Braun Series 5 50-R1000s or Panasonic arc 3 es ll 21

[miffed]

Hi everyone,
thinking of buying one of the two razors from the title...

my main goal is to get totally irritation free shaves that are close within reason, by this i mean as close as with a Oneblade by Philips keeping in mind that this particular tool cuts in "one direction" so to speak where as foils cut in opposing directions, or at least i think they they do...

a little back story, i currently wet shave using a DE razor, i can, with dedication, care and patients achieve a nick and cut free shave mostly irritation free, save a touch of redness, but this is only the case if i go exclusively with the grain, this in turn leaves substantial roughness in the opposite direction that the shave went (WTG)...i dislike the fact that my face after shaving is perfectly smooth in one direction and has the dreaded "sandpaper" effect in the opposite direction...(ATG)

having all this in mind, i bought the andis profoil a few months back, in the hope of being able to achieve a truly smooth shave, the andis did indeed provide me with a close shave, pretty much BBS in fact, but, i disliked how much the device vibrated, in fact it vibrated so much that after shaving with it my face was a little numb, and, and this is a big AND for me, it left a few stray hair, this was appalling for me as the rest of my face was smooth as glass so to speak and the few hairs really stood out, on top of these operational flaws i had severe redness, quite a few whiteheads a few days after, itching and so on, after one use of the andis i had to apply nivea balm at least three times in order to calm my skin enough so that i could get to sleep...

furthermore, i have also owned and tried the Oneblade by philips, it cut close enough, but left me with quite a few whiteheads a couple of days after shaving, actually the most i've had after shaving...the other qualm i had with it was the cutting element was tiny and i took numerous strokes to get anything done...i tried the oneblade wet, using exactly the same prep that i use for DE shaving, the results were worse, i ended up being shaved in patches as i could not see through my lather and the number of whiteheads seemed to amplify itself...my dog chewed up the device so i gave up on that type of "tech" (there are numerous tools similar to the oneblade, made by other companies, but the OB is touted as being the best of the bunch)

i have also read up on the subject on shavercheck, i have narrowed my possibilities down to the two devices in the title of this thread, from what i gather, both should be infinitely gentler than the andis, if this is not the case than i shall forego foil technology on the whole, if however they are, then the premise is as follows, the braun should be gentler than the arc 3 but the arc 3 should give a closer shave...

i can get both devices for 90-ish euros, with the braun being 5 euros more expensive, i also must state that in my third world country panasonics and brauns 30 day return policies are void, meaning, that you cannot return the devices ad hoc, i've spoken to a lady today who says i could try the device and if it tore my skin off i could return it, for this i had to spend quite some time on the phone, persuade, haggle and so on...

my loose plan would be to get the braun, as it is meant to be gentler than the arc 3 given my experience with foil tech with the andis, if it doesn't shave as well as i like, in both directions in regard to the grain, and if it gave me any irritation, then i would exchange it for the arc and give that a whirl...the braun is also said to be better at coping with longer and flat lying hairs than the arc although this newer series is said to inferior to the previous 5 series...

i would really appreciate any insight from anyone that has used these two devices,or just one of course, and also i wholeheartedly welcome any and all comments/experiences

Cheers everyone

 

[StewB]

My experience with electrics is that they are probably not going to get you where you want to go.

How long have you been using a DE razor? I have only been using a DE razor a little over 3 months and my shaves are superior to what I have ever been able to achieve with an electric.

My suggestion would be to try to improve your DE shaves before investing in an electric. No matter what you decide, though, pre-shave preparation will probably do more to help with irritation than anything else (and good technique, if you use a DE razor).

Reply back with whatever you decide, and let the community know your results. Good luck!

 

[LRod]

Hi everyone,
thinking of buying one of the two razors from the title...

my main goal is to get totally irritation free shaves that are close within reason, by this i mean as close as with a Oneblade by Philips keeping in mind that this particular tool cuts in "one direction" so to speak where as foils cut in opposing directions, or at least i think they they do...

a little back story, i currently wet shave using a DE razor, i can, with dedication, care and patients achieve a nick and cut free shave mostly irritation free, save a touch of redness, but this is only the case if i go exclusively with the grain, this in turn leaves substantial roughness in the opposite direction that the shave went (WTG)...i dislike the fact that my face after shaving is perfectly smooth in one direction and has the dreaded "sandpaper" effect in the opposite direction...(ATG)

having all this in mind, i bought the andis profoil a few months back, in the hope of being able to achieve a truly smooth shave, the andis did indeed provide me with a close shave, pretty much BBS in fact, but, i disliked how much the device vibrated, in fact it vibrated so much that after shaving with it my face was a little numb, and, and this is a big AND for me, it left a few stray hair, this was appalling for me as the rest of my face was smooth as glass so to speak and the few hairs really stood out, on top of these operational flaws i had severe redness, quite a few whiteheads a few days after, itching and so on, after one use of the andis i had to apply nivea balm at least three times in order to calm my skin enough so that i could get to sleep...

