better example. Over $500 or so, you'll see nicer Omegas, Breitlings, etc. Over $1500-2000, you'll see Rolex and the like. Spending more doesn't always mean you get a "better" watch - they should all do their job if they're working properly. The quality of the materials, fit, and finish on higher-end watches is almost always better, but probably not hundreds or thousands of dollars "better." You're primarily paying for the rarity and the name.

Next, realize that many, many watches aren't going to be truly original. Most collectors will turn their noses up at anything that has replaced parts (perhaps except for the crystal). If the crown (the part you use to wind the watch) isn't original, if the case isn't original, if the hands aren't original, or if the dial isn't original, you should pay less or avoid it altogether (it's up to you). If the dial is original but it's refinished, pay less. If the dial is original but stained, pay less. If the movement is cobbled together from various parts (often indicated by mis-matched colors on the movement itself - some a bit brighter, some a bit duller, some one shade, some another), it should seriously affect the value. You should make sure to look at the movement (inside mechanism) of the watch and compare it to pictures of the movement from the Internet.

Next, consider the condition of the watch(es) you're looking at. Does it run? Does it keep reliable time? Is the case badly scratched or dented? Is the crown in good condition? Is the crown stem bent? Is the crystal pristine, lightly scratched, or completely shot? Is the dial bright and complete or is it tarnished and missing minute / hour markers or script? Are the hands in good shape? Most importantly, does the movement appear to be clean and free from dust, debris and tarnish?

Finally, realize that if a deal seems too good to be true, it probably is. If someone wants to see you a Rolex for $200, you're probably not the luckiest guy on Earth. Buying a vintage watch - since they're mechanical and prone to issues - is taking a gamble. You could either be getting a great example of history, or you could be buying a piece of junk that will never run right. It's up to how much money you're comfortable taking a chance with. If you're buying on eBay, make sure the listing states whether or not the watch is running and keeping good time. See if they have a return policy. Look for pictures of the movement - if they don't have any GOOD pictures showing the movement, I would personally skip it unless I was only spending $50 or less. Check the movement caliber and serial number to make sure they make sense. Check the case number (often found on the inside of the case back) against images online to see if the case, hands, dial, etc. are period appropriate.