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Can you explain to a blind person how to apply lather?

AimlessWanderer

Remember to forget me!
By the way @AimlessWanderer, I was referring to my notes and I remembered that you also gave very precise count of turns and amount of cream. I'm going to test that out next, and I'm wondering how best I can compare results with you. The things that occur to me is either you giving me description of how the lather feels for you, tactilely, when it dries on its own and gets to a good enough consistency for you, or I can keep posting pictures.
I really like your idea of creating one good lather, because that creates the foundation for everything else. However, it'd be great to compare 'my" good with "your' good, because I'm not sure if I'm getting the results you're getting even though your instructions are as specific as humanly possible.

Well, first of all, pictures probably won't help me. I have complex neurological issues, and my vision is one of the many things affected. I can see, but not well, and not always to the same clarity everyday. Personally, I couldn't make out your lather on that photo of yours, as the lather and bowl were the same colour, and my brain couldn't differentiate one from the other. Some of the pictures I upload here are awful. Either out of focus, badly lit, or blurry from not holding the camera still enough, but I might not realise this till days after taking/posting them.

As to lather preferences, mine is not bulky, cushioning, or so called protective. It's thin, wet and slick. The dense, peaky meringue face lathers that some others strive for, give me appalling shaves. That's why I wanted you to feel for maximum slickness first and foremost. How you would achieve the identical lather could vary wildly, depending how our water chemistry differs. Even my own methods vary wildly, depending what brush or cream I pick up.

What I am trying to say here, is don't compare your lather too closely to anyone's other than your own. Once you find that best possible lather with a certain product, then that is the marker to compare it too. It doesn't matter if you have to stand on one leg, and whistle Beethoven, while balancing a watermelon on your head. Discover what you need to do, to replicate that consistently.

I would suggest that being able to diagnose what went wrong, is as important as knowing what's right. Whenever you decide to test something new, intentionally start with not enough, and keep checking as you go, before ending up with intentionally far too much. In time, you will get a feel (literally) of what your lather needs more of or less of, to get you where you want to be.
 
Well, first of all, pictures probably won't help me. I have complex neurological issues, and my vision is one of the many things affected. I can see, but not well, and not always to the same clarity everyday. Personally, I couldn't make out your lather on that photo of yours, as the lather and bowl were the same colour, and my brain couldn't differentiate one from the other. Some of the pictures I upload here are awful. Either out of focus, badly lit, or blurry from not holding the camera still enough, but I might not realise this till days after taking/posting them.
Ah! Thanks for explaining that! I imagine the on/off of vision clarity must have been annoying in the beginning, before you developed ways to function with it.

As to lather preferences, mine is not bulky, cushioning, or so called protective. It's thin, wet and slick.
Ah, interesting! I've found that thinner, more slick lathers work best for me because I can feel what I'm doing, it's good to know that fluffier isn't necessarily better. I'll keep that top of mind as I experiment with lathers.
It doesn't matter if you have to stand on one leg, and whistle Beethoven, while balancing a watermelon on your head.
Well, I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to pull off that feat of multi-tasking while shaving at the same time, LOL.
I would suggest that being able to diagnose what went wrong, is as important as knowing what's right. Whenever you decide to test something new, intentionally start with not enough, and keep checking as you go, before ending up with intentionally far too much. In time, you will get a feel (literally) of what your lather needs more of or less of, to get you where you want to be.
I understand, makes total sense. Thank you!
 
Okay! Today, I went for @Alum of Potash's suggestion of palm lathering. Here is what I learned:
  • It's very intuitive to feel when the lather is dry. I think dry/sticky lather is the worst, and I see no chance of that happening when I try lathering this way. This is actually one of the reasons that @Marco's method worked for me – when I had too much water in the bowl, I could always keep stirring and, at least with my Castle Forbes cream, it always finally came together. However, when palm lathering, I can start with less water
  • Also related, it's also pretty natural to slowly add water, because I can feel how much water is in my palm vs the product. Plus, extra water just spills out the sides of my hand, hehe
  • I found that the best way to actually feel the lather and also to build it up is to squeeze the brush with the fingers of my "bowl hand" into my "bowl hand palm". That way I can feel the wetness and the foaminess of the lather, because when it's in the brush, I have no clue how it feels
  • Completely unrelated, but my hand smells really nice after this experiment!
I'm going to continue switching between palm and bowl to try out different ways of getting tactile feedback on what I'm learning. It's great that now I have more options.
Thanks a lot to everyone jumping in on this thread to give me suggestions and advice, I really appreciate every single one of you. I'm not done learning and experimenting, so if you still have ideas, keep them coming.
 