furthermore, i have also owned and tried the Oneblade by philips, it cut close enough, but left me with quite a few whiteheads a couple of days after shaving, actually the most i've had after shaving...the other qualm i had with it was the cutting element was tiny and i took numerous strokes to get anything done...i tried the oneblade wet, using exactly the same prep that i use for DE shaving, the results were worse, i ended up being shaved in patches as i could not see through my lather and the number of whiteheads seemed to amplify itself...my dog chewed up the device so i gave up on that type of "tech" (there are numerous tools similar to the oneblade, made by other companies, but the OB is touted as being the best of the bunch)

i have also read up on the subject on shavercheck, i have narrowed my possibilities down to the two devices in the title of this thread, from what i gather, both should be infinitely gentler than the andis, if this is not the case than i shall forego foil technology on the whole, if however they are, then the premise is as follows, the braun should be gentler than the arc 3 but the arc 3 should give a closer shave...

i can get both devices for 90-ish euros, with the braun being 5 euros more expensive, i also must state that in my third world country panasonics and brauns 30 day return policies are void, meaning, that you cannot return the devices ad hoc, i've spoken to a lady today who says i could try the device and if it tore my skin off i could return it, for this i had to spend quite some time on the phone, persuade, haggle and so on...

my loose plan would be to get the braun, as it is meant to be gentler than the arc 3 given my experience with foil tech with the andis, if it doesn't shave as well as i like, in both directions in regard to the grain, and if it gave me any irritation, then i would exchange it for the arc and give that a whirl...the braun is also said to be better at coping with longer and flat lying hairs than the arc although this newer series is said to inferior to the previous 5 series...

i would really appreciate any insight from anyone that has used these two devices,or just one of course, and also i wholeheartedly welcome any and all comments/experiences

Cheers everyone

I'd have to agree with @StewB
I went from electrics (30+ years) and started DE a few months ago. I hated shaving till I started wet shaving.
Now I love it!
I've tried rotary Norelco's, Braun, Remington & Panasonic foils.
Yes the electrics could go ATG but never as close as a DE razor (And I don't shave ATG with the DE).
I shave WTG and XTG and I get a closer shave than any electric ever did.
And I get the result with no ingrown hairs which is an issue with electrics.
Now, if you want to know what's the best electric though, I'd have to give the prize to Panasonic (You have to make sure it's a Made in Japan model). Read reviews, they are #1
Braun is not what the original German Braun was. They sold to Gillette and the quality went down the drain.
Remington is the same story now too.
And Norelco is great if you like rotaries. They are excellent and shave super close if you have more than 2 days of growth. (They aren't the best for daily use).
I still have my Panasonic (Arc 5 with cleaning base)!
The only negative about the Panasonic is the cost of replacing foils and shaving block roughly every year.
It will run you about $70!
I don't know what country you're in but here in the USA they are on sale right now with or without the cleaning/charging base at Best Buy (previous model! They have a newer one out already and it's more expensive):
Good luck,
LRod

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/panasonic-arc5-wet-dry-electric-shaver-silver/5535601.p?skuId=5535601&ref=212&loc=1&extStoreId=1411&ref=212&loc=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw1ZeUBhDyARIsAOzAqQIiGkFaAl76J7OZPAjYQ9kE2F0G5FL2MnEa_8Zsi49MAF5xsLxLD7saAqw9EALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/panasonic-arc5-automatic-cleaning-charging-wet-dry-electric-shaver-silver/5535400.p?skuId=5535400

 

[miffed]

My experience with electrics is that they are probably not going to get you where you want to go.

How long have you been using a DE razor? I have only been using a DE razor a little over 3 months and my shaves are superior to what I have ever been able to achieve with an electric.

My suggestion would be to try to improve your DE shaves before investing in an electric. No matter what you decide, though, pre-shave preparation will probably do more to help with irritation than anything else (and good technique, if you use a DE razor).

Reply back with whatever you decide, and let the community know your results. Good luck!

Hi StewB,
i sincerely thank you for your insight.

I have been using a DE razor for the best part of three months now, i shave about every three days, my main qualm is, that even if, in effect, what you get, so to speak, from a blade shave is "superior" in terms of what you can achieve, as you said, hands down, blades win 10/10 times, but after a day or so, hair starts to grow back and you practically look the same, at least i do...the terrible sensation of roughness is there again but it does not bother me as the entirety of my face is covered in stubble, but when you first shave the areas on your face that are not shaved ATG remain rough, sandpaper like...forgive me if i have not managed to explain this very well, it's still early hours here, plus it's a friday

as for prep and technique, i dare say i think i am ok, i try and keep my lather slick and wet, my technique is such that i shaved over pimples and did not cut myself, on occasion i do cut myself but much more often when i don't perceive that i have a pimple or some sort of acne underneath the lather...i absolutely agree with you that i need to improve each and every aspect of wet shaving, that is a given, but if i am honest i did manage to get glass like smooth skin when i used the andis i have never managed to achieve this with a blade, even when shaving ATG, this is the main reason i am seriously considering a switch back to electrics to be honest...

also when i do shave, talking DE, my skin does get red, it calms itself by morning the next day, as i shave mainly at night, but i have to use alum almost after every shave as i nick myself regularly for reasons mentioned above, and i finish off with a splash of choice, i have found the green proraso to work best with my skin, i forgot to wash the alum off of my face last night lol in effect i just applied some splash over it and that was that...

i will write back when and if i do go back to the "dark side" and indeed acquire an electric...

