shoelessjoe
"I took out a Chihuahua!"
Stumbled onto this recent video & though I neither carry nor leave the post-upgrade P320 lying around chambered, I’m thinking it’s time to part ways with the unpredictable bagel ...
Bye, Bye P320??
- Thread starter shoelessjoe
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"say it ain't so, Joe!"
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- #3
shoelessjoe
"I took out a Chihuahua!"
Oh, yessir...
A few years back, Sig bungled the whole P320 discharge issue by issuing, not a mandatory but rather, a voluntary recall!
That, and recent documented post-upgrade discharges (sans any trigger manipulation), tells me there’s no room in the safe for the 320. So much for Sig’s maiden attempt at a striker-fired pistol...
Watch that video!
Ay, chihuahua! 
"It happens in the best of families."
AA
"It happens in the best of families."
AA
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- #5
shoelessjoe
"I took out a Chihuahua!"
I hate to part with mine. The full size became my house gun. I was an HK guy for years, I may need to go to an optics ready VP9
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- #7
shoelessjoe
"I took out a Chihuahua!"
That’s the thing, eh? Discharge issues notwithstanding, the P320 is an excellent handgun ... I do -did- like mine
The following was copied off of the above-mentioned lawsuit:
Paragraph 88, Page 25: quote: 88. In May 2018, a Rancho Cucamonga, California, officer reported that his “upgraded” P320 fired un-commanded while he was merely walking inside his department locker room; the casing of the round did not eject.
Paragraph 92, Page 26: quote: 92. On May 19, 2019, the upgraded P320 of Lieutenant Thomas Ahern of the Cambridge, Massachusetts, SWAT team fired un-commanded inside a SWAT van with six other occupants while he was working a shift for the annual Mayfair event near Harvard Square. The round struck a metal plate affixed to his cellphone case, deflected into a SWAT gear bag, and came to rest in a ballistic helmet, narrowly missing everyone. The casing of the round did not eject. Lieutenant Ahern is a SIG-certified armorer on the P320 with significant weapons experience.
Paragraph 93, Page 26: quote: 93. On July 23, 2019, an upgraded P320 fired un-commanded on Officer Walter Collette, Jr. of the Somerville, Massachusetts, police department, hitting him in his leg and causing substantial injuries to his leg. The next day, an upgraded P320 fired un-commanded on a Homeland Security Agent at a firing range in the Bronx, New York.
Paragraph 94, Page 26: quote: 94. In August of 2019, a Philadelphia transit officer’s upgraded P320 fired un-commanded while fully-holstered, nearly striking a bystander in the subway. The incident was captured on video, it shows an “upgraded” P320 firing without the gun ever being touched and seated inside its holster. The officer involved, who noted that the round almost hit a bystander, was returned to duty the next day fully exonerated and with no discipline.
Paragraph 96, Page 27: quote: 96. On September 3, 2019, another upgraded and re-designed P320 in use by the Loudoun County, Virginia, sheriff’s office fired un-commanded on another Loudoun County deputy sheriff, Carl Costello, hitting him in his leg.
Paragraphs 98-99, Page 27: quote: 98. On October 11, 2019, a P320 fired un-commanded on Veterans Affairs police officer Frank J. Kneski, striking him beneath his lower back as he was un-holstering the weapon. Upon inspection it was found that the spent casing did not eject.
99.
The Kneski discharge was investigated by Major Peter J. Villani of the United States Veterans Affairs police agency, also a SIG-certified armorer. In his report, he noted the following: After reviewing the Officer’s sidearm, it was noted that the P-320 came from Sig Sauer to the distributor prior to the point of sale already with the “upgrade” completed. The sidearm had approximately 100 rounds through it since purchased. Upon further examination of the internal parts of the frame module, I noticed that the foot of the striker that catches the [sear] has noticeable side to side and up and down movement within its channel along with upward movement of the slide from the frame. Also, the edge of the striker foot which has a height thickness of approximately 2mm, is only making contact with approximately .25 of a mm of the leading edge only of the disconnector hook. Since the striker has been changed with a lighter weight version during the “upgrade program”, it is quite possible that any abrupt movement or twisting of the P-320 while holstered, could cause the foot of the striker to disengage itself from the disconnector hook on its own since there is so little contact between the striker foot and the [sear].
I do not know whether or not the P320 (with the trigger fix) is unsafe, but I do know that almost no operator ever admits to ever playing a role in an NG, they all say "it just went off". Complicating this is the fact that a number of these have apparently involved Blackhawk Serpa holsters which also have been questioned for accidental discharges.
I am going to follow this closely because I really like my P320 and do not want to give it up, certainly not now when there are no handguns of any type available for purchase.
I am going to follow this closely because I really like my P320 and do not want to give it up, certainly not now when there are no handguns of any type available for purchase.
Interesting stuff. I wonder if there are any claims against their X series of P320 pistols?
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- #10
shoelessjoe
"I took out a Chihuahua!"
As found in Sig’s P320 voluntary upgrade FAQs:
Will this affect the X-series P320s?
Yes. However, the X-series flat trigger will not be replaced.
I'll have to forward this video to my brother-in-law. He bought a P320 last year.
Sadly, Sig quality went down when they started making things in Exeter.
I still want a West German made P220 and P226
Sadly, Sig quality went down when they started making things in Exeter.
I still want a West German made P220 and P226
This will be interesting to monitor. Sig has a lot riding on the P320 to say the least
Yeah, this blows me away.
You would think if P320s were discharging as claimed in the lawsuit, it would also be happening to members of different shooting forums. I took a quick peek at some of the larger forums and I can’t seem to find it happening to other members.