Okay! Today, I went for @Alum of Potash's suggestion of palm lathering. Here is what I learned:
  • It's very intuitive to feel when the lather is dry. I think dry/sticky lather is the worst, and I see no chance of that happening when I try lathering this way. This is actually one of the reasons that @Marco's method worked for me – when I had too much water in the bowl, I could always keep stirring and, at least with my Castle Forbes cream, it always finally came together. However, when palm lathering, I can start with less water
  • Also related, it's also pretty natural to slowly add water, because I can feel how much water is in my palm vs the product. Plus, extra water just spills out the sides of my hand, hehe
  • I found that the best way to actually feel the lather and also to build it up is to squeeze the brush with the fingers of my "bowl hand" into my "bowl hand palm". That way I can feel the wetness and the foaminess of the lather, because when it's in the brush, I have no clue how it feels
  • Completely unrelated, but my hand smells really nice after this experiment!
I'm going to continue switching between palm and bowl to try out different ways of getting tactile feedback on what I'm learning. It's great that now I have more options.
Thanks a lot to everyone jumping in on this thread to give me suggestions and advice, I really appreciate every single one of you. I'm not done learning and experimenting, so if you still have ideas, keep them coming.
Glad to hear that palm-lathering may be working out for you. For what it's worth, I will itemize my palm-lathering technique here. First, I soak the brush in water, avoid contact where the knot meets the handle. Then I gently squeeze and shake off the knot to remove standing water in the knot. Next I either add a dollop of cream to the palm of my off-hand or start loading from a soap that has also been soaked in advance followed by pouring out any standing water. In both cases, the goal is to load the tips of the brush with cream or soap. Once this has been achieved, I refill the container I used to soak the knot of the brush with fresh warm water. Then I dip just the tips of the brush into this from time to time add little bits of water while building the lather until the desired lather is achieved. Here it is also important to keep the lather from spilling over the palm. Smaller brushes in the 18-22mm knot diameter range work well in this regard, the narrower diameters with knots with splay or bloom like badgers, and the wider diameters with more vertical bristles and less bloom like Omega boars.
 
Then I dip just the tips of the brush into this from time to time add little bits of water while building the lather until the desired lather is achieved.
Thanks for listing out the steps very concretely, this helps me understand what I'm doing differently than you!
For everything else I'm doing it exactly like you, except this step. I'm adding the water directly to my palm, instead of dipping the tips of the brush in it. This is because I need 2 hands to make sure I dip only the tips of the brush in the water: one for holding the brush, and one for keeping my finger above the water level so I can feel the brush and make sure it's only the tips of the bristles that touches the water.
From your experience, do you think adding the water to my palm as opposed to dipping the brush in it affects the lather quality badly? If so, I can try and find some solution to this.
Here it is also important to keep the lather from spilling over the palm. Smaller brushes in the 18-22mm knot diameter range work well in this regard, the narrower diameters with knots with splay or bloom like badgers, and the wider diameters with more vertical bristles and less bloom like Omega boars.
My Muhle silvertip fibre large is at the 22MM mark, so I'm guessing as long as I don't add too much water to my palm like I did yesterday it shouldn't spill over my palm.
 

Legion

Staff member
Sorry, I haven't read through this whole thread to see if someone else suggested it, but have you tried face lathering from a soap stick? Sitting here thinking about it, it seems to me the method that requires the least visual acuity.
 
Sorry, I haven't read through this whole thread to see if someone else suggested it, but have you tried face lathering from a soap stick? Sitting here thinking about it, it seems to me the method that requires the least visual acuity.
Hi! No, not really. I don't have a soap stick, I just have a Castle Forbes, Proraso white, and Speick shaving cream. Is there a way to test out how that works, maybe by smearing one of them on my face and lathering with a damp brush?
 

blethenstrom

Born to häckla
Hi! No, not really. I don't have a soap stick, I just have a Castle Forbes, Proraso white, and Speick shaving cream. Is there a way to test out how that works, maybe by smearing one of them on my face and lathering with a damp brush?
Indeed you can use a cream and just smear it on your face and then go to town with a damp brush. I did that this morning for my shave. You probably will have to add a bit of water to your brush. Now creams require less water, in general, so you may be able to leave the brush a bit wetter and maybe you do not have to add any more water. Different soaps and creams require different amount of water, but generally creams needs less.
 