Have a lovely day

 

[miffed]

I'd have to agree with @StewB
I went from electrics (30+ years) and started DE a few months ago. I hated shaving till I started wet shaving.
Now I love it!
I've tried rotary Norelco's, Braun, Remington & Panasonic foils.
Yes the electrics could go ATG but never as close as a DE razor (And I don't shave ATG with the DE).
I shave WTG and XTG and I get a closer shave than any electric ever did.
And I get the result with no ingrown hairs which is an issue with electrics.
Now, if you want to know what's the best electric though, I'd have to give the prize to Panasonic (You have to make sure it's a Made in Japan model). Read reviews, they are #1
Braun is not what the original German Braun was. They sold to Gillette and the quality went down the drain.
Remington is the same story now too.
And Norelco is great if you like rotaries. They are excellent and shave super close if you have more than 2 days of growth. (They aren't the best for daily use).
I still have my Panasonic (Arc 5 with cleaning base)!
The only negative about the Panasonic is the cost of replacing foils and shaving block roughly every year.
It will run you about $70!
I don't know what country you're in but here in the USA they are on sale right now with or without the cleaning/charging base at Best Buy (previous model! They have a newer one out already and it's more expensive):
Good luck,
LRod

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/panasonic-arc5-wet-dry-electric-shaver-silver/5535601.p?skuId=5535601&ref=212&loc=1&extStoreId=1411&ref=212&loc=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw1ZeUBhDyARIsAOzAqQIiGkFaAl76J7OZPAjYQ9kE2F0G5FL2MnEa_8Zsi49MAF5xsLxLD7saAqw9EALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/panasonic-arc5-automatic-cleaning-charging-wet-dry-electric-shaver-silver/5535400.p?skuId=5535400

Hello LRod,
thank you for your reply, i appreciate it, really

I also agree with you and StewB, i also have taken a liking to shaving since i started wet shaving, as opposed to before when i deemed it a chore...

Alas i cannot pride myself with achieving better results with a DE going WTG and ATG, as i did last night whilst shaving, i simply cannot get the sides of my neck and areas below and close to my ears smooth, when i wash the lather off of my face i feel the roughness and i dislike that very much, so results wise i am definitely not there yet...and in serious doubt if my skin can actually manage irritation free DE shaving ....

Every time i shave, i nick myself, nothing major, it mostly stops by itself but the fact remains, i cut my face twice a week with a blade...this in my humble opinion is not either good nor needed...

My reasoning at this point would be to try and achieve results like i had with the andis but with no irritation and of course not leaving "strays" behind...

Indeed, you are right about braun as they definitely are not the real deal any more...

Now, as for the actual acquisition of an electric that is not a model that is 10 years old and such, this is quite a task here, by here i mean Sarajevo, so the Balkans in fact...

Allow me to elaborate, yesterday i rang the major stores which from you can buy electric shavers here, i enquired about the international policy (braun and panasonic) of being able to return the device if it does not suit you, surprise surprise, this policy does not apply here because "EU", that is the exact illiterate answer i got from three major stores, i translated it word for word, this situation in turn means that if a buy a device, i am struck with it...this makes choosing and ultimately buying a device quite precarious

The general consensus is that Panasonic is the Mac Daddy of shavers, i can get an arc 3 here, the es ll 21 to be specific for 95 euros, i can also get a braun 5 series the s5 downgraded model, base at that, for 100 euros, from a shop where the lady said i could get my money back if i used the device once, cleaned it, retained the complete packaging and so on...

I am, at this point in time, with the info i have available to me, closest to the arc 3, the reasoning being that i would buy that shaver try it and if it were too aggressive and/or did not suit my face i would exchange it for the braun 5 being the same price and shop in all...

There is also an eventuality i have to factor in and that is that it is said you have to shave with said electric for three weeks at least for your face to get use to it, i can hardly do this in one shave, so again it is a risk buying and/or returning any shaver if we are to be methodical...

Thank you very much for supplying me with those link, alas, i cannot use them, and online shopping here is quite a hassle, first and foremost you cannot return items bought online save shipping them back and so on, this is not an option for me as it would be too time consuming, i generally use cash and get major discounts on everything...

I have the option of kindly asking a friend or relative to buy a device for me from Austria, Germany, Switzerland and the UK respectively, and then to collect it from said individual, again i have pretty much the same problem with this as i would be again trying something based on other peoples (respected) opinions and reviews and as we all very well know, your mileage may vary...

so as my username says, i am in fact quite miffed

Also, i am very interested in you opinion of Philips rotaries, i believe i can get a series 5 here for a touch above 100 euros so i am considering this as an option as well, again thanks to you, so any and all input is very welcome...

