Alpha Outlaw Evolution vs Aylsworth Apex

[wetshaver233]

Hello my fellow RAD patients ! How are you doing today? Are you thinking about getting a new razor, two or more just like I'm currently thinking?

Jokes aide, these two razors caught my attention and I would like to know more about them and then make up my mind. Both of them have become quite popular and hyped recently and I've read some bold reviews claiming that the Apex is on pair with the best of the best DE razors on the market and even supposed some of them! I've heard that story before, but I always wonder if maybe, just maybe that's true and here am I - asking those who own one of them or perhaps someone owns both to share any information about the usual stuff like the blade feel, blade exposure, efficiency, which angle works better, how they perform ATG, are they really that good as the reviews claim etc.

 

[gdawg55]

I’ve had two Alpha razors, the Outlaw and the Clamore. Both had blade alignment issues that drove me nuts. Once the blade was aligned the shaves were pretty good. I decided I had better things to do than worry about blade alignment so I sold them.

Maybe I got a couple of duds but I was disappointed in them.

 

[wetshaver233]

I’ve had two Alpha razors, the Outlaw and the Clamore. Both had blade alignment issues that drove me nuts. Once the blade was aligned the shaves were pretty good. I decided I had better things to do than worry about blade alignment so I sold them.

Maybe I got a couple of duds but I was disappointed in them.

I'm interested about the latest version, which is said to have been improved a lot.

 

[Iridian]

The Alpha Outlaw 2023 must be an entirely different beast than the first Outlaw. The claim of 300% more blade clamping seems to be, not sure about percentages, quite spot on: The blade is held much more firmly, so it doesn't sound as loud as the original Outlaw and is basically, despite the name and visual similarities, an entirely new head. Based on hearsay from a trusted poster.

A 316L version with the new handle is now also offered, though only in matte, which isn't my thing.

The titanium version is lovely, what is holding me back is the price.

I also heard about the Claymore issues with certain AC blades, my Outlaw had no issues, though.

@gdawg55 I can totally understand you, two duds in a row would also make me very much not likely to try for a third time. If you can get one of their handles from somewhere, they are excellent. The Viper 95, also sold by Executive Shaving, for instance is still one of my favorite handles ever. I also like the Alpha Bravo handle, which is knurl after knurl, just a bit short for my liking. They have an almost polished machining and I absolutely love them.

I hope to see a photo of a user here how matte the 316L matte version really is, I might consider that one, the price is attractive. But it is not only that, last time I bought there Hongkong Post was the only option, DHL Express, my usual favorite, was not offered. So I had to pay my custom etc. etc. fees and pick it up at the local post office. I see the point of leaving the middle man out for smaller companies/artisans, but really would love to see some more shipping options.

@wetshaver233 the looks remained similar, for titanium a new spiral design for the handles and stand, but the head changed clamping and stuff quite dramatically, only visually it looks still very much like the old one. As I said, it's an entirely new beast. I cannot comment on Apex, but I heard Yates did the machining for them in the past and that's a recommendation in my book. Don't know how their razors shave, the Drakkant had quite some Yates style characteristics judging by looks, though.

 

[SaguaroSmart]

I cannot comment on the Outlaw evolution.
I have tried the Apex and I would describe it as an Overlander with significantly more efficiency but more risk.

It's a very strange razor to me. This is what I mean by strange: you can barely feel the blade (a bit more than the Overlander) but somehow if you are not careful, it's very easy to end up with weepers and you won't even feel them happening. I'm not sure if it's the angle of the blade or what.

I guess I'm surprised by this razor because I've used many razors that have much more blade feel without getting weepers and this one feels gentle yet I have to be quite careful. I think it's because they found a blade exposure / angle that really makes it super efficient yet minimizes the feel of the blade so It is deceiving and since you don't feel the blade you can easily get too comfortable and apply too much pressure or neglect your angle.

I would say, if you are looking for a high efficiency low blade feel razor you will probably like it but it comes with those caveats so be careful. I would almost go as far as to say the Apex has as high efficiency as razors like the 3one6 or Rocca or more but with the blade feel of the Overlander (maybe a tad bit more).

Take this with a grain of salt, for context:

I usually shave with medium razors like the EJ 3one6. (It's very weird because the 3one6 definitely has more blade feel but does not put weepers on me).

While I can stand medium razors just fine, my skin is not the toughest, I could never shave daily with an R41 for example.

I have only shaved with the Apex for 4 days so maybe I need to adjust my technique.

PS: I will try to revisit this thread as I shave more with it

 

[Iridian]

I would really love some Outlaw Evolution owners to tell us a bit more about it.

 

[Slapo]

I would really love some Outlaw Evolution owners to tell us a bit more about it.

Well, I have one (two, actually... the second one for a bargain price), but haven't used it much yet - been in one passaround after the other lately.
I don't have the Apex to compare it against, unfortunately, only the Drakkant Plus plate.

In the next few days, I should be having a comparison shave with the Outlaw Evolution against Reggie's Razors Jupiter (the latter is not available for sale yet, only in a public UK passaround).

I can also have a shave-off between the Outlaw Evolution and the Muhle Rocca at some point, but later.
I have done several rounds between the Rocca and the Edwin Jagger 3ONE6, and the Rocca came out on top for me - the 3ONE6 could perhaps be slightly more efficient, but they're in the same ballpark, and the Rocca was a fair bit smoother for me.
The Outlaw Evolution has a larger clamping area and clamps the blade closer to the cutting edge, so I expect things to go in its favour against the Rocca, but I'll see.