Hello parham. I have been following this thread for several days. I would like to share my technique with you. You might be able to find something in it that helps. At the end I'll share some thoughts too. You have gotten some wonderful advice from a great group of folks here.
My full brush and soap preparation happens in the amount of time it takes to brush my teeth. I fill my bowl with warm to hot water and drop my bush into it. I press the brush down once to help aide in the soaking of the bristles and keep the brush from floating to the top. I add enough water to the tub of soap to completely cover the surface of the soap and lit it rest.
Then I brush my teeth.

I fill the sink with hot water and dump the water out of the soap tub into it. That's the water I use to wet my face.
When that is done, I remove the brush from the water in the bowl. I dump the water from the bowl into the sink. I hold the brush with my fingers and flick the brush 4 to 6 times lightly using my wrist to remove excess water. The brush I use on a given day dictates how many times I flick. Bigger brush knots need more flicks.
I then hold the soap tub 90 degrees over the bowl and swirl until no more water and soap fall into the bowl. Here is where I might be a little different than most guys here. I find it easier to regulate soap to water easier than water to soap to achieve the lather I like. If I do this right, what I have in my bowl is the consistency of a cream based chowder or bisque. I then hold the soap tub upright and swirl my brush in the tub 3 or 4 times loading up dryer soap. I then start working the lather in the bowl. I swirl and whip the soap for a little bit and check the consistency. I keep adding soap like I mentioned until I get the consistency the way I like it.

If I miss my desired consistency and need to add water, I do not dip my brush. The way I add water is best described by thinking of how a bird's talons work. I reach into the sink of hot water that has some soap in it from dumping the soap water at the beginning in it and grab some water with my fingers. Think of an eagle pulling a fish out of water or turning a know with your fingers and thumb. Not a lot of water gets moved using this technique, but it is repeatable and consistent.
Then I lather my face. Sometimes the lather just isn't right once it's on my face. Any adjustments I need to make, I make in the bowl and then apply some of that new lather to my face.
This is what I have found that works for me.

Some thoughts.
Consistency. The best way I can describe the lather I like is to think about puff pastry. Some puff pastry has cream filling and some puff pastry has custard filling. I like for my lather to be a little more towards the custard side. I like my lather to be a little more creamy and dense rather than airy and holding its shape.

Synthetic brushes. I abandoned synthetic brushes long ago. They do not retain the amount of water within the brush that I like. I live in a very arid environment and that lack of moisture just makes getting the consistency I like that much harder. My preference in brushes in boar and horse. That is just what I like and there are many people out there who will, based on their own experiences, debate on the merits of one hair type over the other. There are very good quality boar brushes out there for very little money. I do find that a quality horse brush can be a little expensive. There are a lot of bad horse brushes out there.

Soap. Every soap is different. It behaves differently so just know that adjustment in technique is necessary every time you open a new soap. Even soaps within the same company using the same base recipe will vary to some degree with different fragrances. Fragrance oil impacts the soap because it changes the base oils. Just be aware of that.

One more thought. Have you ever considered a shave oil instead of soap? I know that is blasphemous here, but it's an idea to explore.

Hope you find some of this helpful. Enjoy the journey of learning. We have all gone through this journey on some level and there are so many wonderful folks here to help you navigate it.
 
I know you seem determined to build good lather, @parham, but have you considered trying a brushless cream? These are applied with fingertips and provide a very thin, slick film to shave with. They need to be reapplied for each pass, but it is still fairly quick to do. A brushless cream would allow you to use your sense of touch more directly.

I'm not sure what is available in the Netherlands. Here we have many products like Cremo, Jack Black, and so on that don't require a brush.
 
Thanks for listing out the steps very concretely, this helps me understand what I'm doing differently than you!
For everything else I'm doing it exactly like you, except this step. I'm adding the water directly to my palm, instead of dipping the tips of the brush in it. This is because I need 2 hands to make sure I dip only the tips of the brush in the water: one for holding the brush, and one for keeping my finger above the water level so I can feel the brush and make sure it's only the tips of the bristles that touches the water.
From your experience, do you think adding the water to my palm as opposed to dipping the brush in it affects the lather quality badly? If so, I can try and find some solution to this.