All things considered, also taking the nature of life into account, the fact that we are essentially organisms (quite virus like in fact when considering how we destroy each other and all things around us) floating around on a rock, orbiting a mass of gas held together by gravity, which i also believe we do not fully understand, on top of this, the fact that life, based on empirical evidence is effectually a fluke, i will "chance" it with my shaver... (if i offended anyone with this opinion i do apologise, freedom of speech in all)

The pictures show quite well what i managed to "achieve" last night with a DE razor, king c gillete, glillette platinum blade (5), dove gentle exfoliating soap bar, proraso sensitive cream for the shave itself, alum block after (forgot to wash it off) and proraso green splash to finish, as one can plainly see, i am not "irritation" free not by a long shot, hence my, i think justified, search for a tool that would suffice...

i thank you again for reading what i wrote, and i am looking forward to any and all input on foils and electrics of all shapes and sizes, but the most useful info would actually be on the devices i can get here, i wont bore any further...

Have a great day

 

[StewB]

the fact that life, based on empirical evidence is effectually a fluke, i will "chance" it with my shaver... (if i offended anyone with this opinion i do apologise, freedom of speech in all)

To offer a counterpoint about life being a fluke: You may be surprised at the mounting research that strongly suggests the opposite of this assertion. I won't say more here as it would be off-topic, but DM me if you want to discuss.

In any case, regarding shaving: Electrics do work, but in my experience insufficient pre-shave prep will still result in irritation and ingrown hairs. I would still suggest working carefully with your DE razor and continue to practice on technique. I have not yet been able to achieve a full BBS in a few places (in particular, just along and under my jawline), but that's not my goal. My goal is a DFS: A very close shave, smooth results on my cheek and neck, and especially no irritation. I am able to achieve this result much more easily with a DE razor than an electric.

Work on your technique, and I think it will be worth your efforts.

 

[Scaramouche]

The general concensus is that Braun makes the foil shavers that are kindest to your face, Panasonic makes the closest. That also varies among their lineups, but a general statement. I use both, as well as Philips rotaries. That prefaced, your face is different. Meaning from everyone else's. The good news about most electrics is that the major manufacturers have generous return policies, so you're able to try them out, which I recommend. Your shaving history is pretty short, so you may not have given DEs a fair shake yet, and technique means a lot more than what blade or razor you use, and there are many mild DEs discussed on this forum and others that can give you an irritation-free, nickless shave. And then there are cartridge razors, which some find more comfortable and forgiving than DE razors. Many experienced shavers with years behind them find themselves still exploring to find that "perfect" razor, and the "perfect" soap/AS/pre-shave combo, and the "perfect" technique.

All that said, and addressing your request, an electric can provide a good shave too, but technique matters there as well. You will NOT get a shave as close as a blade with an electric. You just won't. And that may not be a bad thing in your case, because a closer shave can mean more irritation and ingrowns. A foil electric will usually provide a closer shave than a rotary, simply because of the design - thinner foils. If that's part of your goal, a foil might be a good choice, and I recommend a Braun. They historically are less irritating, and do pick up longer hairs better than does Panasonic. Which brings up another point - electrics by design are made to shave a shorter beard - as in daily shaving. No electric performs best with several days' growth, so you need to shave frequently with any electric. And the foil/comb of an electric will be in contact with your face more than a blade, and longer, so using an electric will require your skin to adapt - most manufacturers recommend a month of shaving exclusively with their product to give your face time to sort of "toughen up" to an electric, and I'd say that's ballpark right. Foil shavers are also generally considered to be more comfortable than rotaries - although that varies depending on your particular face and technique - so starting with a foil is a good choice for that reason as well. The Panasonics in my experience provide a closer shave with less vibration than Brauns, but can cause "razor burn" easier, mainly because of too much pressure applied, but with a light touch and good technique are capable of providing a shave nearly as close as an average DE shave. There are other foil manufacturers, and I've tried them, but as a recommendation I'd stick with either of these as a first choice.

Advancing from the above, and from personal experience, I find shaving long-term with a foil shaver tends to give me occasional ingrowns, likely because of paradoxically providing a closer shave. When I switch to a rotary Norelco, my face feels better eventually because it doesn't cut my beard as close - acceptable, but not as close. A rotary is also orders of magnitude quieter than any foil, if that matters to you, with far less vibration in use. And again, capable of giving you a good, socially acceptable shave with the right technique. As far as cleaning, foil shavers are easier to clean manually - two or three sets of separate and more delicate cutters and combs in a rotary are more fiddly to deal with, but many models offer an automatic cleaner, which is much more convenient using a rotary. If a foil seems to be more irritating for you, switching to a rotary might improve your shave.

And adding to everything, many electrics can be used dry or wet - wet meaning anything from water to shaving foam or soap. I personally use an electric with all of the software (soap, pre-shave, aftershave) that I use with my DE razors, and find I get the most comfortable, irritation-free shaves using them. You might give that a try as well, particularly using a pre-shave like Proraso (with a blade or electric), although there are many. Good luck, and keep us posted on progress!

