Canadian Old type with interesting case

[dakotaev]

Hey all,

I found an interesting old type (I believe) at an antique's show yesterday. Just sharing pics and would love any info anyone might have to share.

I looked for pictures with a similar case but came up with nothing. I believe it is silver plated due to the greyish dark brown tarnishing, correct me if I'm wrong.

Inside

Came with some old unused blades still wrapped in paper

Along with a pile of used blades, these are really thick blades compared to modern DE blades

This Manual was with it, I'm not sure it's original to this set or just happened to be paired with it. Very interesting none the less, here are a few pages I took pictures of:

 

[alex2363]

Canadian ABC set, Empire model [ it's in silver]. The book is in immaculate condition.

 

[Ace McCool]

These two threads will have all of the information you are looking for. This is an Empire Pattern Pocket Edition set with a standard Ball End Old Type. The manual with it is interesting.

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showth...n-Company-Pocket-Edition-Sets-Part-One-Razors

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showth...on-Company-Pocket-Edition-Sets-Part-Two-Cases

 

[alex2363]

These two threads will have all of the information you are looking for. This is an Empire Pattern Pocket Edition set with a standard Ball End Old Type. The manual with it is interesting.

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showth...n-Company-Pocket-Edition-Sets-Part-One-Razors

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showth...on-Company-Pocket-Edition-Sets-Part-Two-Cases

He has a ABC set, not Pocket Edition.

 

[Ace McCool]

He has a ABC set, not Pocket Edition.

It's called an ABC Pocket Edition... like the threads I posted.

 

[alex2363]

It's called an ABC Pocket Edition... like the threads I posted.

I know, i was stating that he has a Canadian ABC set Pocket edition case. [ you just said it was a Empire Pattern Pocket Edition set with a standard Ball End Old Type.]

 

[Ace McCool]

I know, i was stating that he has a Canadian ABC set Pocket edition case. [ you just said it was a Empire Pattern Pocket Edition set with a standard Ball End Old Type.]

Yes... like the threads I posted...

 

[Sled Dog]

I thought the ABC sets had the "King Gillette" and patent numbers etc on the bottom of the case and the Gillette made sets had a plain bottom.

This one appears to be the same as the one I posted the other day here

That book is pretty cool!!

What serial number is it?

 

[Ace McCool]

I thought the ABC sets had the "King Gillette" and patent numbers etc on the bottom of the case and the Gillette made sets had a plain bottom.

This one appears to be the same as the one I posted the other day here

That book is pretty cool!!

What serial number is it?

Yes that's correct. 2 Ways to identify if it was made by the American Button Company.

1. Patent Dates on the bottom of the case
2. Gillette Patch on interior without "Made in U.S.A" written on it (Made in USA means Gillette made it)

How this works with Made in Canada sets I do not know.

Edit: I just checked and I have a Flower set with Patent dates on the bottom, but with Made in U.S.A on the Gillette patch - Go figure.

 

[alex2363]

I thought the ABC sets had the "King Gillette" and patent numbers etc on the bottom of the case and the Gillette made sets had a plain bottom.

This one appears to be the same as the one I posted the other day here

That book is pretty cool!!

What serial number is it?

You can tell by the lack of words- Made in USA in the patch as a identification point, since we can see the underside of the case from the pics.

 

[alex2363]

Yes that's correct. 2 Ways to identify if it was made by the American Button Company.

1. Patent Dates on the bottom of the case
2. Gillette Patch on interior without "Made in U.S.A" written on it (Made in USA means Gillette made it)

How this works with Made in Canada sets I do not know.

Edit: I just checked and I have a Flower set with Patent dates on the bottom, but with Made in U.S.A on the Gillette patch - Go figure.

The razor in it is marked made in Canada.

 

[Sled Dog]

Yes that's correct. 2 Ways to identify if it was made by the American Button Company.

1. Patent Dates on the bottom of the case
2. Gillette Patch on interior without "Made in U.S.A" written on it (Made in USA means Gillette made it)

How this works with Made in Canada sets I do not know.

Edit: I just checked and I have a Flower set with Patent dates on the bottom, but with Made in U.S.A on the Gillette patch - Go figure.

If you check the second link that you posted (cases) there are both patches with and without Made in USA, and one without a patch.
I will take a wild guess that a Made in Canada case would not have the Made in USA on the patch
I'm also guessing that the OP's set will have a plain bottom and be a Gillette set and not an ABC set...

 

[alex2363]

Yes that's correct. 2 Ways to identify if it was made by the American Button Company.

1. Patent Dates on the bottom of the case
2. Gillette Patch on interior without "Made in U.S.A" written on it (Made in USA means Gillette made it)

How this works with Made in Canada sets I do not know.

Edit: I just checked and I have a Flower set with Patent dates on the bottom, but with Made in U.S.A on the Gillette patch - Go figure.

As i understand ithe dating of these sets and razors was not an exact science, there was some mismatching along the way for various economic and other reasons.

 

[Sled Dog]

You can tell by the lack of words- Made in USA in the patch as a identification point, since we can see the underside of the case from the pics.

I don't really get what you're trying to say...since this is a Canadian set, it would not say Made in USA.
I don't see any pics of the OP's underside of the case, so how do you figure it's made by ABC?

 

[alex2363]

this is NOT a standard ball end razor. this is a canadian thin handle ball end without knurling razor!

At this point the razor is made in Canada and the case is only identifiable by the patch as ABC set, that is what i am saying.

 

[alex2363]

this is NOT a standard ball end razor. this is a canadian thin handle ball end without knurling razor!

True, just like Sledog's set.

 

[Ace McCool]

this is NOT a standard ball end razor. this is a canadian thin handle ball end without knurling razor!

Thanks, good catch.

It's likely that the American Button Company never had manufacturing in Canada, so all Canadian Pocket Edition sets are Made by Gillette.

However, according to those 2 Pocket Edition threads, ABC sets had no Made in USA, and Patent engraving on the bottom. This is obviously now false information as I have an ABC Flower Case with Patent info and Made in USA.

Sled Dog and dakotaev: do your Canadian sets have patent info on the bottom?

 

[alex2363]

Thanks, good catch.

It's likely that the American Button Company never had manufacturing in Canada, so all Canadian Pocket Edition sets are Made by Gillette.

However, according to those 2 Pocket Edition threads, ABC sets had no Made in USA, and Patent engraving on the bottom. This is obviously now false information as I have an ABC Flower Case with Patent info and Made in USA.

Sled Dog and dakotaev: do your Canadian sets have patent info on the bottom?

It is from an older thread, but it seems as new information has surfaced. This is why this is somewhat confusing. Does your razors have any other marks? I know that Gillette opened a plant in Canada in 1906 so these have to date after that date.

 

[dakotaev]

Hey all, thanks for all the replies.

Bottom of the case has no markings whatsoever:

Guard has "Made in Canada"

Serial # 535309

 

[alex2363]

That is odd, the case has no country patent info or Gillette signature on the back, but yet i has the patch without MADE IN USA marks which indicates a ABC set case. But ABC sets were not made in Canada. Could it be counterfeit case? Gillette only made 75 razors and 70 doazen blades a day in 1906 with 3 employees. They had issues keeping proper blade records. I know Gillette started taking big orders of Pocket Editions in 1909 from travelers after they rebiult the factory after the fire Jan/1907. They had issues with replaters and some of the accountability of the designs may have been compromised.
Gillette Blade :