Eating Crow: Coticules.

[Brooksie967]

So. I'll eat crow. I've blasted coticules a lot and said they're not finishers on multiple occasions. Well... after selling all but one of mine, a very clean smooth almost kosher looking natural combo that is quite hard, I've finally figured it out.

I don't spend half an hour doing dilutions drip by drip, that's silly.

Took my Eugenio Hoppe #14 "frog king" and reset a bevel on a 1k chosera, made a thick slurry, worked it until it changed colour.

Then I made a new, less thick slurry and worked that until it changed colour, then did one dilution.

Next: 40 laps on just water and about 40 with dish soap.

HHT-4 the whole way after stropping.

The whole process took abount 15 minutess.

Smooth comfortable shave. Even with the HHT-4 it still felt like it was lacking sharpness but man it was a nice shave and almost 0 burn from alum.

SO, yes..... they can be finishers. There, I said it.

 

[MarkO]

Smooth comfortable shave. Even with the HHT-4 it still felt like it was lacking sharpness but man it was a nice shave and almost 0 burn from alum.

Congrats mate that's typical coti magic, seems needs more keeness but leaves skin as if its not been touched, like when your shaving you have to "push" the blade along a bit.

Enjoy them shaves mate.

Mark

 

[jpcwon]

See? We knew you'd come around!!

 

[Raithskar]

Good Coti edge is very hard to beat. Glad you found the sweet spot Brooksie!

 

[buca3152]

My cotis produce nice edges. Ive been using the chosera 1k then bbw then flip to yellow. Nice sharp edge and smooth. Not like my jnats or suehiro but very good edge. Ive done some off the 10k chosera to yellow. Equally good edges imo.

 

[Brooksie967]

I think I was looking into coticule methods too much. I don't follow any methods other than start at a low grit and move higher and watch for visual/physical signals to tell me when to move on. None of this*_cot stuff just raise slurry and work to water as I felt like it.

The edge feels very strange. Why does a coticule edge that provides hht 4 feel like it's not cutting as well as a jnat edge at hht4? The most noticeable spot is under my chin. Jnat edges fly through that hair, the coticule edge feels like it's tugging and dragging.

At the end of the day the shave result is the same, never BBS due to the most random neck hair growth pattern/jaw line pattern. To get BBS i'd have to shave 10 different directions. BUT DFS for sure.

 

[buca3152]

These stones have similar enough characteristics and produce similar edges. I like a coti shave once in a while but find a jnat edge more satisfying even though the shave is bbs either way. But thats the fun of the hobby and contrast helps us distinguish what we like and what we love.

 

[Obiwan]

It takes a big man to admit and eat crow. Great post Brooksie.

I agree with the drip by drip process. I did that at first and it took much longer and didn't yield as good results. I've said it before and still believe, it's solving the riddle of how to eek out a coticules last ~5% that makes all the difference.

Congrats on creating another option (and possible AD) for yourself.

 

[Brooksie967]

OBI, I had 4 coticules and I'm down to this one. I kept it because it was the one that looked most 'kosher' of the bunch to me. I liked the feel of the other ones better to be honest. The edge on this was quite superb but it's also on a very superb razor.

 

[Slash McCoy]

Don't be too disappointed if the next one doesn't come out as easy or as good. Sometimes you eat the bear, sometimes the bear eats you. But usually a coti finished edge will be a nice shave. (I just like film and diamond paste on balsa edges a little bit better!)

 

[SliceOfLife]

The edge feels very strange. Why does a coticule edge that provides hht 4 feel like it's not cutting as well as a jnat edge at hht4? The most noticeable spot is under my chin. Jnat edges fly through that hair, the coticule edge feels like it's tugging and dragging.

Because Jnats can (obviously depending on the Jnat in question) produce far sharper edges than coticules. There's not really a mystery at play here. Coticule edges aren't incredibly sharp. They are sharp enough to cut a beard pretty well and some characteristic of a good coticule edge makes them prove rather gentle and hesitant to cause nicks for the majority of shavers. This combined with the stones somewhat unique cutting profile is why it is a popular razor hone... not the fact that it creates the sharpest edge ever. That said, depending on your hair, if the dragging under the chin is significant (not just noticeable, but troublesome), you probably could get a bit more out of the edge on a coticule. It will possibly always drag a bit, but a significant amount of drag even under the chin would indicate to me that the edge could take a bit more polish.

 

[Brooksie967]

Because Jnats can (obviously depending on the Jnat in question) produce far sharper edges than coticules. There's not really a mystery at play here. Coticule edges aren't incredibly sharp. They are sharp enough to cut a beard pretty well and some characteristic of a good coticule edge makes them prove rather gentle and hesitant to cause nicks for the majority of shavers. This combined with the stones somewhat unique cutting profile is why it is a popular razor hone... not the fact that it creates the sharpest edge ever. That said, depending on your hair, if the dragging under the chin is significant (not just noticeable, but troublesome), you probably could get a bit more out of the edge on a coticule. It will possibly always drag a bit, but a significant amount of drag even under the chin would indicate to me that the edge could take a bit more polish.

Ian, I appreciate the advice but still don't understand. HHT4 is HHT4. I used the same piece of hair from one razor to the next.

As far as under my chin, I've used razors that were tuned up to .125 cbn and still had issues with the thick hair under my chin.

 

[gumbo]

Coticule edges really hit it for me when I finish with x strokes and diluted dish soap. Oil I'm assuming would do the same thing.
It was an amazing difference, and much more polished bevel. Maybe that's where your happiness was found?

 

[rockviper]

....As far as under my chin, I've used razors that were tuned up to .125 cbn and still had issues with the thick hair under my chin.

I'm right there with you on this. Even with a DE blade, right under my chin where the bone starts to curve towards the ears has always been a challenge.

 

[blackhhawk]

What kind of pressure were you using throughout?

 

[Brooksie967]

What kind of pressure were you using throughout?

Slight pressure with slurry, to minimal pressure water only to no pressure (weight of razor) with soap.

 

[gary haywood]

my hht 4 of the coticule passes 40mm from holding point even with pretty fine hair.. I also found less hht of j nat does great job, but coticule the distance has to be 30 to 40mm after stropping ..... I should point out I have exact same probs going against the grain under chin area seems I experience same problem with coticule edge ...I have to go real flat with razor that helps loads...I also get successful shaves with coticule edge no dragging or slight resistants if I get it bang on on. so its smooth for me with grain across the grain sound against the grain cheeks and left and right of neck but middle section where stubble grows directly down is where I do have teething problems if not quite there if i'm all good its nice and smooth if not slight ly ropy...

 

[Brooksie967]

Gary that's what I like to hear. Sounds like this edge is what it's supposed to be.

 

[gary haywood]

yes it may will be ..its always been my problem area..I even took a mach 3 to that area. first time in years I used one...I have to be onest it went through the stubble like it wasn't there... modern razors are sharp

 

[Loner16]

All of my properly executed coticule edges have been as good as any natural I have in my collection .... bar none!

The key operating words for me are "properly executed..." It took me some time, but at this point, it usually works out pretty predictably.