What hones? I don't have any yet. What I have is a small whetstone that's for knives, not razors. Here's a picture of it, with a dime next to it so that you can see how small it is.
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What Honing Stone to get?
- Thread starter The Shave Doctor
- Start date
I also agree Griffith does excellent work on what he offers and will give a shave ready edge on a razor to a new user. If his price points work for the buyer (not a judgement on my part)
Read my post above your reply here. We really are trying to help you out here. Most of what we’re talking about is subjectively preferential developed through our experience. Yours will be yours.
What would? The little pocket one?
The problem here, again, is that you're assuming that I both know what the brands you're talking about are and where to get them. How about a few pointers to websites?
How about searching this forum with explicit terms? I’m not trying to be standoffish or mean spirited here. These topics have been covered over and over since… ‘08 if not earlier. All across the straight razor subsections here. Go look up Slash’s threads he’s started. More about lapping than you’ll ever want to read. Search “The method”. At the bottom of any thread, it’ll give you “similar threads/topics/whatever”
Where in the world are you, what’s your budget, etc, etc… it shouldn’t be a dogmatic, one and done solution set. There are more options that people chose differently. Your preferred set up will be yours.
I get that this can be an overwhelmingly broad topic and choices. you appear to be getting frustrated with it. I get that too. slow down, look at what's been offered throughout the thread, look at and research what may or may not appeal to you and proceed from there. or if you can/want to afford to, in the B&B way, buy one of everything listed and try them out (this is said in the spirit of levity)
I used to buy sets of film from Best Sharpening Stones.
I live in Trinidad, CO, just north of the New Mexico state line. Checking last night, I found that there's a good looking cutlery store and a blacksmith that seems to specialize in knives in Santa Fe, NM, 130 miles from here and nothing closer. I'm 74, retired, living on SS and VA disability (30%) so spending hundreds of dollars on one stone is Right Out. I'm not trying to prove you folks wrong, I'm trying to turn this lemon into lemonade by using it to learn how to use a SR and how to care for it, at least enough to maintain a better blade. And, if I sound frustrated it's because you keep talking about things I don't know about without either defining your terms or pointing me to where I can learn. Searching for exact terms is good, of course, provided that I know what terms to look for. Just looking for hone, or Ark or whatever isn't going to help and it's just going to waste my time. I know that I can get a 4k/8k stone through Walmart, but I've no idea if that's a good idea or not.
"The problem here, again, is that you're assuming that I both know what the brands you're talking about are and where to get them. How about a few pointers to websites?"
Ok...Intro to the Wide World of Shaving 101
Knowing what I do after more than a decade of experience...
1. Patronize a well regarded online vendor. The Superior Shave and Griffith Shaving are two with which I have had great experience. There are more, but I like and trust these guys and have LOTS of first hand experience dealing with them.
2. Buy a set of Naniwa SS or Shapton Stones. 1k-sets your bevel. Gotta have a proper bevel. Without it all else is in vain. You get oo gahts. The 5k and 8k develop and refine your edge. 12k is your finisher. It's the final step in the process of creating a truly "shave ready" razor.
So, I'm going to think the aforementioned information should prove helpful in solving your quandary.
Oh...you will need a proper razor. Talk to the guys mentioned above. Matt (Griffith Shaving) and Jarrod (The Superior Shave) are both experts and can help a great deal with the selection and purchase of a new straight razor.
....Mic Drop.
Ok...Intro to the Wide World of Shaving 101
Knowing what I do after more than a decade of experience...
1. Patronize a well regarded online vendor. The Superior Shave and Griffith Shaving are two with which I have had great experience. There are more, but I like and trust these guys and have LOTS of first hand experience dealing with them.
2. Buy a set of Naniwa SS or Shapton Stones. 1k-sets your bevel. Gotta have a proper bevel. Without it all else is in vain. You get oo gahts. The 5k and 8k develop and refine your edge. 12k is your finisher. It's the final step in the process of creating a truly "shave ready" razor.
So, I'm going to think the aforementioned information should prove helpful in solving your quandary.
Oh...you will need a proper razor. Talk to the guys mentioned above. Matt (Griffith Shaving) and Jarrod (The Superior Shave) are both experts and can help a great deal with the selection and purchase of a new straight razor.
....Mic Drop.