 

[miffed]

To offer a counterpoint about life being a fluke: You may be surprised at the mounting research that strongly suggests the opposite of this assertion. I won't say more here as it would be off-topic, but DM me if you want to discuss.

In any case, regarding shaving: Electrics do work, but in my experience insufficient pre-shave prep will still result in irritation and ingrown hairs. I would still suggest working carefully with your DE razor and continue to practice on technique. I have not yet been able to achieve a full BBS in a few places (in particular, just along and under my jawline), but that's not my goal. My goal is a DFS: A very close shave, smooth results on my cheek and neck, and especially no irritation. I am able to achieve this result much more easily with a DE razor than an electric.

Work on your technique, and I think it will be worth your efforts.

Morning StewB,
thank you for your thoughts, i agree with you about everything you wrote...

i personally do not chase the unicorn that is a bbs shave, but having having experienced the smoothness of my skin after using the andis profil, it was smooth as glass in all directions, i sometimes admittedly overdo it and try to achieve this, especially around the farthest point that hair grows on the sides of my neck practically...

i again shaved with a DE razor last night, although with a fresh king c gillette blade, the results were, well, very compelling, i first off did not cut myself, at least not like i did before, i might have nicked myself behind my left ear although this stopped on it's own, i had truly forgotten about it till now, anyway, the morning after so to speak, as i sit here in the office, i can already fell some resistance when i run my finger across my face, so go figure...

i have to pat myself on the back, after my first pass WTG i had literally no redness, whatsoever, anywhere...i was very pleased, after the second pass as well, nearly none...only a touch in a few places...

All the above stated goes to prove your assertion "Work on your technique, and I think it will be worth your efforts" - it definitely is...

The reasons for wanting and actually getting an electric might have changed somewhat, we will see...alas if an electric cannot shave me with 0 irritation, like a DE razor can, then it would be pointless for me to get one...i woulkd however like to have a respectable electric for situations where i do not have the time to properly wet shave, travelling, vacation, etc etc

We shall see in any case

Cheers

 

[miffed]

The general concensus is that Braun makes the foil shavers that are kindest to your face, Panasonic makes the closest. That also varies among their lineups, but a general statement. I use both, as well as Philips rotaries. That prefaced, your face is different. Meaning from everyone else's. The good news about most electrics is that the major manufacturers have generous return policies, so you're able to try them out, which I recommend. Your shaving history is pretty short, so you may not have given DEs a fair shake yet, and technique means a lot more than what blade or razor you use, and there are many mild DEs discussed on this forum and others that can give you an irritation-free, nickless shave. And then there are cartridge razors, which some find more comfortable and forgiving than DE razors. Many experienced shavers with years behind them find themselves still exploring to find that "perfect" razor, and the "perfect" soap/AS/pre-shave combo, and the "perfect" technique.

All that said, and addressing your request, an electric can provide a good shave too, but technique matters there as well. You will NOT get a shave as close as a blade with an electric. You just won't. And that may not be a bad thing in your case, because a closer shave can mean more irritation and ingrowns. A foil electric will usually provide a closer shave than a rotary, simply because of the design - thinner foils. If that's part of your goal, a foil might be a good choice, and I recommend a Braun. They historically are less irritating, and do pick up longer hairs better than does Panasonic. Which brings up another point - electrics by design are made to shave a shorter beard - as in daily shaving. No electric performs best with several days' growth, so you need to shave frequently with any electric. And the foil/comb of an electric will be in contact with your face more than a blade, and longer, so using an electric will require your skin to adapt - most manufacturers recommend a month of shaving exclusively with their product to give your face time to sort of "toughen up" to an electric, and I'd say that's ballpark right. Foil shavers are also generally considered to be more comfortable than rotaries - although that varies depending on your particular face and technique - so starting with a foil is a good choice for that reason as well. The Panasonics in my experience provide a closer shave with less vibration than Brauns, but can cause "razor burn" easier, mainly because of too much pressure applied, but with a light touch and good technique are capable of providing a shave nearly as close as an average DE shave. There are other foil manufacturers, and I've tried them, but as a recommendation I'd stick with either of these as a first choice.

Advancing from the above, and from personal experience, I find shaving long-term with a foil shaver tends to give me occasional ingrowns, likely because of paradoxically providing a closer shave. When I switch to a rotary Norelco, my face feels better eventually because it doesn't cut my beard as close - acceptable, but not as close. A rotary is also orders of magnitude quieter than any foil, if that matters to you, with far less vibration in use. And again, capable of giving you a good, socially acceptable shave with the right technique. As far as cleaning, foil shavers are easier to clean manually - two or three sets of separate and more delicate cutters and combs in a rotary are more fiddly to deal with, but many models offer an automatic cleaner, which is much more convenient using a rotary. If a foil seems to be more irritating for you, switching to a rotary might improve your shave.

And adding to everything, many electrics can be used dry or wet - wet meaning anything from water to shaving foam or soap. I personally use an electric with all of the software (soap, pre-shave, aftershave) that I use with my DE razors, and find I get the most comfortable, irritation-free shaves using them. You might give that a try as well, particularly using a pre-shave like Proraso (with a blade or electric), although there are many. Good luck, and keep us posted on progress!