When we buy a gun we are making a commitment to a 'system' of holsters, magazines and sometimes upgrades. That is why I hate to give up the P320. Other than the fact that I have old eyes and have come to demand a red dot on my pistols, I would not hesitate for a moment taking my 25 year old (many thousands of rounds) HK USP out of the safe. I also have a shotgun and AR close at hand and other pistols. Things have changed in the 25 years since I bought my HK. The HK has a standard magazine with 15 rounds. I also have a jet funnel and 17 round magazines for it. But here in 2020, my EDC p365 XL also has 15 round magazines and I plan to put a Sig red dot on it. Of course the night sights on the HK no longer work, the rail is proprietary and will not accept the Inforce light that is on the P320, but the HK still goes bang.
As I said, I will be researching this closely before deciding what to do.
The little Romeo Zero from Sig looks perfect for the 365 XL. The housing and lens are made from polymer should be a lightweight set up.
I wonder if it’s durable? I have considered an 365 XL until Glock comes out with a 48 MOS, but seeing that video makes me wonder if the 365’s. Would have any of the same ills of the 320?
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- #17
shoelessjoe
"I took out a Chihuahua!"
As with you, I am quite fond of the pistol, but that said, I have relegated my (upgraded) P320 to a status akin to that of an exposed-sear/time bomb Nambu Type 94 or, for you children of the ‘70s, a Ford Pinto rolling along on a set of Firestone 500 tires.
The chambering (.357 Sig) & the fact that the 320 is such a fine-shooting, accurate pistol are the only reasons I haven’t listed the 320 ... yet. It’s a seller’s market & I still might move it.
Now, ponder this 2.5 year-old report on the P320’s dubious beginning:
Army's New Pistols Often Eject Live Rounds and Don't Work Well With Regular Bullets
A Pentagon report reveals the guns continued to suffer jams and other malfunctions after winning an already controversial competition.
www.thedrive.com
And then there’s this report of an upgraded P320 discharging in a NON-Blackhawk Serpa issue rig:
Your mention of the HK USP brings a smile to my face ... as former RL Winston Rod Company owner (Tom Morgan) said when asked why Winston wasn’t producing a slough of trendy, faster-modulous fly rods like their competitor, the Sage Rod Company was, he replied by saying: It’s simple. If a fly rod was a good fly rod thirty-years ago, it’s still going to be a good fly rod today.
Can’t call me a fanboy, because my affections for HK’s offerings precedes the Internet & all of the firearm forums found therein, but with the unveiling of each new, latest & greatest, trendy striker-fired polymer pistol, the more certain I am that Helmut Weldle’s P7-series pistols & while I am at it, Sig’s metal-frame classic P-series were & still remain the ideal EDC platforms ... they’re safe; they’re fast; they’re accurate; they are notoriously reliable & again, they’re safe!
Post Script: Could & probably should have included reputably-manufactured 1911’s, Governments or whatever you care to call em in the final paragraph, too.
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As with you, I am quite fond of the pistol, but that said, I have relegated my (upgraded) P320 to a status akin to that of an exposed-sear/time bomb Nambu Type 94 or, for you children of the ‘70s, a Ford Pinto rolling along on a set of Firestone 500 tires.
The chambering (.357 Sig) & the fact that the 320 is such a fine-shooting, accurate pistol are the only reasons I haven’t listed the 320 ... yet. It’s a seller’s market & I still might move it.
Now, ponder this 2.5 year-old report on the P320’s dubious beginning:
Army's New Pistols Often Eject Live Rounds and Don't Work Well With Regular Bullets
A Pentagon report reveals the guns continued to suffer jams and other malfunctions after winning an already controversial competition.
And then there’s this report of an upgraded P320 discharging in a NON-Blackhawk Serpa issue rig:
Your mention of the HK USP brings a smile to my face ... as former RL Winston Rod Company owner (Tom Morgan) said when asked why Winston wasn’t producing a slough of trendy, faster-modulous fly rods like their competitor, the Sage Rod Company was, he replied by saying: It’s simple. If a fly rod was a good fly rod thirty-years ago, it’s still going to be a good fly rod today.
Can’t call me a fanboy, because my affections for HK’s offerings precedes the Internet & all of the firearm forums found therein, but with the unveiling of each new, latest & greatest, trendy striker-fired polymer pistol, the more certain I am that Helmut Weldle’s P7-series pistols & while I am at it, Sig’s metal-frame classic P-series were & still remain the ideal EDC platforms ... they’re safe; they’re fast; they’re accurate; they are notoriously reliable & again, they’re safe!
Post Script: Could & probably should have included reputably-manufactured 1911’s, Governments or whatever you care to call em in the final paragraph, too.
I regret selling any of my various P7s.. Have had probably 7 or 8 of them, and 4 at one time, mostly M8's, and a couple of PSPs. Have had Chantilly and Sterling marked. Never had an Arlington marked one.
Carried them, when carried, in an original Lou Alessi CQCS, ox blood red with an exotic trim (Elephant, IIRC), and matching dual mag pouch.
No one on this forum has indicated they’ve had a P320 discharge in such a manner, the thread is merely opening the very well known issue up for discussion. The P320 release was bungled and sig had to issue a recall due to reports of them drop firing. Apparently whatever they did to fix the drop firing is a case of the cure being worse than the illness, as now they apparently go off while in the holster! BTW tons of online forums, including thefiringline and thehighroad, have had a number of threads discussing this during the drop fire issue and recall.
I have had very good luck with the Romeo One on my p320, so much so that I bought a Romeo 5 for my AR. The only reason I have not already bought a Romeo Zero for the 365 is that the Romeo 0 has been in such short supply