My Muhle silvertip fibre large is at the 22MM mark, so I'm guessing as long as I don't add too much water to my palm like I did yesterday it shouldn't spill over my palm.

In this case, rather than dip the bristles to transfer the water, perhaps dipping a finger into the water and transferring it this way to the palm (as many times as needed) would do the trick. A badger-style synth knot at 22mm should be fine. The plastic bristles tend to shed water so a light shake is all that should be needed, not even a soak. Load the tips with cream or a soap and introduce water via the fingers in building the lather on the palm until the desired consistency is achieved.

For me, a good lather, regardless of the razor being used, straight, shavette, or safety, involves a lather that is thick enough to stay on the face when applied, and thin enough to be rinsed off the blade afterwards. For the first pass, it is thicker, for the second pass and subsequent touch-ups, it is a little bit thinner. To thin things after the first pass, you might transfer a little bit of water to the palm with the fingers and introduce this to the knot containing the rest of the built lather.
 
Hey @ralph029! Thanks for chipping in your methods and general thoughts!
I keep adding soap like I mentioned until I get the consistency the way I like it.
Great! I was not using shaving soap so my method is a little bit different in the details, but the way you and I do it seems very similar to how I was doing it at the beginning of this thread. I like having too much water and adding product later if anything is lacking because that generally gives me a lot more lather, and I think it's much easier to feel wet lather with your fingers on the sides of the bowl, than dry lather on the brush itself. I'm still experimenting, so my opinions are very fluid, but I'm hoping this makes sense.
If I miss my desired consistency and need to add water, I do not dip my brush. The way I add water is best described by thinking of how a bird's talons work. I reach into the sink of hot water that has some soap in it from dumping the soap water at the beginning in it and grab some water with my fingers. Think of an eagle pulling a fish out of water or turning a know with your fingers and thumb. Not a lot of water gets moved using this technique, but it is repeatable and consistent.
I tried this yesterday. I will go into more detail into how I tested this in a separate post, but I do like this and it does work for me. I just need to find a container to keep the water in because our sink doesn't have a way to close the drain. Or maybe I should remodel the bathroom over this, lOL.
Then I lather my face. Sometimes the lather just isn't right once it's on my face. Any adjustments I need to make, I make in the bowl and then apply some of that new lather to my face.
Ooh, interesting! I'd love to make this work because I've noticed that if I try to lather on my face, the lather moves around, so I might actually remove lather where it has already been applied. Doing adjustments in the bowl means a thicker lather, but also less moving the lather around. I'll report on my experiments on that!
I like my lather to be a little more creamy and dense rather than airy and holding its shape.
I think this is similar to what I like, but I'm confused. When I get lather that is creamy and has no air bubbles in it, it can also hold its shape – I feel this by the way it clings to the sides of the bowl, and the fact that holding the brush horizontally for a while doesn't make the lather fall off. What do you mean by not holding its shape?
There are very good quality boar brushes out there for very little money. I do find that a quality horse brush can be a little expensive. There are a lot of bad horse brushes out there.
I have been reading and hearing a lot about boar brushes. Maybe that's something to try. This might be wrong, but I feel like my silver tip fibre brush is too soft to actually lift my hair. I can't see other people's faces so I can't compare, but being Middle Eastern, I think I have a dense beard.
If that sounds plausible, I can share a photo of myself with about 2-3 days growth so you all can tell me about the density.
Every soap is different. It behaves differently so just know that adjustment in technique is necessary every time you open a new soap.
Very useful to know, thanks! I'll get into details of how I discovered this when I recap the shave I did yesterday!
 
have you considered trying a brushless cream?
Yes, totally. I really like soaps/creams because of the smell component – that's a big part of this feeling like a spa treatment. However, I do want to try out Jack Black (which I think is available here) once I get a good lather. I think it's great for travel, but also, I feel like I'd prefer that to face lathering.
These are applied with fingertips and provide a very thin, slick film to shave with. They need to be reapplied for each pass, but it is still fairly quick to do. A brushless cream would allow you to use your sense of touch more directly.
Exactly right. Hence my theoretical preference for these over face lathering... for now!
 