Morning Scaramouche,
lovely reply, much appreciated...

you mentioned return policies, the first thing i did when i seriously stared considering an electric was to contact the official distributors of philips, braun and the only shop that sells an arc 3 here, anything above the es ll 21 you'd have to order from abroad...the jist of the matter is that they actually do not allow a return of any kind here, if they did, i'd probably start off with a braun 7 series (195 euros), and if that didn't work, then the philips 7000 and then the arc3 and so on....

as this is not the case, i face the conundrum that i do...

As i got a DFS shave last night with a DE razor, i would really only get and keep a razor that is literally irritation free, so again i am leaning towards braun as the general consensus is that they are best for irritation and so on...
the model i am closest to is the series 5 1000...it gets mixed reviews on amazon and such, and overall it seems to be a worse shaver than the 5 series before it, i can get a braun 3010 for 87.5 euros, this is said to be good but a series 5 for a couple of bucks more simply makes more sense...

i have discovered a shop that might have a kind of solution for me...they sell both the 5 series and es ll 21, and a lady over the phone told me i could return the shaver i bought after one careful use and so on, i was thinking of getting the series 5,
form what i gather i might not shave well enough but should not give me irritation...

i am reluctant about the es ll 21 because it has a 13000 motor, the andis profoil i used had i think 9000 max, and after one use it "numbed" my face...although people that have actually bought it say it's excellent for sensitive skin...

i would also be interested in trying a rotary, but the shop that would eventually agree to refund a shaver does not sell philips so i might end up with a 100 euro 5000 series that does nothing for me...

i have of course read what the shavercheck guy Oviedo thinks about all the razors i can get my hands on here and the conclusions i have drawn are also based in part on his opinions...

strictly sticking to the sort of cutting technology, i have only not given a rotary a try, this would be the empirical next step alas i have not managed to find a philips distributor that would allow me to buy a decent philips rotary and return it of it tore me up...i will try to find one today...not hopeful though

i mistakenly bought some Brut aftershave, i thought i'd treat myself, my wife ended up paying for it in the end, it was only 4 euros, a tad under actually, but, when i got home i was in fact a sort of Brut eau de toillete, horrible, when you apply it...dismal

i used proraso green spalash...seems best for me...

Cheers and thanks again for your time

 

[miffed]

Just a small update electric shaver wise...

I got the chance to have a nice walk while at work today, and as chance would have it i strolled into a shop that, amongst other things, sells electric shavers, they even had various models on display...so, for the first time i saw what the series 5 and series 7 brauns look like, as well as the arc 3 and arc 5 models...

Thank God i ventured out for a walk today...i cannot begin to describe my disappointment with said devices, admittedly i did not use any of them, but the sheer "cheapness" just appalled me...the don't look like shaving tools for men, much rather like toy shavers for small boys...

i completely agree with one gentleman that stated braun was not he same after being bought by a certain conglomerate...to make things even more bleak for the new series 5 and 7 there was a big picture, poster if you will, of the old 5 and 7 series' below the show case where the devices were the new generation devices were displayed, it's plain to see that the new devices are very "plasticky", again i must use the word cheap...they just feel wrong, to look at, touch et cetera i have to state that in my humble opinion the series 3 is a better looker than both the 5 and 7 series...again i have no idea how they perform, this is just my very personal opinion based on looks and build quality...

as for the arc models, the es ll 21 looks much like the brauns, in that it feels mighty cheap, plasticky, small even and so on...it actually took me back to 1995 to a chain of stores called "Tandy" or "Tandy's" this was in the UK when i was a child, the thing that actually took me back was that the build, on the outside of course, the plastic itself, very much resembled the build of stuff (cheap stuff of course, we had Sony even in the 90's ) that was on display back in the golden '90 in said store...the arc 5 was in its box inside a cabinet, the guy selling the shavers was not aware they even had it, i had to ask him...the price of said shaver...350 euros, so i just laughed that instance off to be honest, for that kind of money you can buy literally what you please, plus this was still a foil shaver...

having seen and felt foil shavers for what they are, i opted to go down philips' avenue, ie try a rotary, so...i ventured to acquire one, the 7 series is meant for sensitive skin, or so it says...now the problem with said shaver was first i cannot get it here, the official philips store only sells models up to and including the 5 series...no 6 or 7 series, but, alas, even if they did sell it i wouldn't buy it from them, as they do not allow you to return the shaver?!

then fate stepped in, my best friend (was even the best man at his wedding ) very thoughtfully and kindly offered to buy me whatever i wanted and bring it here, this would be quite an easy feat as he lives in a very civilised part of the World, Vienna if i didn't have him i'd be stuck in 2010 technology wise...

the device that will be arriving in Sarajevo on Thursday is, suspenseful music playing, the s7788/55, as my friend is coming to SA to get something done on his car he will simply bring the shaver with him, i intend to use it on a 4 day beard, as i have shaved yesterday night...we shall see, i have placed my full faith in philips, but, if things do go pear shaped, my friend can return the shaver for a full refund as he is going back to Austria next monday or tuesday...so i believe i am covered...