Now if someone in the UK would lend me their Apex...

 

[Iridian]

Just thoughts about the Outlaw Evo would be already much appreciated!

 

[Slapo]

Just thoughts about the Outlaw Evo would be already much appreciated!

I've had a bunch more shaves with the Outlaw Evo recently, so I'll leave a few notes there.
Before that, I should note that I am not much of a fan of Merkur/Edwin Jagger/Muhle style design where the blade is clamped fairly far from the cutting edge. If the razor forces a bend upon the blade past clamping point, that tends to improve things somewhat, but it depends on the specifics.
For me, they generally have enough blade chatter, particularly when going against the grain, that it ends up feeling worse for me than most carts. Even with a fresh blade they feel like I'm using an old blade, or like I need to somehow hydrate my hair for another 10 minutes before using them to less the discomfort, which never really goes away.

Because the Outlaw Evo has a rather wide clamping area, and seems to clamp the blade closer to the cutting edge than the original or the above mentioned ones, I had high hopes for it.

Unfortunately for me, it seems that there are two things that work against me with it.
The first one is that there's still a surprising amount of blade flex. Perhaps it's so because the top cap doesn't really force a curve upon the blade past clamping point.
The second one is that the top cap is so blunted that its edges along the blade's cutting edge seem to curve up a bit. This seems to allow for more blade flex toward the cap.

The result is that the razor just isn't smooth or comfortable for me, regardless of the angle I use.
I can manage to shave with it, it just isn't a nice experience for me.
The Rocca v4, RazoRock MJ-90A, Pearl Blaze and Reggie's Razors' Jupiter were more comfortable for me while offering a similar level of efficiency. I'm planning on selling the Roccas and Pearl Blaze on as well.

For what's it worth, the top caps for the old version and Evo seem to be identical and interchangeable.

There seem to be many people for whom the above aren't an issue, but I'll be selling mine.

 

[Iridian]

@Slapo thank you, but I must agree and wonder that the new Outlaw is promoted as 300% more clamping etc. then. I quite like the Outlaw despite this clamping style, but what point is in clamping if it doesn't stiffen the blade and allows chatter nevertheless.

Doesn't seem all that different to the old Outlaw, for better and worse.

 

[Slapo]

@Slapo thank you, but I must agree and wonder that the new Outlaw is promoted as 300% more clamping etc. then. I quite like the Outlaw despite this clamping style, but what point is in clamping if it doesn't stiffen the blade and allows chatter nevertheless.

Doesn't seem all that different to the old Outlaw, for better and worse.

Happy to help.
For what's it worth, I might try the base plate with e.g. a RazoRock Mamba, Game Changer or Winning razor top cap, and if they'll work, I'll just try buying the base plates separately... or not, as it isn't like I'm lacking for razors.

 

[Slapo]

@Slapo thank you, but I must agree and wonder that the new Outlaw is promoted as 300% more clamping etc. then. I quite like the Outlaw despite this clamping style, but what point is in clamping if it doesn't stiffen the blade and allows chatter nevertheless.

Doesn't seem all that different to the old Outlaw, for better and worse.

I just remembered - the Winning Razor v1 is kind of like that as well, except it has barely any blade reveal and exposure, and it well supported by the top cap.

I suspect what some people reported as a drag might've actually been just a bit of blade flex (possibly in combination with lather that might not have been slick enough).

 

[wetshaver233]

I've talked to a couple of owners of both razors and some of them describe them as efficient and nearly as smooth as a Razorock Game Changer .84p. The GC .84p is nice, but I want something more efficient. The so called ''everyday razors'' feel too mild for me. YMMV.

 

[zifnab]

Hello my fellow RAD patients ! How are you doing today? Are you thinking about getting a new razor, two or more just like I'm currently thinking?

Jokes aide, these two razors caught my attention and I would like to know more about them and then make up my mind. Both of them have become quite popular and hyped recently and I've read some bold reviews claiming that the Apex is on pair with the best of the best DE razors on the market and even supposed some of them! I've heard that story before, but I always wonder if maybe, just maybe that's true and here am I - asking those who own one of them or perhaps someone owns both to share any information about the usual stuff like the blade feel, blade exposure, efficiency, which angle works better, how they perform ATG, are they really that good as the reviews claim etc.

They are very different. While both are medium aggressive feeling on my face, Outlaw has more traditional round cap but it does follow the Henson trend of very good blade clamping to reduce chatter etc. Apex is more in line with the Overlander, easy to find the angle. Apex is more efficient aggressive razor for sure, but it's easier to find the angle.

Weight is 2nd biggest difference, the Overlander Evo with Viper 95 is extremely hefty.

I know some here ragged on Alpha about blade alignment issue, doesn't exist on Outlaw Evolution. Blade alignment on this is at same level as Overlander, exceeds anything from Yates. It's not quite Apex level, but it's close. Apex is perfection for someone who wants high efficiency IMO.

But personally, I end up using the Overlander and WSC Hyperion more, I like the milder razors. And currently been enamoured by the AC single edge razors. So got the Claymore on the way while I experiment with the Shield AC.