Thank you for your service. sincerely. Welcome home, as that applies.
lapping film will give you the best bang for your buck, lowest entry cost system that will give you a shaving edge. plenty of guys shave off film and have never touched a stone. go read Slash's posts. everything you need to know about lapping film is there.
you can also look at the buy sell trade area here. good quality vintage razors show up there for $20-50 routinely. that would be my recommendation for a viable, low cost solution.
knife makers/users may be be great at what they do, but have no viable expertise with and about razors unless they use razors most often. get honing work and razor specific knowledge from those who use straights. plenty of knife people have ruined razors by using knife techniques on them and there are plenty of examples here in the back catalog.
if you can afford the investment in stones, synthetics will get you were you want to be once your research in the brand and type meets your choice to start with. natural stones can run into the hundreds or thousands per stone.
I recommend lapping film, synthetic stones, natural stones in that order of expense and ease of use and learning, based on my experience. there are plenty of names and styles to review and chose from in this thread alone.
edit to add: and plenty of guys send out their razors to be honed, and never learn to do it themselves. it's always a cost/benefit analysis. all of this.
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First, understand and accept that sharpening knives and honing razors are two very different things, processes and goals.
Many of us came to razors from sharpening knives, me included, 50 years ago.
We often get Knife guys that think they can hone a razor like sharpening a knife and go away frustrated and mad. Some make the transition. If your glass is full, it is pretty hard to add any more knowledge… there will be spillage.
Google (My Second Try at Honing), for a step-by-step post of a new honer taking an eBay beater to super shaver, all the stones needed and excellent micrographs of his edges. It was literally the second razor he had tried to hone.
There are hundreds of synthetic stones that can hone a razor and tons of naturals. You need a progression of stones that will get you to 8 or 12k edge. A coarse stone, 1k a mid-grit 4-6k and fine stone 8-12k. Everybody has a preference and an opinion; you will hear them soon.
A 1/6k King combo hone is $30 new and will get you started, a Naniwia 8k or Suehiro 10k finisher are about $100. Those 3 stones will get you shaving. 1um film is also an option to replace an 8 or 10k, but can get pricy in a hurry.
But be warned, your razor will not hold a shaving edge. Yes, I have honed them, they may shave… once but not well.
Buy a $20 vintage razor from an Antique store or on-line, eBay. Post a photo and ask for advice we will tell you if it is worth it. Sometimes you find a gold nugget for $20 or less.
Take a look at this thread (Learning to hone, Welsome) and contact the OP via PM. He is making great progress with a minimal kit, he is a new honer who can give you firsthand advise of what worked for him.
Many of us came to razors from sharpening knives, me included, 50 years ago.
We often get Knife guys that think they can hone a razor like sharpening a knife and go away frustrated and mad. Some make the transition. If your glass is full, it is pretty hard to add any more knowledge… there will be spillage.
Google (My Second Try at Honing), for a step-by-step post of a new honer taking an eBay beater to super shaver, all the stones needed and excellent micrographs of his edges. It was literally the second razor he had tried to hone.
There are hundreds of synthetic stones that can hone a razor and tons of naturals. You need a progression of stones that will get you to 8 or 12k edge. A coarse stone, 1k a mid-grit 4-6k and fine stone 8-12k. Everybody has a preference and an opinion; you will hear them soon.
A 1/6k King combo hone is $30 new and will get you started, a Naniwia 8k or Suehiro 10k finisher are about $100. Those 3 stones will get you shaving. 1um film is also an option to replace an 8 or 10k, but can get pricy in a hurry.
But be warned, your razor will not hold a shaving edge. Yes, I have honed them, they may shave… once but not well.
Buy a $20 vintage razor from an Antique store or on-line, eBay. Post a photo and ask for advice we will tell you if it is worth it. Sometimes you find a gold nugget for $20 or less.
Take a look at this thread (Learning to hone, Welsome) and contact the OP via PM. He is making great progress with a minimal kit, he is a new honer who can give you firsthand advise of what worked for him.
@Sideburns
Search the BST thread, there were some inexpensive razors there being sold by members that hone their own and use them. They will come to you shave ready.
Instead of hones get a strop and use Dovo black paste on it. You can use an old pair of denim jeans to make your own. Denim works very well, with paste, to keep a shaving edge.
That approach will keep cost at a minimum
Search the BST thread, there were some inexpensive razors there being sold by members that hone their own and use them. They will come to you shave ready.
Instead of hones get a strop and use Dovo black paste on it. You can use an old pair of denim jeans to make your own. Denim works very well, with paste, to keep a shaving edge.
