I am think of trying a coticule. However, I am confused about the blue and yellow. The blue seems to generally a lower grit equivalent (4000), but with a slurry, it seems the yellow may function similarly. Anyway, the questions are: 1) Can I get away with just a yellow coticule? 2) Even if the yellow is all you need, why do people use the blue? I have a 1K Shapton for bevel setting. THANKS!
Blue, yellow?
- Thread starter NavyShave
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You can use just the yellow Coticule. Even when I had a Belgian Blue, more often than not I'd not use it. Bart, who will hopefully chime in here, has done some very interesting investigations.
Very interesting indeed.
I hope Bart can correct me if Im wrong but with the blue you can clean up minor chips as it is not the case with the yellow.
I hope Bart can correct me if Im wrong but with the blue you can clean up minor chips as it is not the case with the yellow.
Although Bart is the man for the best info on these, I never really found the blue to be too useful. Anything it could do, a Coticule with a slurry could do.
If your yellow is slow with slurry, the blue with slurry may be faster.
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- #6
So, I read somewhere recently that there is a lower% of granite in a blue stone...I would think that it would cut slower because of that. Hum...
Lower % of garnets. Coticules are 30% to 40% garnet while Blues are 20% to 30%.
I have used both blue and yellow. I don't undersatnd why blue is rated 4k and yellow 8k. my opinion is the blue with slurry is a little slower and the yellow is quiker with slurry. I think the blue has less garnets but they are bigger in size. The yellow has more garnets as mentioned above but they are smaller in size. My blue is redundant as i only use the yellow coticule. When used with slurry the yellow can remove steel like a 1k, The thinner the slurry gets the less abrasive the hone becomes, also the more the hone will refine your razors edge untill finaly you can polish by using just water. The finish i get of my yellow gives a smoother shave as any paste can achieve.
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- #10
I am excited to order and receive my coticule. I think I am going to stick with just the yellow and learn the ways of the slurry! Now the size...the 6x2 is fairly affordable, and it is a huge leap to the 8x2. I am favoring the 6x2. Any opinions?
I have a few in 6 x 2 and a 15 sqin bout. I can't see ever needing anything bigger than a 6 x 2.
I've got a 6x2, and it's perfectly serviceable. I really do wish I'd sprung for the 8x2, though.
There'll be more to come soon regarding what exactly a BBW can do by itself... 
There'll be more to come soon regarding what exactly a BBW can do by itself...
Can't wait, Paul. I always love to learn from you experience.
working on that experience, Sir... I'll share everything I know when it's good information. Don't worry 
Not only is a narrower hone more economical and perfectly serviceable, it also has distinct advantages. When I was honing up my 7-day set (and believe me, getting 7 "identical" razors to shave identically is a real challenge) I had a lot of trouble with Thursday and Saturday. Well, I discovered that they were ever so slightly warped to the extent that they were good shavers, but not as good as the other two. In fact, something that I wouldn't have noticed if they weren't part of a set. It turned out that the easiest way to hone them is on a narrow hone, which automatically corrects for slight deformations in the blade. In fact, on the basis of that experience I had my two 3"-inch-wide hones cut in half.
I did an experiment with the BBW when I got my DT and wanted to compare the two. I set bevels on razors on a King 1k, and then did one with the BBW and one with the DT (identical Sheffield quarter hollows). Started with slurry, diluted, ended with just water. Got very comfortable shaves off both. I don't know how one would estimate grit, but the shaves were at least as comfortable of an 8k synthetic. I never tried setting a bevel with my BBW, DT, Coti, or any other natural hone because, to be honest, you can buy a 1k synthetic for $20 and there is no reason not to.
Having said that, a coticule (at least mine) with heavy slurry will set a bevel (note: not restorative honing) as fast as my Shapton 1K... It's all preference really, IMHO
Fact is that they're are differences in BBWs, as well as inCoticule.
In the extremes, they touch. But in general a BBW is much slower than a Coticule. As a rough estimate, I'd say 4 times as slow on average.. On Coticule.be, with a group of gentlemen who volunteered to do research on the topic, we're trying to establish good reliable procedure for getting the best edge possible off a BBW. While doing the preliminary research, I 've honed razors on quite a few different BWWs lately. One thing I've found, is that most of them don't work well on water. They seem to be so slow that the deterioration at the very edge (from rubbing edge-first over the hone) is greater than the keenness gain by removing steel from the bevel facets. I found that, for finishing on the BBW, an edge trailing approach allows for a significant improvement. I have yet to assess the repercussions of that on edge longevity. Extremely light slurry (one back and forth rub with the slurry stone) seems to deliver the best results for finishing.
For honing on slurry, in general, the BBW exerts less of the "slurry-dulling" effect than a Coticule. For this reason, many people find it beneficial to include the BBW in their honing progression. They go: Coticule/slurry - BBW/slurry - Coticule/water. If you prefer a DMT1200 for bevel correction, you get the well-known DMT - BBW - Coticule progression. But with some experience, one can learn to get the same by slowly diluting the slurry on a Coticule, which renders the BBW redundant.
With the BBW procedures we're currently investigating, a very good edge is possible with just a BBW. I'm eager to find out if our "blind" test panel will be able to discern between the edges of one Coticule and 2 BBWs, and how they will qualify the differences.
Kind regards,
Bart.
In the extremes, they touch. But in general a BBW is much slower than a Coticule. As a rough estimate, I'd say 4 times as slow on average.. On Coticule.be, with a group of gentlemen who volunteered to do research on the topic, we're trying to establish good reliable procedure for getting the best edge possible off a BBW. While doing the preliminary research, I 've honed razors on quite a few different BWWs lately. One thing I've found, is that most of them don't work well on water. They seem to be so slow that the deterioration at the very edge (from rubbing edge-first over the hone) is greater than the keenness gain by removing steel from the bevel facets. I found that, for finishing on the BBW, an edge trailing approach allows for a significant improvement. I have yet to assess the repercussions of that on edge longevity. Extremely light slurry (one back and forth rub with the slurry stone) seems to deliver the best results for finishing.
For honing on slurry, in general, the BBW exerts less of the "slurry-dulling" effect than a Coticule. For this reason, many people find it beneficial to include the BBW in their honing progression. They go: Coticule/slurry - BBW/slurry - Coticule/water. If you prefer a DMT1200 for bevel correction, you get the well-known DMT - BBW - Coticule progression. But with some experience, one can learn to get the same by slowly diluting the slurry on a Coticule, which renders the BBW redundant.
With the BBW procedures we're currently investigating, a very good edge is possible with just a BBW. I'm eager to find out if our "blind" test panel will be able to discern between the edges of one Coticule and 2 BBWs, and how they will qualify the differences.
Kind regards,
Bart.
- Thread starter
- #20
Thank you for the very informative posts. I am leaning towards just the yellow coticule and learning the slurry dilution technique. I have a few shapton's if I need to set a bevel quickly or abandon the coticule temporarily! 