Okay! I thought I'd share my latest results with the suggestions that I picked from this thread.
First off, a picture of the lather I got, this time on the brush. Not sure if I myself am also visible in this photo:
Lather.jpg

I built this lather in the bowl, and applied it to my face, and started shaving. This was using the Castle Forbes Lavender.
Here are my learnings:
  • The first issue I faced during the shave was that I noticed the lather was a bit dry. It was very easy to wet the very tips of my fingers and apply the water straight to the lather on my face, using what I had learned while experimenting with @AimlessWanderer
  • The second issue I faced was that, since this was almost the very end of my shaving cream, my lather ran out. It was very easy to swirl my finger underneath the nooks and crannies of the cream container, gather a bit on my finger, put that in my palm, and lather straight in my palm as @Alum of Potash described
  • As I was lathering in my palm, I noticed that the lather was a bit too dry. I tried two ways of adding water:
    1. The first was to do what @ralph029 suggested: grab some with my finger and drop it into a bowl (well, in this case, my palm). I could feel 8 or so drops fall on my palm, which is great
    2. The second was something I thought of, which was to very barely open the tap, until I hear the "tap, tap, tap" of drops falling into the sink. When it hit a rhythm, I held the brush under the tap until I couldn't hear the drops hit the sink any more, which meant they were falling on my brush instead! Then, since I knew the rate at which the drops were falling, I could estimate how long it'd take for 4 drops to fall on my brush
  • I got to experience first hand what many of you had been saying, the last time by @ralph029: soaps/creams are very different, and so it goes with Speick vs Castle Forbes. I could add a lot more water to the Castle Forbes lather, either in my palm, or in the bowl, or directly on my face with my fingers, and the cream would still hold its shape. However, I also noticed that even at its most wet, it was too thick/dry for me
  • Although many people here don't see much value in a pre-shave cream, applying the Proraso Sensitive pre-shave cream in the second and third pass gave me a really supple face feel after the shave, and also helped me get a much closer shave than just with Castle Forbes. I'm going to continue using pre-shaves while my razor and lathering technique improves, so that I can get the super smooth shave I love
  • And finally, my biggest achievement: at last, I think I can tell when a lather isn't good because of my technique, versus when it is not my fault, and I just don't like the way the cream feels
I think, finally, I'm more confident to go out there, experiment, adjust, and learn experientially. You guys have given me the tools to evaluate different options, get feedback on my technique, and adjust when things need fixing. I'm very grateful to you all and hope that I can learn even more from you 🙏
 
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blethenstrom

Born to häckla
Okay! I thought I'd share my latest results with the suggestions that I picked from this thread.
First off, a picture of the lather I got, this time on the brush. Not sure if I myself am also visible in this photo:
View attachment 1788623
I built this lather in the bowl, and applied it to my face, and started shaving. This was using the Castle Forbes Lavender.
Here are my learnings:
  • The first issue I faced during the shave was that I noticed the lather was a bit dry. It was very easy to wet the very tips of my fingers and apply the water straight to the lather on my face, using what I had learned while experimenting with @AimlessWanderer
  • The second issue I faced was that, since this was almost the very end of my shaving cream, my lather ran out. It was very easy to swirl my finger underneath the nooks and crannies of the cream container, gather a bit on my finger, put that in my palm, and lather straight in my palm as @Alum of Potash described
  • As I was lathering in my palm, I noticed that the lather was a bit too dry. I tried two ways of adding water:
    1. The first was to do what @ralph029 suggested: grab some with my finger and drop it into a bowl (well, in this case, my palm). I could feel 8 or so drops fall on my palm, which is great
    2. The second was something I thought of, which was to very barely open the tap, until I hear the "tap, tap, tap" of drops falling into the sink. When it hit a rhythm, I held the brush under the tap until I couldn't hear the drops hit the sink any more, which meant they were falling on my brush instead! Then, since I knew the rate at which the drops were falling, I could estimate how long it'd take for 4 drops to fall on my brush
  • I got to experience first hand what many of you had been saying, the last time by @ralph029: soaps/creams are very different, and so it goes with Speick vs Castle Forbes. I could add a lot more water to the Castle Forbes lather, either in my palm, or in the bowl, or directly on my face with my fingers, and the cream would still hold its shape. However, I also noticed that even at its most wet, it was too thick/dry for me
  • And finally, my biggest achievement: at last, I think I can tell when a lather isn't good because of my technique, versus when it is not my fault, and I just don't like the way the cream feels
I think, finally, I'm more confident to go out there, experiment, adjust, and learn experientially. You guys have given me the tools to evaluate different options, get feedback on my technique, and adjust when things need fixing. I'm very grateful to you all and hope that I can learn even more from you 🙏
I like the look of that lather you have there in your lather bowl and on the brush. Looks nice and creamy.
 