That approach will keep cost at a minimum
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@Sideburns and if you choose stones, there's a pretty good, no nonsense honing channel on youtube that could help you with it.
Dr Matt (something like that) also does a lot of honing vids. I'd have to run through his vids to see how much is useful for a beginner. or you can as you see fit.
I'm sure there are plenty of others, but I can't/won't vouch for any of them
edit: well that didn't format as I expected them to. open those videos in youtube and you can subscribe to his channel if you want.
Dr Matt (something like that) also does a lot of honing vids. I'd have to run through his vids to see how much is useful for a beginner. or you can as you see fit.
I'm sure there are plenty of others, but I can't/won't vouch for any of them
edit: well that didn't format as I expected them to. open those videos in youtube and you can subscribe to his channel if you want.
Thank you for that information; it's what I've been asking for all along. You do understand, I hope, that my financial resources are limited, so I doubt that I could get all of that at once. If, as I expect, I can only afford one, and have to make do with what I've got for the time being, which one would you recommend?
I expect honing a razor to be different than sharpening a knife; I mention it to show that I'm not a complete beginner and I understand how gentle your touch has to be. There's got to be a learning curve, and I might as well get through at least part of it before I move to a razor that's too easy to mess up.
Those are intended to be used either with small pocket knives by moving the blade in circles, or moving the hone down the length of a larger knife. Neither of those techniques are appropriate for a razor.
As a beginner the smallest hone I suggest you buy is 2x6”. With practice you can use smaller, but they are tricky when you are learning.
I have a couple of Dans translucents about the same size. Fiddley for full size razors, but I keep one in a travel kit with a shorty and it works really well.
Well, I wasn't expecting anybody would think it appropriate for my razor; if nothing else, I don't know what size the grit (or whatever's getting measured) is. Somebody wanted to see it, so I obliged.
Trinidad... I know the area. Try and find Jerry Stark. His shop is somewhere in NE Arizona. If you need someone to talk stones with...he quite possibly is your guy. Makes a nice razor too.
@Sideburns thank you for your service!
There is a lot of information to digest when jumping into SR shaving and honing gets overwhelming very quickly. I say that because of all the choices involved. Everyone has a preferred progression, or stone, and you will only find that through trial and error. That can get expensive quickly.
I am following @KW Driver lead and would suggest lapping film. There is a lot of reading, but start at Newbie Honing Compendium - https://www.badgerandblade.com/forum/threads/newbie-honing-compendium.545370/
As @Slash McCoy mentions, read it twice. You will find a system for honing and stropping there. Gather your kit and start your journey. Once comfortable with this honing and stropping process, then you can experiment further.
Send me a DM and I will mail you a razor to play with. Don’t get frustrated and keep asking questions. You got this!
There is a lot of information to digest when jumping into SR shaving and honing gets overwhelming very quickly. I say that because of all the choices involved. Everyone has a preferred progression, or stone, and you will only find that through trial and error. That can get expensive quickly.
I am following @KW Driver lead and would suggest lapping film. There is a lot of reading, but start at Newbie Honing Compendium - https://www.badgerandblade.com/forum/threads/newbie-honing-compendium.545370/
As @Slash McCoy mentions, read it twice. You will find a system for honing and stropping there. Gather your kit and start your journey. Once comfortable with this honing and stropping process, then you can experiment further.
Send me a DM and I will mail you a razor to play with. Don’t get frustrated and keep asking questions. You got this!
It's important to remember that people have been using natural whetstones to hone razors at least since Roman times and a lot of that information has been passed down in generational manner for a very long time. You can see it in Italian barber culture... Syrian and Japanese too. Italy and Syria were both part of the Roman empire have similar barber culture, Japan is different but also very old. Razors, knives and stones were passed from father to son, grandfather to grandson for a very long . Technique and tips went along with them and everyone's technique is slightly different and old methods evolve and change over time. In my opinion good natural stones like vintage coticules are preferable because they can very often cover the range or 3,4, or even 5 synthetic waterstones and you only got one rock to keep up with. Coticules are my favorite, I have a couple grand worth of them(plus the same with many other types of natural whetstones) and with a soft/fine slurry stone+ hard fine base stone you can do everything you need to do with just about any blade with the right technique and touch. But you can do the same with a pike no.1 washita+dans hard ark. The best thing to do, with whatever stones you end up with is to dedicate time to rubbing steel on it and learn how they interact with each other. Absolutly learn how to get a bevel set correctly and then the rest comes fairly easy.