although, just to make things more complicated, and generally spite me, i managed a DFS last night lol

the plan is to shave thursday night with the philips and then see what we get, i just hope that my post on friday will be full of smiley faces and not the crying ones...

i must report that i, at the moment, feel relieved, at ease so to speak, so i am hoping that i might be mad enough to be receiving and interpreting good omens

Cheers

 

[Gauthier]

Thank God i ventured out for a walk today...i cannot begin to describe my disappointment with said devices, admittedly i did not use any of them, but the sheer "cheapness" just appalled me...the don't look like shaving tools for men, much rather like toy shavers for small boys...

i completely agree with one gentleman that stated braun was not he same after being bought by a certain conglomerate...to make things even more bleak for the new series 5 and 7 there was a big picture, poster if you will, of the old 5 and 7 series' below the show case where the devices were the new generation devices were displayed, it's plain to see that the new devices are very "plasticky", again i must use the word cheap...they just feel wrong, to look at, touch et cetera i have to state that in my humble opinion the series 3 is a better looker than both the 5 and 7 series...again i have no idea how they perform, this is just my very personal opinion based on looks and build quality...

The new shavers do indeed look and feel like junk in comparison with the shavers from the 1990's and before. Then, it was not unusual for a shaver to last for 20 years or more, and they could always be repaired. Now, they are designed for a serviceable life of at most six years. There's no point in trying to have them repaired. If you absolutely must have an electric shaver, look for the best bargain possible, so that you can write it off without too many regrets. You won't find yourself identifying with it.

 

[Scaramouche]

Great news! And yes, newer electrics are mainly plastic, which does not in fact affect their function or performance. Partly because of manufacturing costs, but essentially to save weight. Very few electrics are substantially metal - some in the Andis line (which are mostly barber razors just for trimming) and Philips' 9000 Prestige series (and couple of high end Panasonics). And they're really no more effective for purpose than their mostly plastic counterparts and not necessarily more durable, the metal bits being mainly cosmetic.

The new Philips line are great electrics, with some caveats. They're slightly heavier and bulkier than previous models, because the trimmer is integral and the head is redesigned as a flip-top (like some of Philips' original rotaries), which is more convenient for use and cleaning, but adds more weight (although also substantially plastic). And the square heads are not quite as maneuverable, requiring a slightly different rotary technique. They're also Bluetooth capable with the GroomTribe app, which is interesting (and also not necessary to use it - the razor is fine as an "unconnected" razor), and unique to Philips. It does provide some helpful coaching and tracks your shaves, but is another element that may be intimidating to new shavers. The cleaning station is also unique - powered by the razor - but is useful in the cleaning process and more compact. I actually like the new models, and they're very nice razors, but for previous Philips rotary users may require some adapting. The heads of these new models are particularly comfortable for a rotary, a plus, but might not perform as well as the older heads on a 4-day growth. I use a new 9000 series and it is one of my favorite rotaries, so I'll be interested to hear your experience. Just remember one shave is not a true measure of efficiency or comfort, and in my experience rotaries require more adjustment than foils for your face to fully adapt - a couple of weeks at least - and again a shorter beard gives better results.

 

[miffed]

The new shavers do indeed look and feel like junk in comparison with the shavers from the 1990's and before. Then, it was not unusual for a shaver to last for 20 years or more, and they could always be repaired. Now, they are designed for a serviceable life of at most six years. There's no point in trying to have them repaired. If you absolutely must have an electric shaver, look for the best bargain possible, so that you can write it off without too many regrets. You won't find yourself identifying with it.

'morning Gauthier,
thank you for your input, i was quite gutted yesterday when i saw those toys which are now sold as electric razors, premium at that, as for me absolutely having to have one, well, day 2 (today) after my wet shave i appear to have about three whiteheads so i am putting my faith in the Philips i have on the way...

As for getting a bargain, well, given the circumstances i will be getting a 7 series with the cleaning pod thing for 130 euros, the same device without the pod costs around 200 euros here so that's a really good deal for me, also, if it indeed does not perform well it can be returned, i do however hope that this rotary will be my last stop...

Cheers

 

[miffed]

Great news! And yes, newer electrics are mainly plastic, which does not in fact affect their function or performance. Partly because of manufacturing costs, but essentially to save weight. Very few electrics are substantially metal - some in the Andis line (which are mostly barber razors just for trimming) and Philips' 9000 Prestige series (and couple of high end Panasonics). And they're really no more effective for purpose than their mostly plastic counterparts and not necessarily more durable, the metal bits being mainly cosmetic.