AimlessWanderer

Remember to forget me!
That lather looks very promising, Parham (I had no problems seeing this photo). However, you said that lather felt dry. Did you wet your face before applying it? If not, I think that is all it would have needed.
 
Hey @ralph029! Thanks for chipping in your methods and general thoughts!
My pleasure. I'm glad my thoughts could help some.
Great! I was not using shaving soap so my method is a little bit different in the details, but the way you and I do it seems very similar to how I was doing it at the beginning of this thread. I like having too much water and adding product later if anything is lacking because that generally gives me a lot more lather, and I think it's much easier to feel wet lather with your fingers on the sides of the bowl, than dry lather on the brush itself. I'm still experimenting, so my opinions are very fluid, but I'm hoping this makes sense.
It makes good sense to me since I use this method. The last two days, I have spent some time feeling the lather with my fingers. I know being sighted, this is not quite the same as your perspective, but it has given me the opportunity to have a different perception. I'll talk a little more about what I have been feeling below.
I tried this yesterday. I will go into more detail into how I tested this in a separate post, but I do like this and it does work for me. I just need to find a container to keep the water in because our sink doesn't have a way to close the drain. Or maybe I should remodel the bathroom over this, lOL.
Oh the rabbit holes this hobby will take us down. I just use a mug and a small bowl. I have not needed anything fancy.
Ooh, interesting! I'd love to make this work because I've noticed that if I try to lather on my face, the lather moves around, so I might actually remove lather where it has already been applied. Doing adjustments in the bowl means a thicker lather, but also less moving the lather around. I'll report on my experiments on that!
The initial lathering of my face just pushes a very thin lather all around. Then I use a painting stroke to apply the rest of the later that I use. Once I have completed my first pass with a razor, I then splash some water on my face and paint on another layer of lather for my second pass. I have to be careful not to apply too much water to my face here or the later gets too thin.
I think this is similar to what I like, but I'm confused. When I get lather that is creamy and has no air bubbles in it, it can also hold its shape – I feel this by the way it clings to the sides of the bowl, and the fact that holding the brush horizontally for a while doesn't make the lather fall off. What do you mean by not holding its shape?
This was difficult for me to explain since my reference is in cooking and working with heavy cream. It is something that I have always relied on sight for, so trying to explain it was difficult. I obviously missed the mark on that. Let me try this again. If you take cream and beat it until it becomes butter you go through 4 stages. Stage 1 is liquid, heavy and thick but viscous. This is what is in my shave bowl in a small amount when I start. Stage 2 would be a soft peak cream. Soft peaks will fall over slowly when you pull a beater straight up but the mound remains stable. This is what I meant by not holding its shape. There is air in it but the bubbles are small. It feels very silky to the touch. You can roll it around with your fingers without it falling apart. It might ooze around some but it doesn't stay firm and solid and break up. Stage 3 is a stiff peak. The points of the cream stand straight up when you pull the beaters straight up. This stage has lots of air in it and it will feel like you are breaking the form in pieces when you pull it apart. If you roll it around in your fingers it will fall away pretty quickly but it will be very slick while it's there. Stage 4 is butter. It is very slick but solid and useless for our purposes. My preference is between stage 2 and stage 3 with my lather being just to the side of center of stage 3. I will tell you that over the last several days, I have spent more time feeling my lather with purpose than I ever have before.
I have been reading and hearing a lot about boar brushes. Maybe that's something to try. This might be wrong, but I feel like my silver tip fibre brush is too soft to actually lift my hair. I can't see other people's faces so I can't compare, but being Middle Eastern, I think I have a dense beard.
If that sounds plausible, I can share a photo of myself with about 2-3 days growth so you all can tell me about the density.
I have a very dense beard myself. I have opinions about what a brush actually does, aside from creating and applying later to the face that I will keep to myself here. I use boar and horse brushes because I find they hold the right amount of water for me and my style of creating lather. I like how they feel against my skin. I also like the process of breaking them in. A good quality horse hair brush is much easier to break in, but finding a good one can be a challenge and a little expensive.
This is a thread about lather and not brushes, so I'll hold off going any further down that path.
Very useful to know, thanks! I'll get into details of how I discovered this when I recap the shave I did yesterday!
 
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