The new Philips line are great electrics, with some caveats. They're slightly heavier and bulkier than previous models, because the trimmer is integral and the head is redesigned as a flip-top (like some of Philips' original rotaries), which is more convenient for use and cleaning, but adds more weight (although also substantially plastic). And the square heads are not quite as maneuverable, requiring a slightly different rotary technique. They're also Bluetooth capable with the GroomTribe app, which is interesting (and also not necessary to use it - the razor is fine as an "unconnected" razor), and unique to Philips. It does provide some helpful coaching and tracks your shaves, but is another element that may be intimidating to new shavers. The cleaning station is also unique - powered by the razor - but is useful in the cleaning process and more compact. I actually like the new models, and they're very nice razors, but for previous Philips rotary users may require some adapting. The heads of these new models are particularly comfortable for a rotary, a plus, but might not perform as well as the older heads on a 4-day growth. I use a new 9000 series and it is one of my favorite rotaries, so I'll be interested to hear your experience. Just remember one shave is not a true measure of efficiency or comfort, and in my experience rotaries require more adjustment than foils for your face to fully adapt - a couple of weeks at least - and again a shorter beard gives better results.

'morning Scaramouche,
Thanks!!

I appreciate all the info, of course i agree with you...

I hope i have the main points covered, the only loose part of my plan is that i will only get two shaves per se before i decide whether to keep the device...i will try to shave on Thursday, that's the earliest i can do so, my friend is arriving on that day around 19h,it probably takes an hour to charge so i will be aiming for a nine o'clock night shave if i have approximated things accurately...this will practically be on a 4 days beard, but, i am quite light haired, although my beard is black in colour, but i trust it to be quite supple as opposed to other mens beards, i dare say that my 4 days of growth is quite akin to a more common two days of growth...i trust that shorter beards yield better results, as you pointed out, but i think that my beard is not strong enough to shave after two days at least three by my estimate...

the second shave is intended for sunday...now, i agree with you that i should dedicate a month or so to this type of tech, but, alas things are what they are, if i did so i probably would not be able to return it if it didn't suit me...so i'll have to base my decision on the two shaves as mentioned above...

Things have in general gone down in quality, by leaps and bounds i dare say, seeing the shavers first hand was indeed a pivotal moment for me, plus the lad selling them was also unusually honest with me...he pointed me in the direction of Philips stating that they sold so well they didn't have a single one left in the shop...
it is a shame that you can't get normal return policies here (as well as other more important things of course) i might have even gone for another (higher) model, but from what i read the 7000 series is quite good for skin irritation, so here's hoping...

Cheers

 

[Scaramouche]

 

[Gauthier]

Good morning Miffed.

I do hope that your new electric shaver will work out well for you. The only other advice can give you is to try and keep a light touch.

Cheers,

Gauthier

 

[Filudo]

try the Phillips one , using pre electric shave (Lectric) by Menem. Then apply an aftershave....whichever with alcohol.... Try this before wasting more money in another useless electric.

 

[miffed]

Good morning Miffed.

I do hope that your new electric shaver will work out well for you. The only other advice can give you is to try and keep a light touch.

Cheers,

Gauthier

'morning Gauthier,
thank you for your kind wihses, i hope it works as well, i have never used a new gen rotary so i have i like it but primarily that it does the job...the device itself has arrived already, it's in Vienna at the moment, should have it tomorrow night in my possession and then i hope i will have reached the end of my quest...if not...well i'll probably go back to wet shaving...
we'll see
Cheers

 

[miffed]

try the Phillips one , using pre electric shave (Lectric) by Menem. Then apply an aftershave....whichever with alcohol.... Try this before wasting more money in another useless electric.

'morining Filudo,
thanks for your advice, i intend to try it dry first tomorrow night and then perhaps with shaving soap or even with proraso preshave...sadly we dont have the product you kindly recommended that's why i'd go with the proraso...as for splash, again, proraso green splash...if the rotary does not perform, it will be on it's way back as early as next monday

cheers

 

[miffed]

Top of the morning to everyone reading, although there does not seem to be many reading lol
anyway...an update

i indeed received the Philips 7788/55, i do like the look of it, the friend who brought it to me commented that it looks like something out of star trek, the build is good in my opinion as well...

I actually like they shave it gave me, my face right after shaving was indeed smooth all over, in every direction, at that moment i was very happy with it and myself having chosen it (sidenote a "bbs" shave is word for word baby butt smooth, if this implies that your entire face is smooth all over then the device gave me a bbs if it however translates to softness and such, i have no children, nor can i attest to the smoothness of their posteriors, i presume them to be quite soft, so i can't credibly go into softness)...alas, this lasted till day two after shaving...then whiteheads galore...lots and lots of them...i have some pics that attest to this,you have have a look, again, i must state that i am saddened by this turn of events, there is little hope for me using electrics to be honest...i might try and get in touch with that shaver check guy seems to know his stuff maybe he has a suggestion, i'll see...

the Philips is on its way back to Jeff Bezos, and my attention has shifted to wet shaving until i find something that can do a better job...i used it only once, with results that can me seen below, when i was giving it back to my friend we tried turning it on, and we could not...i might have a travel lock of sorts i dont think it actually broke after one use, but i had to state this for honesty's sake...

i might treat myself to a new razor in a couple of months...merkur most probably 34 rose gold...

Have a great day everyone, i'm keeping it short as i seem to be writing to my

self...